I'm not sure why it's still going. The meetings Trump is taking is borderline conspiring. Attempting to delegitimize the US government by any means has been Trump's card since questioning Obama's place of birth. If he continues this talk after all states have certified the results and his legal means are up (or completely unrealistic), such talk and conspiring essentially becomes sedition against the elected administration.
yep
the problem is for some strange reason a ton of people still believe his lies. Supposedly, 70% of all who voted for him think that the election was rigged. This is totally ruining our democracy and isn't going to get better just by having Biden in the WH - the right wingnuts will still be spouting lies and people will believe them
The most recent number I heard is that 50% of Republicans think the election was stolen...So that’s what, 30% of the population? So in essence, the die hard Trump cult...Certainly NOT even close to the majority of Americans...
I was aghast to hear my father in law earlier today, who voted for Trump, say it’s time he shut up, quite whining, and concede the fact that he lost the election...Something I thought he’d never say...To me that means Trump is now losing even some of his die hard supporters.
The more this drags on, the more I'm enjoying watching Trump lose over and over. I'm even starting to feel sorry for the brainwashed masses that keep grasping at straws. It's long over. It wasn't even close. If there was real evidence of widespread voter fraud, not speculation and conspiracy theories, the Trump lawyers would have presented it in court.
Why feel sorry for those brainwashed? They are complicit as much as the GOP House and Senate members. They voted for continuation of what we saw the last 4 years. Doesn't that make you wonder what their constitution is, and I don't mean The Constitution.
Every day that drags on and more Covid deaths rise, hospitals fill up, more & more cases, and Trump makes a mockery of democracy, the brainwashed root him on. Are these the people you want to associate with, break bread with, and have "intellectual" discussions on democracy with?
The more this drags on, the more I'm enjoying watching Trump lose over and over. I'm even starting to feel sorry for the brainwashed masses that keep grasping at straws. It's long over. It wasn't even close. If there was real evidence of widespread voter fraud, not speculation and conspiracy theories, the Trump lawyers would have presented it in court.
Why feel sorry for those brainwashed? They are complicit as much as the GOP House and Senate members. They voted for continuation of what we saw the last 4 years. Doesn't that make you wonder what their constitution is, and I don't mean The Constitution.
Every day that drags on and more Covid deaths rise, hospitals fill up, more & more cases, and Trump makes a mockery of democracy, the brainwashed root him on. Are these the people you want to associate with, break bread with, and have "intellectual" discussions on democracy with?
I feels sorry that they lack the intellectual capacity to grasp the obvious. Our democracy is at stake here, and for them to not understand that makes me sad. As for Trump, I have no sorrow for him. His legacy will continue to be tarnished, and it couldn't happen to a bigger lowlife and failure.
From Rudy Giuliani's press conference yesterday, it is not over. They expect to file challenges/and or lawsuits in more states such as New Mexico, Arizona, Virginia.
Rudy's son was just diagnosed with Covid, as was Don Jr., who is quarantining.
While most are looking forward to the holiday next week, Dec. 11th could be another government shutdown. Nancy, Chuck Schumer, Mitch, and Mnuchin are back in negotiations to try to avoid that.
At what point is an election fully finally legally & unconditionally decided - what ‘august body’ or legal/political entity decides that
Does the president have the legal legs to at least postpone Inauguration Day pending the outcome of his appeal
Why do I think the Nat’l Guard will be on high alert on that day
At what point is an election fully finally legally & unconditionally decided - what ‘august body’ or legal/political entity decides that
Does the president have the legal legs to at least postpone Inauguration Day pending the outcome of his appeal
Why do I think the Nat’l Guard will be on high alert on that day
The Electoral College meets on December 14 to vote. Congress counts the votes on January 6. The Constitution specifies that the president's and vice president's terms end on noon of January 20. There is no provision to delay the Inauguration Day. On that day, the president's term is over. If somehow the winner is still disputed, then based on the line of succession outlined in the Constitution, The Speaker of the House will become president (Nancy Pelosi unless the House elects a new one).
From Rudy Giuliani's press conference yesterday, it is not over. They expect to file challenges/and or lawsuits in more states such as New Mexico, Arizona, Virginia.
Rudy's son was just diagnosed with Covid, as was Don Jr., who is quarantining.
While most are looking forward to the holiday next week, Dec. 11th could be another government shutdown. Nancy, Chuck Schumer, Mitch, and Mnuchin are back in negotiations to try to avoid that.
It is over. Trump can continue to fool himself and his brainwashed masses, but he is 1 for 29 in court cases, and the judges and becoming more and more angry that Trump's lawyers have offered zero evidence of widespread voter fraud. Speculation and conspiracy theories are not evidence, and even if most of them were true, they aren't even close to being enough votes to overturn the election. Plus he would need major victories in at least 4 states. Zero chance of that happening. The one court case he did win was only a delay, and even if we throw out all the votes in question it would make zero difference in the outcome.
At this point, Trump is making of mockery of our democracy. Unless he can provide undeniable PROOF of enough voter fraud in at least 4 states by next week, he should resign and not even wait until January 20.
At what point is an election fully finally legally & unconditionally decided - what ‘august body’ or legal/political entity decides that
Does the president have the legal legs to at least postpone Inauguration Day pending the outcome of his appeal
Why do I think the Nat’l Guard will be on high alert on that day
The Electoral College meets on December 14 to vote. Congress counts the votes on January 6. The Constitution specifies that the president's and vice president's terms end on noon of January 20. There is no provision to delay the Inauguration Day. On that day, the president's term is over. If somehow the winner is still disputed, then based on the line of succession outlined in the Constitution, The Speaker of the House will become president (Nancy Pelosi unless the House elects a new one).
Thanks for that info 2112, glad to know it👍
Another loss for Trumpty Dumpty...Federal judge tosses out latest Trump suit in PA...Time to pack your bags Little Donnie.
Many leaders of the GOP are either actively supporting Trump's allegations or are silently complicit with them, whether they believe it or not. They are putting one person's demands over the votes. This is not democracy.
He went to court. His cases have been thrown out. Under oath, all of the witnesses said they had no evidence of fraud. His attorneys, in court, said there was no evidence of fraud. On TV and the internet, his attorneys tell a different story. Even Tucker Carlson said there is no evidence of fraud. He invited Trump's attorney to come on his show and display the evidence and she denied. Of course, when Carslon called her out the "right wing media' was all over him.
The GOP establishment ought to be ashamed.
Trump has a new PAC Save America. He's not done yet.
Trump has a new PAC Save America. He's not done yet.
Nothing but another way to rob the wallets of his followers one last time on the way out the door.
The 49ers have a better chance of overturning the Superbowl results in court than Trump has for overturning the will of the voters in 4 different states.
Another smack down for Trump...PA Supreme Court tosses out latest appeal from the Trump train....
I find it funny that some Trump supporters still think he has a chance. Even if he was able to overturn the results in Pennsylvania and Michigan, he still wouldn't have enough electoral votes to win. He would still be 2 or 3 states short. You would think at least a few Trump supporters would understand math, but that doesn't seem to be their strong suit.
I think their grasp of math is no doubt a problem......However, succumbing to the charms of a con man is slightly more of a problem it would seem to me. Losing one's common sense or never possessing such a trait in the first place explains how we elect such obvious incompetents.
After all if it looks, smells, and tastes like dog sh*t, it's probably dog shit...
The most recent number I heard is that 50% of Republicans think the election was stolen...So that’s what, 30% of the population? So in essence, the die hard Trump cult...Certainly NOT even close to the majority of Americans...
Change Republicans to Democrats, and Trump to Gore, and you have the debacle of the 2000 election.
@jerry Not exactly the same situations.
In 2000 there was legitimate question regarding FL votes, which would have swung a close election (271-266). After the US Supreme Court essentially halted the recount, Gore conceded.
In 2020, Trump has questioned the results in several states that he lost without any evidence, even after recounts. Even after GOP state officials contradict Trump's baseless claim, he refuses to concede thus encouraging his supporters to believe the election was somehow "stolen".
right
in 2000 there was about 500 votes separating Bush and Gore in Florida. And Gore won the popular vote. Entirely different.
I mean, seriously, this is what we are patiently entertaining. It's ridiculous.
https://twitter.com/MollyJongFast/status/1334318185772961796?s=20
I mean, seriously, this is what we are patiently entertaining. It's ridiculous.
https://twitter.com/MollyJongFast/status/1334318185772961796?s=20
I saw that yesterday I believe. She's a whack job, but look who she's sitting next to. It's "Pardon Me" Rudy who has also become a whack job. They along with Nero Trump have represented the GOP in a very ethical and professional manner. This is what the GOP has come to. in Congress - mostly crickets where words are spoken very carefully. Long live King Trump.
Not really. Every recount had Bush winning, even though they did find more votes not counted each time they had a recount.
Gore kept filing lawsuits to change the way votes were counted, after the election.
It took SCOTUS to end the debacle so bush could start the transition.
There are STILL some democrats that insist that Bush "stole" the election when Bush continually had more votes than Gore in Florida.
I guess I shouldn't speak for any Democrats (I'm registered as independent). Personally, I think that ship has sailed long ago and Bush won. That said, there were many differences in the way the ballots were marked - remember the hanging chad? The secretary of state in FL was a republican and the governor was George's brother (no - I don't think they cheated) 537 votes in 1 state is way different than the tens of thousands of votes in each state now. The electoral officials in most of the states in question are GOP and they said the election was fair. Even Barr said there was no fraud. Trump is falsely claiming there was. His lawyers are too - until they get in front of a judge. There were legitimate issues in 2000. Gore did concede the election, which Trump will never do. There are no legitimate issues now except that Trump doesn't like the results.
@jerry There were indeed Democrats who claimed the 2000 election was stolen because the recount was never completed and there actually were questions regarding what votes they were counting or discounting. I agree, I don't think it would have changed the 2000 election, but the point was the recount was never completed so there was always a lingering question.
That's a lot different than this year where several states have completed recounts where there was a significant margin of victory just to satisfy baseless claims. And it hasn't put an end to those baseless claims. So, similar, but also very different.
right
in 2000 there was about 500 votes separating Bush and Gore in Florida. And Gore won the popular vote. Entirely different.
Not in Florida.
@jerry There were indeed Democrats who claimed the 2000 election was stolen because the recount was never completed and there actually were questions regarding what votes they were counting or discounting. I agree, I don't think it would have changed the 2000 election, but the point was the recount was never completed so there was always a lingering question.
That's a lot different than this year where several states have completed recounts where there was a significant margin of victory just to satisfy baseless claims. And it hasn't put an end to those baseless claims. So, similar, but also very different.
The first sentence is why I support doing recounts if there is ANY question of legitimacy in the count. Dead people voting, yep, and reported by some tv stations.
Votes not sent in, yep, boxes of ballots found here in GA (five counties) and other places. Some places have still not completed counting the votes. mail in ballots missing, Absentee ballots missing. Votes not counted due to errors, wrong information on registration, ballot not filled out properly, did not come back to correct voter registration in designated time so provisional ballot not accepted.
This is why a national voter registration card is needed. Scan the registration card, vote, print ballot with same bar-code as on registration card, scan ballot in.
You then have a record of who voted, where they voted, and a method of knowing exactly how many votes were given at each location. The vote audit conducted after the election would show where votes cast at the polls were not accounted for and the correct questions would need to be asked to the correct persons.
If for some reasons the ballots cast by those voters are not accounted for, they could be called back and asked to re-cast their ballots to insure that their vote is counted.
Why anyone would not want that system in place I cannot figure out.
You are correct. We need that
there was a bill in congress for national voting standards
it was blocked
by McConnell
His rationale- the States are in charge of running elections
which I suppose is true, but it is no longer practical
re- dead people voting- just cause a tv station report something doesn’t mean it was true. All of the accounts I have read about which were checked (which may not be all of them) were clerical errors and not dead people voting.
ex- John Smith He’s ballot was mistakenly attributed to his late father. Or people who didn’t supply a DOB have 01/01/1900 used as a placeholder until it gets corrected. The vote doesn’t count until it’s corrected.
sources that are known to not be left, ie WSJ and Attorney Gen Barr said there was no systemic fraud.
no lawyer presented ANY evidence of fraud in front of a judge, no matter what they said on TV or at a rally
