hey Jerry; BigV, everyone; thanks for the sparring ; Im gone

It's been a pleasure my friend, sparring was all that was left here; not very far behind you.

The timing of this thread is, to me, impeccable. Was going to post my adios last night in Gina's weather thread (could be the only person who never insulted anyone) but had some calls to make then nodded off.

I'm close too. Not that anyone cares.

There were two "new" members in Gina's BLM thread. Very clear that they were veterans of the forum with only having like 10 or so posts though. I can't recall exactly what was really contained within, I just skimmed it quickly. It may've went south after I saw it, think it only had 4 posts at the time.

I cruise by to see what is going on, but I do not bother to log in just to do that. The only time I log in is when I actually intend to post. Assuming others do that as well, you will often see a large number of guests whom many of those are actual registered users who didn't take the time at that moment to actually log in.

My head and my interests are in a different place as is often the case for me throughout the year depending on what I'm doing and how I'm spending my time, so I don't have a lot to say right now. Hopefully our forum will be around for us down the road as it has before.

I think I got Gina's BLM thread confused with her Iran thread. Like who is Cagey and Pdouble?

I don't know. I really don't care much to be discussing topics at hand right now anyway.

I think I got Gina's BLM thread confused with her Iran thread. Like who is Cagey and Pdouble?
I don't know. I really don't care much to be discussing topics at hand right now anyway.

Glad to hear you're around if not posting.
No idea who those people are, but one isn't nice & hope it's not going to de-rail the whole forum.
Enjoy your summer!

There is another site I visit for college football. Needless to say I'm not spending much time there...but on that one you have to log in to even just read the posts. That might be a solution here...the trolls would only be seen by those who are interested enough to log in and there for would have a smaller audience potentially reading their posts. Maybe, maybe not. There used to be a decent amount of fighting on the football forum I mentioned but now it's just the same people having normal discussions after switching to a member only viewing threads system.

I go on vacation from this place all the time.
Some take things way too personal/serious at times I am of the opinion that "different" has lost its inclusion in modern interaction and emphasis is placed on being right and/or correct to the fault of opposition only being misled, evil, ignorant, mental, intolerant, and everyone's favorite, racist. The anger is the head scratcher though
Dr. Drumz says use your own experiences to guide your path on life as it comes, input from others is just data to be processed and never an absolute. Any puzzle completed/solved by another with no personal interaction by yourself is like saying you painted the print in the frame on your wall or watching an ABB DVD and believing it is the same/ better than actually having been at the Beacon for the gig.

Everyone is a dumb@$$ in some capacity of another, Some fail to possess the ability to admit it, or much worse, have to go see if it is trending on social media before even contemplating the thought process involved.

I typically only log in if I'm going to post something as well, I still lurk to read through some topics. I mostly stick to the Anything Goes, I still prefer to talk about music and I still discover new music here all the time.

I drift over here to the WP for sports mostly, and enjoy reading some of the political discussions. They have typically been pretty thoughtful - people from different areas and perspectives trading info that might not have otherwise been exposed to. There has been a lot to discuss the past 4 years, whatever your opinion this has definitely been a unique time. When people listen to each other, it's thought provoking. Sometimes things get circular, many of us simply believe what we believe. Sometimes there's a Muleman who walks into a room with the intent to kick over the furniture.

I'm not surprised a couple threads got deleted yesterday, there was one newbie who I'm surprised still has an account. Most here are pretty civil, but the WP can take some nasty turns. That's when I usually take a break and stick to AG. But as every year passes, there is less and less to discuss even there, and even some of those threads go off the rails.

But then, HTN has always been a bit of a family. I know a lot of HTN people I've since met at shows who don't come here at all anymore, they stick to FB. When I met Sang at Wanee a few years ago, everyone pointed out we are the only ones out of a whole pack of super fans there who still post on HTN. The WP shines a light on minor topics we disagree about and the WP enhances that because the anonymous nature of online discussions lack nuance. I have great friends and family I disagree with, but they are still my favorite peoples and we can have a cordial conversation. Here in the WP, it's easy to forget how much we have in common.

Right now, 9:17 am Eastern, we have again 3 registered users on line, but we have 529 guests.
We always have a lot of people perusing our posts and possibly forming opinions of who and what we are, and what ABB fans are made of.

They must like the music, or they like the controversy generated here. Maybe some of the "guests" are actually registered, but don't want to get into the mess that has been generated lately. Some could be ones banned from the site, but want to keep up with any "progress" they had generated.

Nebish posted about the football website where you have to log in just to read the posts. When I first came on these forums you didn't have to log in to post. There were a lot of the infamous "0" posters since even a username wasn't required. You should have seen this place back then.
Think the name calling is bad, should have seen some of those posts. Cyber bullying was rampant. Threats of violence, posting addresses, photos of posters homes, phone calls that included death threats where some decided their view was the only one that should be aired, vile language, this place is tame now compared to back then.
Much of that got throttled back when the site changed to require registering to post. Not all, but quite a bit.

Had a good run for a few tears, then a group got together and decided they wanted to "police" the site from those who they didn't like.
They followed some posters from thread to thread and posted insults, not only about him, but his family. Those posters got angry at one of those they didn't want on here and posted the phone number and address where he worked.
We went through a "Boyton Brother" phase then when they would get banned, come back, get banned again, and again. That time it wasn't a single person, but close to 10.
We got through that.
We got through the 2000 election and the circus that came afterward.
Most of us got through the "Fence Fund" year. Some left from the repeated ridicule by some posters who would hijack threads and would sometime post not-so-veiled threats. They did stay the course on the fundraising.
We got through the Obama years where a poster was called racist, and other things, when any type of criticism of Obama was posted.
Last year this place was almost in the same condition it is now. Only a few posting.
BrerRabbit and I got together and decided to just post wild, ridiculous things. Some posters came back and have remained.
This place really isn't dead, just going through one of its' phases. There will more than likely be some culling of those who don't want us to post a disagreement, or are mad that facts don't support their belief.

Some of those posters had been good ones in the past, and always agreed to disagree. I think the strain of the pandemic, isolation, possible money problems form where their job has been deemed non-essential, even the familial problems of forced togetherness (You mean I got to stay in the same house with you for the next xxx months? Hello, is this the package store? Do you do bulk deliveries?).

This has been called a place of brotherhood, and i think it still is. We should be for each other. We should understand that sometimes there are reasons to rant. We might not understand it when a poster does that, but we can still get along.

If a poster wants to rant about something, I think that a Thread called "I just want to rant for bit" would be the place. Post what you want. it might not get read by others, but at least you got it out of your system.

Any agreement on that?

Post what you want. it might not get read by others, but at least you got it out of your system.

Any agreement on that?

To some degree yes I can agree, but you know to some degree also the damage is done. Name calling and bullying are the fastest ways to kill participation in a forum. Some people like to destroy discussion with one word name calling posts like racist, nazi, nazi viper, white supremacist, communist, etc and use GIF's of someone blowing the balls off a nazi to stop discussion and only to cause harm to others and diversion from topics.

However, I think the low traffic is largely due to the fact the band is no more. And it does not help that former band members do not participate and interact with fans at all from what I can tell. The band members themselves open up social media accounts on facebook and draw fans away from this forum over to facebook. I see this with other bands as well.

It tends to divide the fan base rather than unite it which should be what is happening with this computer driven internet. This forum should be linked to social media and it could all be united if only there was a vision for it and determination to make it happen but we don't see that. This forum is isolated from the social media activities of former band members and that is hurting it a lot.

It would be very helpful if former band members would use this forum as part of their every day interaction with paying fan base and keep it alive and use it to promote what they are doing today, but from what I can tell none of them do that. Instead they are drawing fans away from here rather than the opposite and contributing to an overall growing body of band knowledge and history that should be kept alive and promoted and grown.

I can only remember Butch as being the only band member that participated here, and that was few and far between.
Berrys' daughter, Brittany, came here for a while, and she was run off by those who didn't like that she backed the Fence Fund. I also seem to remember Duane's' daughter came in and posted a couple of times during that time.

There was a time when the home page had links to the sites for various musicians.

I don't think it's ever been about band participation, just about talking about the band and your experiences.
Whipping Post was where people came to argue about what was played or what instrument was used and even about what type of pickup was used on certain guitars.
There were many threads about how to build your own "Tractor" bass.
One I remember from way back was concerned if Gregg actually played that fast or was he using the leslie to make it sound as if he was.

here is a question: Why is it that no one who registered since 9-18-2018 has not made it to even 10 posts?
The last one to get close registered on 9-17-2018 and has only 15 posts. There are more that posted 0 posts than all others combined. Just under two years and all that have registered since then have made less than 150 posts.

Who? I am former live sound engineer who worked with more artists than I can count.

Good, thank you for that. Forgive me for seeing a low post count member newly active in WP threads.

Maybe the forum needs some moderators. Very common on other web forums. Roland doesn't have time to baby sit this place. If he can control who has access and posting ability, then maybe some of us can police the threads ourselves. Whoever was going to do that would have to be granted special ability to edit and restrict threads. There are a few good members here who could do that, although they might not want to. I would volunteer myself, I just fear I go through periods of inactivity.

As for a thread for ranting, that is all well and good, but stuff is always going to bleed into all the other threads. It is what it is, it's the internet, a lot of BS goes on everywhere.

33% gain tonight. We've got 4 registered users on line.
In another week, we may have 5.

Thank goodness Cagey is gone - hostile, agitator, spoiling for a fight. He's no longer on the member list, but there's a Cageylefty who registered at the same time who might be back.

When BoytonBrother returned, he'd register as a PeachBud, post 25 times/day (kind of a tip off that he wasn't a newbie), get kicked off, have that username deleted, & do it all over again the next day. He did that 5 times in 6 weeks!

It's getting hard to navigate around here. Having to guard against new trolls is tiresome. Why banned members are desperate to get back here to disrupt is beyond me. This is a site for a defunct 50 yr old band w/comments on Can You Believe What Trump Did Today like putting W & Clinton's official portrait in the room w/unused linens so he wouldn't have to look at them.

Seriously, Cagey was hostile & threatening. When he was talking about hacking accounts, is that possible? What info could anyone get?

Thank goodness Cagey is gone - hostile, agitator, spoiling for a fight. He's no longer on the member list, but there's a Cageylefty who registered at the same time who might be back.

When BoytonBrother returned, he'd register as a PeachBud, post 25 times/day (kind of a tip off that he wasn't a newbie), get kicked off, have that username deleted, & do it all over again the next day. He did that 5 times in 6 weeks!

It's getting hard to navigate around here. Having to guard against new trolls is tiresome. Why banned members are desperate to get back here to disrupt is beyond me. This is a site for a defunct 50 yr old band w/comments on Can You Believe What Trump Did Today like putting W & Clinton's official portrait in the room w/unused linens so he wouldn't have to look at them.

Seriously, Cagey was hostile & threatening. When he was talking about hacking accounts, is that possible? What info could anyone get?

I'm going to have to ask the question, in which posts was he hostile, threatening, or spoiling for a fight?

I never saw a post indicating any of that. Of course he could have done that in a thread I didn't want to read, so, if you could tell me where he did so, I'd like to know.

BoytonBrother is still listed as a member (12/27/2003). Why hasn't his screen name been removed?

Yes, hacking accounts has happened here before.

I'm going to have to ask the question, in which posts was he hostile, threatening, or spoiling for a fight?

He was ranting about taking up arms against hippies yesterday & today, he was all over me about Jews being evil & he was free to say what he wanted.

I don't remember Boyton Brother. I don't know anything about his leaving. All I know is that he tried to return to disrupt threads & insult by posting 25-30 times/day after registering w/a new username. Those usernames were removed. I asked him why he didn't just ask Rowland to re-set his password so he could use Boyton Brother & he said he didn't want to "bother" Rowland.

Yes, hacking accounts has happened here before.

So what info did the hackers get?

Glad to hear Cagey is gone. He came on here nearly a decade ago and got into it with Tom Dowd's daughter about how he taught Dowd how to mic live records. Then this week he came back and was dropping ugly, racist garbage all over the place (the Finland stuff made my skin crawl). He was absolutely the cause of that multiple thread purge a few days ago. It was almost the last straw for me, not what I come here to read. Different opinions are great, but bigotry is not an opinion.

I've said before that the US has never had a real civil war. The Confederacy never tried to overthrow the Federal government.
I feel that there is a problem today that could lead to an actual civil war. The lack of civility among fellow Americans.
Listen to what others say. If someone gives you an opportunity to find out something, check it out. If someone disagrees with you, find out why they do so without ridicule or self serving remarks.

Issues we have as a society at the moment...

- Every issue must be framed politically, red or blue
- Red and Blue issue stances are framed and re-framed by the ideological extremes of both sides
- Absolutely zero humility shown by...anyone
- We are solidly in the Post-Truth Era. "Alternative facts" was a major game-changer.
- Fact and opinion are given equal weight
- Agreement is seen as a weakness, therefore, anyone can rationalize...anything
- The worst attributes of a very small few are attached to the entirety of the whole

Fix all that, we'll be good. Where do we start?

Actually, better question is...who goes first? 😉

I've said before that the US has never had a real civil war. The Confederacy never tried to overthrow the Federal government.
I feel that there is a problem today that could lead to an actual civil war. The lack of civility among fellow Americans.
Listen to what others say. If someone gives you an opportunity to find out something, check it out. If someone disagrees with you, find out why they do so without ridicule or self serving remarks.

Issues we have as a society at the moment...

- Every issue must be framed politically, red or blue
- Red and Blue issue stances are framed and re-framed by the ideological extremes of both sides
- Absolutely zero humility shown by...anyone
- We are solidly in the Post-Truth Era. "Alternative facts" was a major game-changer.
- Fact and opinion are given equal weight
- Agreement is seen as a weakness, therefore, anyone can rationalize...anything
- The worst attributes of a very small few are attached to the entirety of the whole

Fix all that, we'll be good. Where do we start?

Actually, better question is...who goes first? 😉

Lookout we're agreeing again.

I've said before that the US has never had a real civil war. The Confederacy never tried to overthrow the Federal government.
I feel that there is a problem today that could lead to an actual civil war. The lack of civility among fellow Americans.
Listen to what others say. If someone gives you an opportunity to find out something, check it out. If someone disagrees with you, find out why they do so without ridicule or self serving remarks.

Issues we have as a society at the moment...

- Every issue must be framed politically, red or blue
- Red and Blue issue stances are framed and re-framed by the ideological extremes of both sides
- Absolutely zero humility shown by...anyone
- We are solidly in the Post-Truth Era. "Alternative facts" was a major game-changer.
- Fact and opinion are given equal weight
- Agreement is seen as a weakness, therefore, anyone can rationalize...anything
- The worst attributes of a very small few are attached to the entirety of the whole

Fix all that, we'll be good. Where do we start?

Actually, better question is...who goes first? 😉

I have tried for a while to show some folks that what they believe isn't exactly what's true.

Put the facts in front of them, and they attack you because you don't follow their view of reality.

Some times there is a "purple" side to issues. Something that works for both sides, but not in a manner that the reds and blues want it done.

There are things that I agree on with my sometimes political opposites. Get fussed at from both sides that I'm not following the status quo.

Why should humility be an issue? Everybody knows that you need to drown out the other voices to get your point across. Just don't let your opponent speak, write, or broadcast an opinion that isn't yours.
That's the way things are now. Nobody listens, just tries to keep blaring out what they want hear. If you don't listen, how can there be dialog? Without dialog, no understanding. No understanding, no humility, no sympathy, no caring.

Alternative facts, no. Additional facts, yes. Too easy to research that which really happened, and shame those who tend to want to make the real facts bend to their version of reality.

Opinion can hold sway in an theoretical argument, but should never be presented as "this is what happened".

As said before, I agree with my sometimes opponents once in a while, if I don't, I try not to make a federal case out of it.

The actions of individuals doesn't effect how i feel on others in their racial, religious, geographic, gender, or sexual affiliation. I am wondering when there will be a Heterosexual Pride Day and Parade.

I might not be able to fix it, but I think I've got a decent start to it. Now, if others will just start to listen to what people have to say, and feel what they are saying, maybe we can get a little farther along in this human race.

^^
well put

There is so much gray out there. Unfortunately much of it has been lost.
There is no nuance anymore.
We live in an analog world, but all decisions have become binary.
I miss the days when I can have a discussion without emotion with people I disagree with. I often learn more in those situations than I do when I'm talking with people who are mostly in my camp.

Sometimes there are great discussions here. Sometimes I have to shake my head an ignore what someone posted, sometimes I have to walk away.

I'm going to have to ask the question, in which posts was he hostile, threatening, or spoiling for a fight?

He was ranting about taking up arms against hippies yesterday & today, he was all over me about Jews being evil & he was free to say what he wanted.

I don't remember Boyton Brother. I don't know anything about his leaving. All I know is that he tried to return to disrupt threads & insult by posting 25-30 times/day after registering w/a new username. Those usernames were removed. I asked him why he didn't just ask Rowland to re-set his password so he could use Boyton Brother & he said he didn't want to "bother" Rowland.

Yes, hacking accounts has happened here before.

So what info did the hackers get?

Did you see my post about where some posters got hold of addresses, phone numbers, work location, photos of houses of posters they didn't like, along with names of family members?

Mine was hacked early on. Got some nasty phone calls, late night visitors yelling from cars, and some threats.
Kinda quit when somebody found out why I had a t-shirt that says "Does Not Play Well With Others".
I then went with an unlisted number.

Did you see my post about where some posters got hold of addresses, phone numbers, work location, photos of houses of posters they didn't like, along with names of family members?

Mine was hacked early on. Got some nasty phone calls, late night visitors yelling from cars, and some threats.
Kinda quit when somebody found out why I had a t-shirt that says "Does Not Play Well With Others".
I then went with an unlisted number.

Wow! I had no idea. Sorry to hear that.

I registered years ago & don't recall providing much more than my email & creating a username/password. Can't imagine what someone could do w/that.

Well, hopefully Cagey was just a lot of noise & isn't going to hack anyone.

am wondering when there will be a Heterosexual Pride Day and Parade.

All day, every day at your local gogo bar. Go celebrate your orientation til the cows come home! How long would a gay strip joint stay in business in the town nearest you?

You ever hear of Ann's Tic Toc club on Broadway? Where Little Richard got his start. It opened in the 40's, closed in the late 70's, but there are several "alternate" sexual joints around here, they just aren't strip clubs.

Besides GoGo bars are so 60ish.

Did you see my post about where some posters got hold of addresses, phone numbers, work location, photos of houses of posters they didn't like, along with names of family members?

Mine was hacked early on. Got some nasty phone calls, late night visitors yelling from cars, and some threats.
Kinda quit when somebody found out why I had a t-shirt that says "Does Not Play Well With Others".
I then went with an unlisted number.

Wow! I had no idea. Sorry to hear that.

I registered years ago & don't recall providing much more than my email & creating a username/password. Can't imagine what someone could do w/that.

Well, hopefully Cagey was just a lot of noise & isn't going to hack anyone.

Wow, pretty weird. Thanks for the warning Jerry, strange as it's been around here might be a good time for all to do a password change:

Gotta remember all that happened more than 15 years ago.

funny how Oregon pretends to be so progressive and tolerant but really very provincial compared to cultural hotspots down south.

Why aren't the Oregon militias fighting back against the secret Federal police infiltrating Portland? Isn't this exactly what they trained for?

funny how Oregon pretends to be so progressive and tolerant but really very provincial compared to cultural hotspots down south.

Why aren't the Oregon militias fighting back against the secret Federal police infiltrating Portland? Isn't this exactly what they trained for?

Conspiracy theory?

funny how Oregon pretends to be so progressive and tolerant but really very provincial compared to cultural hotspots down south.

Why aren't the Oregon militias fighting back against the secret Federal police infiltrating Portland? Isn't this exactly what they trained for?

Conspiracy theory?

For the militias, maybe.

A few years ago, OR militias raided a public wildlife building.

https://www.newsweek.com/oregon-militia-members-fear-federal-raid-coming-412186

This past week, unidentified federal agents have been arresting people on the streets of Portland

https://www.forbes.com/sites/rachelsandler/2020/07/18/outcry-in-oregon-state-sues-homeland-security-as-national-local-officials-tell-troops-to-get-out/#76d6c92d1eae

Just saying, this is exactly the kind of government overstep these militias are against. Well, until they aren’t

[Edited on 7/19/2020 by porkchopbob]

With today's technology you can follow a group of 200 people doing "whatever" two weeks ago in real time up to the moment a few got arrested. What they did in that time frame? I don't know, you don't know, the news don't know, but the person "randomly" getting pulled off the street knows.

Different opinions are great, but bigotry is not an opinion.

Lord, here we go. "Bigotry" as defined by who?.....Just another label for thoughts expressed that differ with yours.

Give it a rest.