The Tax Cut and Jobs Act has passed in Congress.
President Trump and the Republicans deliver for The American People while The Democrats lie and cry.
President Trump and the Republicans deliver
He’s getting aroused folks.
Michael Bloomberg on the tax cuts
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/tax-cuts-alone-wont-answer-u-s-economic-needs-bloomberg-says
The GOP ain't stupid. They just lined the pockets of billionaires and huge corporate donors, and gave a small tax break that helps mostly those in red states. Then they set the tax cuts for individuals to expire in 7 years, while keeping the tax cuts for those at the top. Why expire the tax cuts for the non millionaires in 7 years? Because they know they likely won't be in power at the time and they will somehow be able to blame the Democrats for the tax increase that everybody except those at the top will see. In fact, the tax rates will expire, but the deductions that most in the middle class enjoy will not return. Again, very cleaver. The billionaires will continue to enjoy their tax breaks while everyone else will get a tax increase, and they will blame it on the Democrats. Bravo!
[Edited on 12/20/2017 by 2112]
The Tax Cut and Jobs Act has passed in Congress.
President Trump and the Republicans deliver for The American People while The Democrats lie and cry.
I'm not a Democrat and I'm completely against this piece of poor legislation. It has elements that clearly benefit one portion of society plus will increase the deficit. Do you have any idea how long it takes to count a trillion at a buck a second?
Heard Corker say this morning the amount potentially added to the debt is $500 billion. The Democrats stick with the $1.5 trillion figure. I don't know who to believe on anything anymore, but even a supporter of the bill, and supposed concern for debt and deficit increases, admits that it could add to the deficit. Not surprisingly the Republicans and Democrats each favor different ways of calculating the figures to suit one's position.
Corporate tax reform if good, as long as we get the good benefits and results of such reform. Time will tell. This issue along could've garnered decent bipartisan support I imagine.
The Democrats are using an interesting, and to their credit, effective argument on this, saying that 87% of the benefits goes to the 1%...but a large component of the benefits is going to corporations not simply the often demonized and always hated 1% of wealthy individuals Democrats so rely on dragging through the mud. If we were to strip away the corporate benefits and just look at individual and married tax filers I wonder what that % comes down to?
Some have said saving $600 for somebody how earns $70,000 is "peanuts" and "not even worth it". $600 is real money. Not worth it, as opposed to continually paying $600 more every year?
I will say the corporate tax reform makes some sense. The individual cuts I think come at a curious time just because as I can remember the Bush tax cuts and the Regan tax cuts were at times the economy needed a boost. We are experiencing decent growth and low unemployment currently, so atleast compared to the other two major tax cut bills the timing on this one seems quite different. Is it possible that this bill moves us from 3% GDP growth to some higher rate? If the economy is going to grow and if businesses are going to hire more people, with historically low unemployment where are the new workers going to be found? (technically speaking about the numbers, perhaps not in reality of the actual unemployed persons which some think is quite a bit higher still)
The Tax Cut and Jobs Act has passed in Congress.
President Trump and the Republicans deliver for The American People while The Democrats lie and cry.
26% of Americans approve of it!, theres a real victory
Only 18% approved of President Reagan's 1986 tax cut and the result was over a decade of strong economic growth and millions of new jobs.
The left simply cannot stop lying:
“Trump’s Tax Cuts only benefit his billionaire buddies and penalizes the middle class”
Utter crap.
What the left doesn’t mention in their lie is that the minimal rate decrease tax rate they use has no effect on the top earners. The rate the left screams about is on wages which is not a source of income for the top earners. Their income comes from capital gains and the tax rate on that income does not change in the Tax Cut and Jobs act.
The left also does not mention the doubling of the standard deduction and almost doubling of the child tax credit which is a huge benefit to the middle class and the poor.
The Democrats have been lying daily for months about President Trump and The Republican’s Tax Cut and Jobs Act.
So outrageously false even The Washington Post’s fact-checker, Glenn Kessler (Pinocchio) skewered the Democrat’s lies:
Senate Democrats falsely claim GOP tax plan will raise taxes for most working-class families
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2017/11/02/senate-democrats-falsely-claim-gop-tax-plan-will-raise-taxes-for-most-working-class-families/?utm_term=.73d9d60783b8
Democratic Policy and Communications Committee
Talking points (lies) for Democrats to use when running to the corrupt liberal media:
https://www.democrats.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/50%20State%20Report%20-%20Tax%20FINAL.PDF
One source of Democrat lies:
Republicans Push Tax Hike on Millions of Working Families
https://www.jec.senate.gov/public/_cache/files/645d77d3-592a-4221-b57f-f41f4421f9b5/tax-increase-working-families.pdf
Another source of Democrat lies:
The “Tax Policy Center” has been discredited as a political action arm of the left and who’s report is flatly false.
The “Tax Policy Center” is a joint operation of the liberal-leaning Urban Institute and Brookings Institution and funded by George Soros.
http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/model-estimates/unified-framework-september-2017/t17-0225-unified-framework-distribution-federal-tax
Embarrassed by the above false report, the Democrats issued a “clearer” report that admits that most people would have a tax cut:
Caught in the first lie the Democrats were forced to issue a “Special Report”:
SPECIAL 50-STATE REPORT: HOW THE REPUBLICAN TAX GIVEAWAY TO THE WEALTHY WOULD HURT FAMILIES
https://www.democrats.senate.gov/dpcc/press-releases/special-50-state-report-how-the-republican-tax-giveaway-to-the-wealthy-would-hurt-families
Are you a spokesman now? LOL
Repeating lies over and over again don't make them true.....
The left simply cannot stop lying:
“Trump’s Tax Cuts only benefit his billionaire buddies and penalizes the middle class”Utter crap.
What the left doesn’t mention in their lie is that the minimal rate decrease tax rate they use has no effect on the top earners. The rate the left screams about is on wages which is not a source of income for the top earners. Their income comes from capital gains and the tax rate on that income does not change in the Tax Cut and Jobs act.
The left also does not mention the doubling of the standard deduction and almost doubling of the child tax credit which is a huge benefit to the middle class and the poor.
If that is the case then why not just leave the 39.6% rate rather than reducing it to 37%? Atleast some of the optics of the plan could be argued differently then. They should've left the top rate where it was.
So much for the GOP deficit hawks. That's all we've heard for years from the GOP...especially under Obama. What about Corker and his not voting for the bill if it adds one cent. Guess he rolled over like a puppy dog.
"In an exclusive interview on Meet the Press, Sen. Bob Corker (R-Tenn.) tells Chuck Todd that if the GOP’s new tax reform plan adds a penny to the deficit he won’t support it."
The GOP talking points are supply side rehashed theory that probably won't create the anticipated growth & offsets. That's why the provision for individual taxes to go up if targets aren't met. But that's not the case for corporations.
Yes, the GOP deficit hawks went the way of GOP compassionate conservatism and the dodo bird - three entities that are now history.
Want to bet the GOP deficit hawks will make a recovery if a Democrat is elected to be prez in 2020.
The left simply cannot stop lying:
“Trump’s Tax Cuts only benefit his billionaire buddies and penalizes the middle class”Utter crap.
What the left doesn’t mention in their lie is that the minimal rate decrease tax rate they use has no effect on the top earners. The rate the left screams about is on wages which is not a source of income for the top earners. Their income comes from capital gains and the tax rate on that income does not change in the Tax Cut and Jobs act.
The left also does not mention the doubling of the standard deduction and almost doubling of the child tax credit which is a huge benefit to the middle class and the poor.
If you hate the left, why do you think about them so much?
I guess Republicans only care about debt and deficit when they are talking about entitlements?
Honestly I don't think most Republicans care about debt and deficit anyway...as long as they are the ones in power.
It should matter though, it matters to me, it makes sense...don't spend more than you receive.
That's just the thing with the projections. I don't know who to believe or trust on it. And really there are so many variables that are unpredictable and can change to make all the projections unreliable.
But one thing is for sure I think, raising taxes doesn't guarantee more tax revenue and cutting taxes doesn't guarantee less tax revenue. There is something to the behavior of the tax payer in light of having to tax plan to avoid paying higher taxes or being able to spend or invest more in light of less tax liability. It boils down to what the government decides (or is obligated) to spend the money on - so whatever the incoming tax receipts are is what should dictate what they spend.
The only way this "works" is if the top earners and corporations actually do trickle it down and actually take the savings and actually create jobs. On the state level, this did not happen.
Time and only time will tell.
I guess Republicans only care about debt and deficit when they are talking about entitlements?
Honestly I don't think most Republicans care about debt and deficit anyway...as long as they are the ones in power.
It should matter though, it matters to me, it makes sense...don't spend more than you receive.
That's just the thing with the projections. I don't know who to believe or trust on it. And really there are so many variables that are unpredictable and can change to make all the projections unreliable.
But one thing is for sure I think, raising taxes doesn't guarantee more tax revenue and cutting taxes doesn't guarantee less tax revenue. There is something to the behavior of the tax payer in light of having to tax plan to avoid paying higher taxes or being able to spend or invest more in light of less tax liability. It boils down to what the government decides (or is obligated) to spend the money on - so whatever the incoming tax receipts are is what should dictate what they spend.
Trickle down has never worked before. There is no reason to think it will work now. Republican projections are based on the rosy theory that by getting tax breaks, they will create jobs. BS. Jobs are created when the consumers are spending. Consumers spend when they have money. The paltry tax breaks consumers are getting will not help that much. When those tax breaks expire, a recession is sure to follow.
The Tax Cut and Jobs Act has passed in Congress.
President Trump and the Republicans deliver for The American People while The Democrats lie and cry.
26% of Americans approve of it!, theres a real victory
Only 18% approved of President Reagan's 1986 tax cut and the result was over a decade of strong economic growth and millions of new jobs.
Allow me take on of your favorite quotes, “Wrong. try again son,”
if you’re too stupid to understand that these are the kind of actions that led to the massive economic crash 10 years ago...then good god I really want whatever drugs you take. I enjoy escaping reality too!
[Edited on 12/23/2017 by lukester420]
Trickle down has never worked before. There is no reason to think it will work now. Republican projections are based on the rosy theory that by getting tax breaks, they will create jobs. BS. Jobs are created when the consumers are spending. Consumers spend when they have money. The paltry tax breaks consumers are getting will not help that much. When those tax breaks expire, a recession is sure to follow.
The individual cuts expire in 2025. Congress could extend or renew them depending on who's in power.
But so you are saying that recession is sure to follow in 2025...is that because taxes will increase and then are you saying higher taxes = recession. I don't think you are, but see how that sounds?
Give me 8 years of continued economic growth, if you are saying we have 8 more years until a recession I'll be very very very happy with that. Chances are we get a dip, contraction, recession to some degree or another before that. Our current period of expansion started in 2009. If we run until 2025 that is going to be a hell of a run! The current period we are in is about to become the second longest in US history!
Allow me take on of your favorite quotes, “Wrong. try again son,”
if you’re too stupid to understand that these are the kind of actions that led to the massive economic crash 10 years ago...then good god I really want whatever drugs you take. I enjoy escaping reality too![Edited on 12/23/2017 by lukester420]
You are saying specifically the Bush tax cuts of 2001 and 2003 led to the great recession? That isn't the case. What evidence do you have to support your position?
Allow me take on of your favorite quotes, “Wrong. try again son,”
if you’re too stupid to understand that these are the kind of actions that led to the massive economic crash 10 years ago...then good god I really want whatever drugs you take. I enjoy escaping reality too![Edited on 12/23/2017 by lukester420]
You are saying specifically the Bush tax cuts of 2001 and 2003 led to the great recession? That isn't the case. What evidence do you have to support your position?
Interesting, I need to show evidence to back my claims, yet you provide nothing but your own opinion to support your position.
The fact that you read that and immediately felt the need to defend the Bush administration speaks volumes.
In my opinion, it was not necessarily just the Bush administration and the tax cuts but the last oh, 35 years of gov’t policies that allowed for Wallstreet, lenders and other big business leaders to operate with impunity. Massive corruption, conflicts of interest and lack of regulation led to the crash. These are all things that are avoidable if you don’t subscribe to the laissez-Faire horse crap of letting crooks regulate themselves in the hope that they will just, out of the goodness of their own hearts not be greedy schmucks and stimulate anyone’s pockets but their own.
Since it is irrational to argue with someone who subscribes to a different set of facts, I do not expect to change anyone’s opinions since this forum proves this on an daily basis, but here ya go.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/20/business/worldbusiness/20iht-prexy.4.16321064.html
http://prospect.org/article/bubble-economy
https://www.forbes.com/sites/peterferrara/2011/05/19/how-the-government-created-a-financial-crisis/#72dfb8b321fb
http://www.aei.org/publication/how-government-failure-caused-the-great-recession/
https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424053111904199404576536930606933332
http://www.heritage.org/government-regulation/commentary/government-policies-caused-the-financial-crisis-and-made-the
[Edited on 12/23/2017 by lukester420]
Haha, you're funny. You said "these are the kind of actions that led to the massive economic crash 10 years ago" in a thread about a tax cut bill. What is one supposed to take from that? I had no way to know what was inside your head beyond what you typed, what other actions are in this tax cut bill that I might've drawn some broader meaning from for your post? The last time "these kinds of actions" took place were the 2001 and 2003 Bush-era tax bills and had nothing to do with the great recession as you claimed, or I thought you claimed. Democrats have liked to paint that picture, but it is false as described here:
Now if you would've originally stated that it was something larger than just tax reform that led to the great recession, I wouldn't have raised a peep, we could actually agree on alot of those points. Your provided links are excellent snapshots and review of history. And I thank you for those for reminders and reference. But that wasn't the impression you gave, or I took, from your post. Blame you for not saying what you meant, or blame me for being too narrow in interpreting your words.
And yes, I will to this day defend, on principle the Bush-era tax cuts. My only objection was doing so on a war-footing which as we know happened not long after passage of part 1 of those cuts. I'm glad you now have "volumes" to take away from that opinion whatever that does for you going forward I don't know.
I guess Republicans only care about debt and deficit when they are talking about entitlements?
Honestly I don't think most Republicans care about debt and deficit anyway...as long as they are the ones in power.
It should matter though, it matters to me, it makes sense...don't spend more than you receive.
That's just the thing with the projections. I don't know who to believe or trust on it. And really there are so many variables that are unpredictable and can change to make all the projections unreliable.
But one thing is for sure I think, raising taxes doesn't guarantee more tax revenue and cutting taxes doesn't guarantee less tax revenue. There is something to the behavior of the tax payer in light of having to tax plan to avoid paying higher taxes or being able to spend or invest more in light of less tax liability. It boils down to what the government decides (or is obligated) to spend the money on - so whatever the incoming tax receipts are is what should dictate what they spend.
Trickle down has never worked before. There is no reason to think it will work now. Republican projections are based on the rosy theory that by getting tax breaks, they will create jobs. BS. Jobs are created when the consumers are spending. Consumers spend when they have money. The paltry tax breaks consumers are getting will not help that much. When those tax breaks expire, a recession is sure to follow.
Wow, the left is talking about the national debt and throwing a faux -fit.
While Obama adding more to the national debt than all previous 43 Presidents combined we heard nothing from the left.
Okay, President Trump and The Republican’s Tax Cut and Jobs Act might add about $1.5 Trillion to the national debt. However, the growth in GDP because of the strong economy the Tax Cut and Jobs Act will bring will easily wipeout that $1.5 Trillion.
Yet again The American People, President Trump and The Republicans score another major win and the lefties just lie can cry.
If you hate Obama and the left, why do you think about them so much?
If you hate Obama and the left, why do you think about them so much?
The complete failure of Obama must be exposed as well as the damage done to our country.
The left has nothing to offer. It would be interesting to compare President Trump and The Republican's Tax Cut and Jobs Act to that offered by The Democrats but the Democrat had no plan.
The rhetoric from the left is destroyed the actual results.
I prefer results.
Since president Trump’s election:
- The Stock Market has risen 25%. The majority of American’s pension plans are invested in the stock market.
- GDP is has risen to 3.2% for two straight quarters and is project to remain at above that.
- Unemployment has fallen to almost a flat 4% and the country is approaching full employment.
- The 2 million new jobs added are almost all full-time and at above living wage.
- Many major companies are retuning to The U.S. and making major investments and hiring hundreds of thousands of new employees.
Within hours of Congress passing the Tax Cut and Jobs Act:
- AT&T was the first company to go public with its plans to pass along coming tax savings to workers, saying once the tax bill is passed it would pay a special $1,000 bonus to more than 200,000 of its non-management workers. Front-line managers, the company said, will also be included in the bonus pool. The telecom giant also confirmed it would invest $1 billion more in the U.S. in 2018.
- Comcast announced that it would award $1,000 bonuses to more than 100,000 employees, which would include frontline and non-executive employees.
- Fifth Third Bancorp, a regional bank based in Cincinnati, said it will raise the minimum wage for all of its nearly 3,000 hourly employees to $15, and would distribute a bonus of $1,000 for more than 13,500 employees by the end of the year.
- Wells Fargo, said it would boost its minimum wage to $15 per hour, an 11% increase from its current hourly rate of $13.50.
- Aerospace giant Boeing said it would move forward with $300 million in investments as a result of the new tax law, including $100 million in employee training and education and $100 million to enhance Boeing facilities as part of its "workforce of the future" initiative.
- Aerospace giant Boeing said it would move forward with $300 million in investments as a result of the new tax law, including $100 million in employee training and education and $100 million to enhance Boeing facilities as part of its "workforce of the future" initiative.
The complete failure of Obama must be exposed as well as the damage done to our country.
Why must this happen?
Haha, you're funny. You said "these are the kind of actions that led to the massive economic crash 10 years ago" in a thread about a tax cut bill. What is one supposed to take from that? I had no way to know what was inside your head beyond what you typed, what other actions are in this tax cut bill that I might've drawn some broader meaning from for your post? The last time "these kinds of actions" took place were the 2001 and 2003 Bush-era tax bills and had nothing to do with the great recession as you claimed, or I thought you claimed. Democrats have liked to paint that picture, but it is false as described here:
Now if you would've originally stated that it was something larger than just tax reform that led to the great recession, I wouldn't have raised a peep, we could actually agree on alot of those points. Your provided links are excellent snapshots and review of history. And I thank you for those for reminders and reference. But that wasn't the impression you gave, or I took, from your post. Blame you for not saying what you meant, or blame me for being too narrow in interpreting your words.
And yes, I will to this day defend, on principle the Bush-era tax cuts. My only objection was doing so on a war-footing which as we know happened not long after passage of part 1 of those cuts. I'm glad you now have "volumes" to take away from that opinion whatever that does for you going forward I don't know.
I shall cherish these volumes. I did indeed post in a way that did not convey what I wanted to say, so I do blame me. But still, Buck Fush.
Wow, the left is talking about the national debt and throwing a faux -fit.
While Obama adding more to the national debt than all previous 43 Presidents combined we heard nothing from the left.
Okay, President Trump and The Republican’s Tax Cut and Jobs Act might add about $1.5 Trillion to the national debt. However, the growth in GDP because of the strong economy the Tax Cut and Jobs Act will bring will easily wipeout that $1.5 Trillion.
Yet again The American People, President Trump and The Republicans score another major win and the lefties just lie can cry.
In fairness a good bit of the debt added under Obama was actually set in stone from the last few Bush years. Obama inherited a mess of epic proportions, but the ship did get turned around. Trump was set up for success. Now maybe the growth under Obama was slower or smaller than ideal, but it was a growing economy none-the-less and Trump should benefit from that. Which is much different than what GW or Obama inherited upon taking office.
I shall cherish these volumes. I did indeed post in a way that did not convey what I wanted to say, so I do blame me. But still, Buck Fush
Good. I enjoy the interaction here as well.
And really I jumped the gun since your reply was to muleman, but I thought I could offer a better response than he would or could.
I look forward to our future posts. Here is to hoping the best for the holidays for everyone, left-right-and middle. Cheers.
