And btw, Scotland is a very conservative place . . .

You sure about that? They were the one part of the UK who definitely wanted to stay in the EU.

I get it's a joke, but I don't think any American got duped. Trump wasn't elected by any policy that he discussed. He was elected because of his desire to fight and be hostile. That's what the majority of this country unfortunately admires. Only a complete fool would have believed that Trump was going to build a wall and ban Muslims. I don't think Americans are that foolish, so his voters were attracted to his willingness to be hostile and fight. It didn't matter what he said. He could have been spouting liberal socialist ideas, but if he delivered it in an angry hostile tone, he would've gotten the same votes. There's nothing Republican about his campaign, but yet he won the Republican nomination. If he didn't run on Republican values, then why would he get the nomination? Because his policies were never relevant. The right was so infuriated with Obama, that they would nominate any person who mirrored their own rage and fury, and that person is Trump. I know it felt good to "get payback on liberals", but at the end of the day, conservative values have been thrown out the door.

Only a complete fool would have believed that Trump was going to build a wall and ban Muslims

Only a complete fool would have believed Trump could get elected.

Only a complete fool would have believed in the Nazi Holocaust as it was happening.

Only a complete fool would believe that a country that elects a complete fool is not a nation of complete fools.

It can happen here. It is happening here.

Description of the Ship of Fools, from Plato's Republic. Seem familiar?

"Imagine then a fleet or a ship in which there is a captain who is taller and stronger than any of the crew, but he is a little deaf and has a similar infirmity in sight, and his knowledge of navigation is not much better. The sailors are quarreling with one another about the steering––every one is of opinion that he has a right to steer, though he has never learned the art of navigation and cannot tell who taught him or when he learned, and will further assert that it cannot be taught, and they are ready to cut in pieces any one who says the contrary. They throng about the captain, begging and praying him to commit the helm to them; and if at any time they do not prevail, but others are preferred to them, they kill the others or throw them overboard, and having first chained up the noble captain's senses with drink or some narcotic drug, they mutiny and take possession of the ship and make free with the stores; thus, eating and drinking, they proceed on their voyage in such a manner as might be expected of them. Him who is their partisan and cleverly aids them in their plot for getting the ship out of the captain's hands into their own whether by force or persuasion, they compliment with the name of sailor, pilot, able seaman, and abuse the other sort of man, whom they call a good-for-nothing; but that the true pilot must pay attention to the year and seasons and sky and stars and winds, and whatever else belongs to his art, if he intends to be really qualified for the command of a ship, and that he must and will be the steerer, whether other people like or not––the possibility of this union of authority with the steerer's art has never seriously entered into their thoughts or been made part of their calling. Now in vessels which are in a state of mutiny and by sailors who are mutineers, how will the true pilot be regarded? Will he not be called by them a prater, a star-gazer, a good-for-nothing?"

I think the ones who really look like fools are those who speak of Trump as if he is the second coming of Hitler, or something even worse...like the Donald is some big, scary fascist dictator...LOL.

And of course the obvious fools are the ones who believed the MSM and the lies from the pollsters prior to the election, the over-confident liberal elites, and the Hollywood celebrities who threatened to leave the country.

We may in fact be a nation of complete fools...but that didn't just start with this election. Remember, this same nation also elected Barry to two terms. Fools indeed!

And if Trump didn't run on Republican values, and if he is not even a true conservative...then what are all the liberals so worried about??

[Edited on 1/16/2017 by Redfish7]

[Edited on 1/16/2017 by Redfish7]

the ones who really look like fools are those who speak of Trump as if he is the second coming of Hitler, or something even worse...like the Donald is some big, scary fascist dictator...LOL.

Fascist dictators don't appear that way to the ones who create and worship them. We have people right here in the WP saying things like "face down on the ground with boots on their necks before being dragged off to RFK."

That doesn't sound like a Nazi groundswell to you? You get enough people thinking like this and it happens. Anywhere, anytime, all throughout history - the goosesteppers are right there waiting to move in.

We have people right here in the WP saying things like "face down on the ground with boots on their necks before being dragged off to RFK."

Who said this? What is the source, and the context?

What exactly is it that you think is going to happen over the next 4 years...what is it about Trump that scares you so much?

[Edited on 1/16/2017 by Redfish7]

That was in one of the current threads, re people who protest. It was just one example of the type of rhetoric that has become the new normal. Trump doen't scare me at all, in fact there are some things I really like about him. He is a heck of a lot smarter than his fan base. What disturbs me is the chilling effect of bigotry and ignorance becoming fashionable.

Time will tell. Nothing wrong with a bit of caution in defense of liberty.

And if Trump didn't run on Republican values, and if he is not even a true conservative...then what are all the liberals so worried about??

I think that is what gets ignored in the "conservatives didn't do this in 2008" talk because there wouldn't be so the kind of concern if Romney or McCain been elected, it misses the point. The majority of people who are worried about Trump as President aren't concerned because he is a "conservative", they are concerned because of the way he conducts himself, attacks people with the slightest provocation, and a general lack of knowledge of the Constitution and due process. Just this past week: directly attacking the press; attacking Rep John Lewis' entire district; publicly shaming companies on twitter. And this isn't being overly sensitive, I simply find him dangerously reactionary at worst, vainly ignorant at best.

Ah, OK...I wasn't sure what you meant by "WP"...I thought you were referring to an article that you had read, and all I could come up with was Washington Post? Now I get that you were referring to the Whipping Post...should have been obvious...my fault on the confusion.

We are on the internet forum of a defunct band...so I wouldn't get too worked up by what was said by some ignorant bigot on this forum, and then jump to the conclusion that he/she is representative of the "new normal".

I don't think the average Joe - the "forgotten man" - who voted for Trump is some kind of neo-Nazi bigot who is ready to fire up the furnaces (although that's what Rosie O' and the media would like for you to think) ...they're just folks who were sick and tired of Barry and they knew that Hillary would just be 4-8 more years of Barry...a Barry 2.0 if you will. It was a wholesale rejection of Barry's policies and the liberal agenda, not a neo-Nazi uprising. And if anything is "scary"...it is the extremists on the left who want riots/martial law and are opposed to the peaceful transfer of power.

As to your last statement..."Nothing wrong with a bit of caution in defense of liberty." Amen to that, brother.

And if Trump didn't run on Republican values, and if he is not even a true conservative...then what are all the liberals so worried about??

I think that is what gets ignored in the "conservatives didn't do this in 2008" talk because there wouldn't be so the kind of concern if Romney or McCain been elected, it misses the point. The majority of people who are worried about Trump as President aren't concerned because he is a "conservative", they are concerned because of the way he conducts himself, attacks people with the slightest provocation, and a general lack of knowledge of the Constitution and due process. Just this past week: directly attacking the press; attacking Rep John Lewis' entire district; publicly shaming companies on twitter. And this isn't being overly sensitive, I simply find him dangerously reactionary at worst, vainly ignorant at best.

Your closing line is spot on.

Add to this the following:

Trump's comments / criticisms / lack of understanding of NATO.

Trump's criticism and trust ideas of Angela Merkel

His cozy words & attitude towards Putin & Russia

His lack of insight into ramifications of his idea of moving the US Embassy to Jerusalem

His view on One China

Attacking his twin (Alec Baldwin)

Twitter, twitter, and more twitter

His major conflicts of interest / ethics issues

That's a start. We could fill up a disk drive.

And if Trump didn't run on Republican values, and if he is not even a true conservative...then what are all the liberals so worried about??

I think that is what gets ignored in the "conservatives didn't do this in 2008" talk because there wouldn't be so the kind of concern if Romney or McCain been elected, it misses the point. The majority of people who are worried about Trump as President aren't concerned because he is a "conservative", they are concerned because of the way he conducts himself, attacks people with the slightest provocation, and a general lack of knowledge of the Constitution and due process. Just this past week: directly attacking the press; attacking Rep John Lewis' entire district; publicly shaming companies on twitter. And this isn't being overly sensitive, I simply find him dangerously reactionary at worst, vainly ignorant at best.

Well said, and all good points. Is there reason for some concern? Yes. I despise Trump. I just think the comparisons to Hitler are a bit too much. And this idea that everyone who voted for Trump is some kind of ignorant redneck bigot is just nonsense. Let's just say...I think the reaction to Trump getting elected has been an extreme OVER-reaction.

And I have no sympathy for the press. They deserve whatever they get... 😉

Yeah man I agree there was some bad stuff coming down with the Corporate Left that is good didn't solidify. I hope Trump can outsmart the ultra-right wolves he will be surrounded by and just go ahead and piss everyone off, like by making good on his vow to reopen the 9-11 inquiry, and keeping Big Pharma's medical control-state agenda off our backs for a while longer. There are plenty of Republicans who are just as evil as Democrats when it comes down to these types of issues.

Maybe our biggest strength is that somehow no one thing can ever take over completely.

Trump wasn't elected by any policy that he discussed...It didn't matter what he said. He could have been spouting liberal socialist ideas, but if he delivered it in an angry hostile tone, he would've gotten the same votes.

There's nothing Republican about his campaign, but yet he won the Republican nomination. If he didn't run on Republican values, then why would he get the nomination?

The right was so infuriated with Obama, that they would nominate any person who mirrored their own rage and fury, and that person is Trump.

1. I don't know if I'd go that far. Let's not get carried away.

2. Strong military? School choice? Tax cuts for individuals? Corporate tax rate cuts? Tighter immigration policies? I could go on....

3. Yet you also claimed that Trump could have proposed "liberal, socialist" ideas and been elected just as easily. If this was the case, why were voters so infuriated with Obama? Doesn't add up.

For some reason you keep forgetting my position. When you say "voters", you are referring to conservatives. Conservatives were always opposed to Obama. Nobody switched or bailed on Obama. The only difference is that Trumps rhetoric brought out a new segment of conservative voters. They weren't inspired by Romney or McCain because they were too weak. Once Trump came out swinging, game over. Your notion that Trump won because Obama was bad is just foolish - so many holes and I don't care enough to get into it.