...How one can relate gang violence to mentally ill terrorists legally buying WMD's is beyond me.
You are right because one kills A WHOLE LOT MORE people than the other every year.
Or I guess if I wanted to reply to your post using your demented logic I should have said, "Oh, so you are ok with gang violence?"
And BTW.. At least the Ryder makes coherent points. I was joking about your drinking so early in the day but now I am starting to wonder.
"President Trump is visiting Las Vegas on Wednesday, he spoke this morning, said he’s praying for those who lost their lives. You know in February, he also signed a bill that made it easier for people with severe mental illness to buy guns legally," Kimmel said in his monologue. "Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, Speaker of the House Paul Ryan, a number of other lawmakers who won’t do anything about this because the NRA has their balls in a money clip, also sent their thoughts and their prayers today, which is good. They should be praying. They should be praying for God to forgive them for letting the gun lobby run this country, because it's so crazy."
https://www.yahoo.com/gma/jimmy-kimmel-calls-congress-over-inaction-gun-control-090009528--abc-news-topstories.html
[Edited on 10/3/2017 by robslob]
OK, I'll bite. Which bill did he sign to let mentally ill people purchase firearms? Links please.
if they don't have guns they use trucks, or fertilizer bombs or whatever... that was my point and yet still no one says anything about 1200 lives each day lost to tobacco now that is insanity!
Filling your own lungs with smoke is a choice, unlike getting shot to death by someone else at a concert. Kind of insane you're comparing the two.
It's true that every time you leave your house there is a chance that someone else can take your life, intentionally or accidentally. We have many regulations on dangerous items and substances to keep us and our neighbors safe. That's why automatic guns are rare and rarely used in crimes - they are strictly regulated. Heavily regulating and controlling semi-automatic weapons would likely have the same effect.
You've never heard of "second hand smoke"?
if they don't have guns they use trucks, or fertilizer bombs or whatever... that was my point and yet still no one says anything about 1200 lives each day lost to tobacco now that is insanity!
Filling your own lungs with smoke is a choice, unlike getting shot to death by someone else at a concert. Kind of insane you're comparing the two.
It's true that every time you leave your house there is a chance that someone else can take your life, intentionally or accidentally. We have many regulations on dangerous items and substances to keep us and our neighbors safe. That's why automatic guns are rare and rarely used in crimes - they are strictly regulated. Heavily regulating and controlling semi-automatic weapons would likely have the same effect.
You've never heard of "second hand smoke"?
Are you trying to make my point for me?
We regulate smoking. Heavily. After it was proved to be a health risk to people who couldn't object (often young children in smoke-filled homes who were acquiring asthma) smoking areas have shrunk over the past few decades. There are local ordinances banning smoking from restaurants and public places, airplanes, hospitals, etc. There are televised ad campaigns and Federally mandated warnings on cigarette packaging. People went after the tobacco companies and their lobbyists, and it worked. After a steady effort to find solutions to the effects of smoking, if you want to smoke today, it is largely at your own risk. But you know what? - you can still smoke, no one took peoples' smokes away!
So yeah, everyone went to bat to stop innocent people from developing asthma, emphysema, bronchitis. Maybe we should try this with highly dangerous semi-automatic weapons that have been used to repeatedly murder large numbers of innocent people.
[Edited on 10/4/2017 by porkchopbob]
The people that say, "you will never be able to prevent someone who snapped from hurting people," are exactly right. HOWEVER, why then do we leave the most common and simple way of doing that on a large scale so easily accessible?
Almost anybody can figure out how to point a gun and squeeze the trigger (it's just like a video game). Not that many (in a fit of mental insanity, especially) can go through all the steps of building a successful bomb on a truck.
But, if someone flips out and they already own multiple machine guns, it is pretty easy to go out and hurt a lot of people.
We have had bombings, but we do not have an epidemic of bombings. We have had car attacks, but we do not have an epidemic of car attacks. It is hard to hurt 600 people in an acid attack. It is hard to hurt 600 people in a knife attack. It would be hard to hurt 600 people by throwing hammers out of a 32nd story window before the cops can kill you. There a very few ways to do this much damage while you are committing suicide without machine guns.
Reasonable gun policy is not the "beginning of confiscating all guns" anymore than security checks at airports is the end of airplanes. It is simply doing something to address a deadly problem, INSTEAD OF DOING NOTHING.
There is a constitutional right to "bear arms" and we can continue to debate what was meant by that, but suggesting that James Madison was talking about machine guns is pretty flimsy.
Giving up something that you enjoy for the betterment of society is called civilization...
What machine guns are you talking about? If he had some then he had either gone through almost a year of multiple background checks, license checks, fees, fingerprinting, and very costly transfer fees.
Misinformation is one thing that goes rampant after an incident like this. There have been no reports of machine guns being used. There are reports of an aftermarket item called a SlideFire. This effectively makes the rifle push forward against your finger with forward recoil from the stock. The rifle can then be fired at it's cyclic rate, if you practice with it for a while. It does not make the rifle a machine gun or an assault rifle. To me, it's just a way to burn through ammo. It's not effective of putting rounds on target, but it does help you spend more money on ammo.
The shooter was from 900 to 1200 feet away from where the bullets hit, he wasn't aiming at anyone in particular, just doing a "spray and pray" in my opinion.
Now, for a question. did the Founding Fathers set up the 1st Amendment for TV, Radio, Movies, DVD, CD, VHS, cassette, photography, internet, or for Facebook, Snap-chat, Google, Instagram, and other social media venues? It's about your comment on James Madison.
"President Trump is visiting Las Vegas on Wednesday, he spoke this morning, said he’s praying for those who lost their lives. You know in February, he also signed a bill that made it easier for people with severe mental illness to buy guns legally," Kimmel said in his monologue. "Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, Speaker of the House Paul Ryan, a number of other lawmakers who won’t do anything about this because the NRA has their balls in a money clip, also sent their thoughts and their prayers today, which is good. They should be praying. They should be praying for God to forgive them for letting the gun lobby run this country, because it's so crazy."
https://www.yahoo.com/gma/jimmy-kimmel-calls-congress-over-inaction-gun-control-090009528--abc-news-topstories.html
[Edited on 10/3/2017 by robslob]OK, I'll bite. Which bill did he sign to let mentally ill people purchase firearms? Links please.
Here you go:
Misinformation is one thing that goes rampant after an incident like this. There have been no reports of machine guns being used. There are reports of an aftermarket item called a SlideFire. This effectively makes the rifle push forward against your finger with forward recoil from the stock. The rifle can then be fired at it's cyclic rate, if you practice with it for a while. It does not make the rifle a machine gun or an assault rifle. To me, it's just a way to burn through ammo. It's not effective of putting rounds on target, but it does help you spend more money on ammo.
The shooter was from 900 to 1200 feet away from where the bullets hit, he wasn't aiming at anyone in particular, just doing a "spray and pray" in my opinion.
This is kind of the point. Automatics are heavily regulated because they are very dangerous. Semiautomatics are not as heavily regulated, but he purchased a legal device that made it more like an automatic. So why bother regulating Automatics when this device is legal? Oh, the shooter wasn't doing target practice in a crowd of 22,000 people? No sh1t? Existing regulation contradicts itself and it fatally failed hundreds of people.
Misinformation is one thing that goes rampant after an incident like this. There have been no reports of machine guns being used. There are reports of an aftermarket item called a SlideFire. This effectively makes the rifle push forward against your finger with forward recoil from the stock. The rifle can then be fired at it's cyclic rate, if you practice with it for a while. It does not make the rifle a machine gun or an assault rifle. To me, it's just a way to burn through ammo. It's not effective of putting rounds on target, but it does help you spend more money on ammo.
The shooter was from 900 to 1200 feet away from where the bullets hit, he wasn't aiming at anyone in particular, just doing a "spray and pray" in my opinion.
This is kind of the point. Automatics are heavily regulated because they are very dangerous. Semiautomatics are not as heavily regulated, but he purchased a legal device that made it more like an automatic. So why bother regulating Automatics when this device is legal? Oh, the shooter wasn't doing target practice in a crowd of 22,000 people? No sh1t? Existing regulation contradicts itself and it fatally failed hundreds of people.
Calm down before you pop a blood vessel. You ain't getting any younger ya know.
This may get long but I really want to give you the truth about alcohol and tobacco and guns , dead is dead when someone drinks I am sure they are not thinking of going on a drive and killing people yet it happens now using anti gun thinking we should ban alcohol? right but we all know it will not happen it was tried and failed look up prohibition if you are not informed on it.... Tobacco kills others as well second hand smoke has killed many thousands of people who grew up in smoking homes again it was not done on purpose but still these people are dead yet tobacco still is sold to kill more remember dead is dead.. the method does not really matter how about automobiles?
My point is this we can not always control the things that happen to us and others not matter what laws we pass or make, the guns used in Chicago are illegal guns over 90% are and they are used by criminals !!!! NO law you make pass or whatever are going to obey that law that is why they are criminals it is what they do.
Sick people will do what they do no law will stop one from committing a crime if they have it in their minds to do so because they do not think they are right.... what law will stop anyone who is not committed or was previously committed .... and as it is now committed people can NOT buy a gun.
The second amendment is NOT about hunting or target shooting it is a fail safe for the American people to have the means to take back their Government in the event it become corrupt and tries to do away with the rights guaranteed in the constitution and bill of rights . The founding fathers felt this was as important as any other right and it is there to protect all of us but we as a Nation have grown lazy and uniformed and we have grown reliant on the Government and police force to do everything for us and the world of technology and media just make these sick bastards into stars and martyrs...the only thing that I believe will help this problem is education about guns and people being responsible with guns, other than that please tell me what law can be passed that would stop any one of the last 10 idiots with guns.
also almost every day some with a gun helps or stops someone else from hurting another person with a gun, it happens all the time yet where is that news on the 6.00 o clock report?
http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/25/us/tennessee-church-shooting-hero-trnd/index.html
http://www.davekopel.org/2A/LawRev/american-revolution-against-british-gun-control.html
The second link is about what helped start the Revolutionary war yes GUN CONTROL!
I am more than happy to try and answer anyone's questions as best i can but if you are going to just attack me with no rational facts other than your personal feelings i am out of here and i am sure you don't care but If you want to have a adult conversation I am more than willing...
This may get long but I really want to give you the truth about alcohol and tobacco and guns , dead is dead when someone drinks I am sure they are not thinking of going on a drive and killing people yet it happens now using anti gun thinking we should ban alcohol? right but we all know it will not happen it was tried and failed look up prohibition if you are not informed on it.... Tobacco kills others as well second hand smoke has killed many thousands of people who grew up in smoking homes again it was not done on purpose but still these people are dead yet tobacco still is sold to kill more remember dead is dead.. the method does not really matter how about automobiles?
My point is this we can not always control the things that happen to us and others not matter what laws we pass or make, the guns used in Chicago are illegal guns over 90% are and they are used by criminals !!!! NO law you make pass or whatever are going to obey that law that is why they are criminals it is what they do.
Sick people will do what they do no law will stop one from committing a crime if they have it in their minds to do so because they do not think they are right.... what law will stop anyone who is not committed or was previously committed .... and as it is now committed people can NOT buy a gun.
The second amendment is NOT about hunting or target shooting it is a fail safe for the American people to have the means to take back their Government in the event it become corrupt and tries to do away with the rights guaranteed in the constitution and bill of rights . The founding fathers felt this was as important as any other right and it is there to protect all of us but we as a Nation have grown lazy and uniformed and we have grown reliant on the Government and police force to do everything for us and the world of technology and media just make these sick bastards into stars and martyrs...the only thing that I believe will help this problem is education about guns and people being responsible with guns, other than that please tell me what law can be passed that would stop any one of the last 10 idiots with guns.
also almost every day some with a gun helps or stops someone else from hurting another person with a gun, it happens all the time yet where is that news on the 6.00 o clock report?
When did alcohol or tobacco kill 59 innocent people and injure hundreds of others in ONE incident? And your post makes NO distinction between the right to bear arms (which I support) and the right for a private citizen to own an assault rifle (which I do NOT support).
This may get long but I really want to give you the truth about alcohol and tobacco and guns , dead is dead when someone drinks I am sure they are not thinking of going on a drive and killing people yet it happens now using anti gun thinking we should ban alcohol? right but we all know it will not happen it was tried and failed look up prohibition if you are not informed on it.... Tobacco kills others as well second hand smoke has killed many thousands of people who grew up in smoking homes again it was not done on purpose but still these people are dead yet tobacco still is sold to kill more remember dead is dead.. the method does not really matter how about automobiles?
My point is this we can not always control the things that happen to us and others not matter what laws we pass or make, the guns used in Chicago are illegal guns over 90% are and they are used by criminals !!!! NO law you make pass or whatever are going to obey that law that is why they are criminals it is what they do.
Sick people will do what they do no law will stop one from committing a crime if they have it in their minds to do so because they do not think they are right.... what law will stop anyone who is not committed or was previously committed .... and as it is now committed people can NOT buy a gun.
The second amendment is NOT about hunting or target shooting it is a fail safe for the American people to have the means to take back their Government in the event it become corrupt and tries to do away with the rights guaranteed in the constitution and bill of rights . The founding fathers felt this was as important as any other right and it is there to protect all of us but we as a Nation have grown lazy and uniformed and we have grown reliant on the Government and police force to do everything for us and the world of technology and media just make these sick bastards into stars and martyrs...the only thing that I believe will help this problem is education about guns and people being responsible with guns, other than that please tell me what law can be passed that would stop any one of the last 10 idiots with guns.
also almost every day some with a gun helps or stops someone else from hurting another person with a gun, it happens all the time yet where is that news on the 6.00 o clock report?
http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/25/us/tennessee-church-shooting-hero-trnd/index.html
http://www.davekopel.org/2A/LawRev/american-revolution-against-british-gun-control.html
The second link is about what helped start the Revolutionary war yes GUN CONTROL!
I am more than happy to try and answer anyone's questions as best i can but if you are going to just attack me with no rational facts other than your personal feelings i am out of here and i am sure you don't care but If you want to have a adult conversation I am more than willing...
I always enjoy the guns are needed to take our government back argument. We've had a couple congressmen shot by wackos who I'm sure felt like that was what they were doing. Didn't work out very well for them, and it won't work out any better for anybody else (unless we go back to single shot black power riffles again).
This is kind of the point. Automatics are heavily regulated because they are very dangerous. Semiautomatics are not as heavily regulated, but he purchased a legal device that made it more like an automatic. So why bother regulating Automatics when this device is legal? Oh, the shooter wasn't doing target practice in a crowd of 22,000 people? No sh1t? Existing regulation contradicts itself and it fatally failed hundreds of people.
Calm down before you pop a blood vessel. You ain't getting any younger ya know.
Ah, gotcha, this is the part of the thread where instead of having a conversation you get all passive aggressively chippy. Cool. Fun chat!
This may get long but I really want to give you the truth about alcohol and tobacco and guns , dead is dead when someone drinks I am sure they are not thinking of going on a drive and killing people yet it happens now using anti gun thinking we should ban alcohol? right but we all know it will not happen it was tried and failed look up prohibition if you are not informed on it.... Tobacco kills others as well second hand smoke has killed many thousands of people who grew up in smoking homes again it was not done on purpose but still these people are dead yet tobacco still is sold to kill more remember dead is dead.. the method does not really matter how about automobiles?
My point is this we can not always control the things that happen to us and others not matter what laws we pass or make, the guns used in Chicago are illegal guns over 90% are and they are used by criminals !!!! NO law you make pass or whatever are going to obey that law that is why they are criminals it is what they do.
Sick people will do what they do no law will stop one from committing a crime if they have it in their minds to do so because they do not think they are right.... what law will stop anyone who is not committed or was previously committed .... and as it is now committed people can NOT buy a gun.
The second amendment is NOT about hunting or target shooting it is a fail safe for the American people to have the means to take back their Government in the event it become corrupt and tries to do away with the rights guaranteed in the constitution and bill of rights . The founding fathers felt this was as important as any other right and it is there to protect all of us but we as a Nation have grown lazy and uniformed and we have grown reliant on the Government and police force to do everything for us and the world of technology and media just make these sick bastards into stars and martyrs...the only thing that I believe will help this problem is education about guns and people being responsible with guns, other than that please tell me what law can be passed that would stop any one of the last 10 idiots with guns.
also almost every day some with a gun helps or stops someone else from hurting another person with a gun, it happens all the time yet where is that news on the 6.00 o clock report?
When did alcohol or tobacco kill 59 innocent people and injure hundreds of others in ONE incident? And your post makes NO distinction between the right to bear arms (which I support) and the right for a private citizen to own an assault rifle (which I do NOT support).
What is the point of the second amendment if you are not able to have weapons that will be of use in a fight with the government or any other group or gang or country whatever remember Guns are for law abiding citizens I have no idea what a criminal would do as i am not one.. on alcohol and Tobacco what about trains , airplanes big trucks etc they are caught drinking all the time but that is not the point the point is dead is dead no matter what the cause many things kill people are we going to enact laws against all of them?
"President Trump is visiting Las Vegas on Wednesday, he spoke this morning, said he’s praying for those who lost their lives. You know in February, he also signed a bill that made it easier for people with severe mental illness to buy guns legally," Kimmel said in his monologue. "Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, Speaker of the House Paul Ryan, a number of other lawmakers who won’t do anything about this because the NRA has their balls in a money clip, also sent their thoughts and their prayers today, which is good. They should be praying. They should be praying for God to forgive them for letting the gun lobby run this country, because it's so crazy."
https://www.yahoo.com/gma/jimmy-kimmel-calls-congress-over-inaction-gun-control-090009528--abc-news-topstories.html
[Edited on 10/3/2017 by robslob]OK, I'll bite. Which bill did he sign to let mentally ill people purchase firearms? Links please.
Here you go:
So you're talking about the "Implementation of The NICS Improvement Amendments Act of 2007".
Have you read it, or taking at face value an article with a misleading title?
The act went in opposition of U.S.C. Title 18, Part 1, Chapter 44, Section 922, g, 4.
It would basically call for the Social Security Administration to list as "mentally ill" anyone who needed help with basic things such as balancing a checkbook, instead of reporting those who have been adjudicated by a court of law as being mentally ill. It would have nominally violated the HIPAA rights of disabled recipients, and the 2nd, 5th, and 14th amendment rights of the recipient.
it really would have been the true definition of denying a right without due process.
Those who have been adjudicated by a court as mentally ill were not given the right to purchase and own firearms, so the title is factually false.
for those who may not know it is legal in this country to own machine guns it is NOT legal to make a semi auto gun into a machine gun and to own one legally you have to get finger printed and pass every check there is for about a year and pay a 200 dollar tax to own that weapon you can not lend it or have it out of your possession you want to know how many Americans spend there time and never harm anyone?
When did alcohol or tobacco kill 59 innocent people and injure hundreds of others in ONE incident? And your post makes NO distinction between the right to bear arms (which I support) and the right for a private citizen to own an assault rifle (which I do NOT support).
Who owns an assault rifle?
"President Trump is visiting Las Vegas on Wednesday, he spoke this morning, said he’s praying for those who lost their lives. You know in February, he also signed a bill that made it easier for people with severe mental illness to buy guns legally," Kimmel said in his monologue. "Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, Speaker of the House Paul Ryan, a number of other lawmakers who won’t do anything about this because the NRA has their balls in a money clip, also sent their thoughts and their prayers today, which is good. They should be praying. They should be praying for God to forgive them for letting the gun lobby run this country, because it's so crazy."
https://www.yahoo.com/gma/jimmy-kimmel-calls-congress-over-inaction-gun-control-090009528--abc-news-topstories.html
[Edited on 10/3/2017 by robslob]OK, I'll bite. Which bill did he sign to let mentally ill people purchase firearms? Links please.
Here you go:
So you're talking about the "Implementation of The NICS Improvement Amendments Act of 2007".
Have you read it, or taking at face value an article with a misleading title?The act went in opposition of U.S.C. Title 18, Part 1, Chapter 44, Section 922, g, 4.
It would basically call for the Social Security Administration to list as "mentally ill" anyone who needed help with basic things such as balancing a checkbook, instead of reporting those who have been adjudicated by a court of law as being mentally ill. It would have nominally violated the HIPAA rights of disabled recipients, and the 2nd, 5th, and 14th amendment rights of the recipient.
it really would have been the true definition of denying a right without due process.
Those who have been adjudicated by a court as mentally ill were not given the right to purchase and own firearms, so the title is factually false.
So, you think somebody who doesn't have enough mental capacity to balance a checkbook should have the right to buy guns? Seriously, you care less for the safety of innocent people than you do about guns.
"President Trump is visiting Las Vegas on Wednesday, he spoke this morning, said he’s praying for those who lost their lives. You know in February, he also signed a bill that made it easier for people with severe mental illness to buy guns legally," Kimmel said in his monologue. "Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, Speaker of the House Paul Ryan, a number of other lawmakers who won’t do anything about this because the NRA has their balls in a money clip, also sent their thoughts and their prayers today, which is good. They should be praying. They should be praying for God to forgive them for letting the gun lobby run this country, because it's so crazy."
https://www.yahoo.com/gma/jimmy-kimmel-calls-congress-over-inaction-gun-control-090009528--abc-news-topstories.html
[Edited on 10/3/2017 by robslob]OK, I'll bite. Which bill did he sign to let mentally ill people purchase firearms? Links please.
Here you go:
So you're talking about the "Implementation of The NICS Improvement Amendments Act of 2007".
Have you read it, or taking at face value an article with a misleading title?The act went in opposition of U.S.C. Title 18, Part 1, Chapter 44, Section 922, g, 4.
It would basically call for the Social Security Administration to list as "mentally ill" anyone who needed help with basic things such as balancing a checkbook, instead of reporting those who have been adjudicated by a court of law as being mentally ill. It would have nominally violated the HIPAA rights of disabled recipients, and the 2nd, 5th, and 14th amendment rights of the recipient.
it really would have been the true definition of denying a right without due process.
Those who have been adjudicated by a court as mentally ill were not given the right to purchase and own firearms, so the title is factually false.So, you think somebody who doesn't have enough mental capacity to balance a checkbook should have the right to buy guns? Seriously, you care less for the safety of innocent people than you do about guns.
Good response there. There are plenty of people out there who can't do some things that we take for granted, or think as menial tasks, but are not mentally ill. Are you for labeling people mentally ill and denying them a constitutional right because they can't balance a checkbook without going through due process?
"President Trump is visiting Las Vegas on Wednesday, he spoke this morning, said he’s praying for those who lost their lives. You know in February, he also signed a bill that made it easier for people with severe mental illness to buy guns legally," Kimmel said in his monologue. "Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, Speaker of the House Paul Ryan, a number of other lawmakers who won’t do anything about this because the NRA has their balls in a money clip, also sent their thoughts and their prayers today, which is good. They should be praying. They should be praying for God to forgive them for letting the gun lobby run this country, because it's so crazy."
https://www.yahoo.com/gma/jimmy-kimmel-calls-congress-over-inaction-gun-control-090009528--abc-news-topstories.html
[Edited on 10/3/2017 by robslob]OK, I'll bite. Which bill did he sign to let mentally ill people purchase firearms? Links please.
Here you go:
So you're talking about the "Implementation of The NICS Improvement Amendments Act of 2007".
Have you read it, or taking at face value an article with a misleading title?The act went in opposition of U.S.C. Title 18, Part 1, Chapter 44, Section 922, g, 4.
It would basically call for the Social Security Administration to list as "mentally ill" anyone who needed help with basic things such as balancing a checkbook, instead of reporting those who have been adjudicated by a court of law as being mentally ill. It would have nominally violated the HIPAA rights of disabled recipients, and the 2nd, 5th, and 14th amendment rights of the recipient.
it really would have been the true definition of denying a right without due process.
Those who have been adjudicated by a court as mentally ill were not given the right to purchase and own firearms, so the title is factually false.So, you think somebody who doesn't have enough mental capacity to balance a checkbook should have the right to buy guns? Seriously, you care less for the safety of innocent people than you do about guns.
Good response there. There are plenty of people out there who can't do some things that we take for granted, or think as menial tasks, but are not mentally ill. Are you for labeling people mentally ill and denying them a constitutional right because they can't balance a checkbook without going through due process?
I'm saying we shouldn't allow them deadly weapons unless they can prove they are mentally competent. The world is dangerous enough withour crazy people having guns.
Let's see Jimmy start saying that Liberal Hollywood and Silicon Valley should stop glamourizing violence.
Let's see Jimmy start saying that Liberal Hollywood and Silicon Valley should stop glamourizing violence.
Oh you are good very good..... 
"President Trump is visiting Las Vegas on Wednesday, he spoke this morning, said he’s praying for those who lost their lives. You know in February, he also signed a bill that made it easier for people with severe mental illness to buy guns legally," Kimmel said in his monologue. "Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, Speaker of the House Paul Ryan, a number of other lawmakers who won’t do anything about this because the NRA has their balls in a money clip, also sent their thoughts and their prayers today, which is good. They should be praying. They should be praying for God to forgive them for letting the gun lobby run this country, because it's so crazy."
https://www.yahoo.com/gma/jimmy-kimmel-calls-congress-over-inaction-gun-control-090009528--abc-news-topstories.html
[Edited on 10/3/2017 by robslob]OK, I'll bite. Which bill did he sign to let mentally ill people purchase firearms? Links please.
Here you go:
So you're talking about the "Implementation of The NICS Improvement Amendments Act of 2007".
Have you read it, or taking at face value an article with a misleading title?The act went in opposition of U.S.C. Title 18, Part 1, Chapter 44, Section 922, g, 4.
It would basically call for the Social Security Administration to list as "mentally ill" anyone who needed help with basic things such as balancing a checkbook, instead of reporting those who have been adjudicated by a court of law as being mentally ill. It would have nominally violated the HIPAA rights of disabled recipients, and the 2nd, 5th, and 14th amendment rights of the recipient.
it really would have been the true definition of denying a right without due process.
Those who have been adjudicated by a court as mentally ill were not given the right to purchase and own firearms, so the title is factually false.So, you think somebody who doesn't have enough mental capacity to balance a checkbook should have the right to buy guns? Seriously, you care less for the safety of innocent people than you do about guns.
Good response there. There are plenty of people out there who can't do some things that we take for granted, or think as menial tasks, but are not mentally ill. Are you for labeling people mentally ill and denying them a constitutional right because they can't balance a checkbook without going through due process?
I'm saying we shouldn't allow them deadly weapons unless they can prove they are mentally competent. The world is dangerous enough withour crazy people having guns.
So you approve not having rights until you can prove mental competency?
So you approve not having rights until you can prove mental competency?
Not having rights? How about not having a gun until you can prove you can deconstruct and assemble your weapon of choice, demonstrate shooting and safety compliance, and pass the same psychological exams our police force use on recruits to test for this very thing. Surely that would decrease some deaths, if even the accidental ones, and only lets our finest men and women have the easiest of access to whatever it is they please. The ones who struggle with the aforementioned measurements can still excercise their 2nd amendment right, once they step up and prove themselves worthy of operating one of the greatest and most powerful tools ever. To disrespect some sort of testing is to disrespect all of our biggest cities' police forces who rely on them to protect and serve.
So you approve not having rights until you can prove mental competency?
Not having rights? How about not having a gun until you can prove you can deconstruct and assemble your weapon of choice, demonstrate shooting and safety compliance, and pass the same psychological exams our police force use on recruits to test for this very thing. Surely that would decrease some deaths, if even the accidental ones, and only lets our finest men and women have the easiest of access to whatever it is they please. The ones who struggle with the aforementioned measurements can still excercise their 2nd amendment right, once they step up and prove themselves worthy of operating one of the greatest and most powerful tools ever. To disrespect some sort of testing is to disrespect all of our biggest cities' police forces who rely on them to protect and serve.
None of that is in the Constitution. Nope, I checked. Nothing about efficiency, mental stability, background checks. Nothing. How dare you think that common sense is more important than owning an arsenal.
The people that say, "you will never be able to prevent someone who snapped from hurting people," are exactly right. HOWEVER, why then do we leave the most common and simple way of doing that on a large scale so easily accessible?
Almost anybody can figure out how to point a gun and squeeze the trigger (it's just like a video game). Not that many (in a fit of mental insanity, especially) can go through all the steps of building a successful bomb on a truck.
But, if someone flips out and they already own multiple machine guns, it is pretty easy to go out and hurt a lot of people.
We have had bombings, but we do not have an epidemic of bombings. We have had car attacks, but we do not have an epidemic of car attacks. It is hard to hurt 600 people in an acid attack. It is hard to hurt 600 people in a knife attack. It would be hard to hurt 600 people by throwing hammers out of a 32nd story window before the cops can kill you. There a very few ways to do this much damage while you are committing suicide without machine guns.
Reasonable gun policy is not the "beginning of confiscating all guns" anymore than security checks at airports is the end of airplanes. It is simply doing something to address a deadly problem, INSTEAD OF DOING NOTHING.
There is a constitutional right to "bear arms" and we can continue to debate what was meant by that, but suggesting that James Madison was talking about machine guns is pretty flimsy.
Giving up something that you enjoy for the betterment of society is called civilization...
What machine guns are you talking about? If he had some then he had either gone through almost a year of multiple background checks, license checks, fees, fingerprinting, and very costly transfer fees.
Misinformation is one thing that goes rampant after an incident like this. There have been no reports of machine guns being used. There are reports of an aftermarket item called a SlideFire. This effectively makes the rifle push forward against your finger with forward recoil from the stock. The rifle can then be fired at it's cyclic rate, if you practice with it for a while. It does not make the rifle a machine gun or an assault rifle. To me, it's just a way to burn through ammo. It's not effective of putting rounds on target, but it does help you spend more money on ammo.
The shooter was from 900 to 1200 feet away from where the bullets hit, he wasn't aiming at anyone in particular, just doing a "spray and pray" in my opinion.
Now, for a question. did the Founding Fathers set up the 1st Amendment for TV, Radio, Movies, DVD, CD, VHS, cassette, photography, internet, or for Facebook, Snap-chat, Google, Instagram, and other social media venues? It's about your comment on James Madison.
Look, you know what I meant when I said "machine gun". I don't care if I am technically correct or not. I do not care to know about the differences between classes of guns other than ones that are used for reasonable purposes and ones used to commit mass murder or make some loser feel like he has more power than his little ego tells him everyday. I am talking about guns that some P.O.S. can use to shoot 600 people in a matter of a few minutes. I don't care how they were modified or any of the other stuff that doesn't have any relevance to the innocent dead and injured people.
And... No, I don't think James Madison was talking about VHS or DVD or anything else we use without harming people today. HOWEVER, I doubt he was talking about child pornography either, yet that has since been correctly banned to protect innocent lives.
The people that say, "you will never be able to prevent someone who snapped from hurting people," are exactly right. HOWEVER, why then do we leave the most common and simple way of doing that on a large scale so easily accessible?
Almost anybody can figure out how to point a gun and squeeze the trigger (it's just like a video game). Not that many (in a fit of mental insanity, especially) can go through all the steps of building a successful bomb on a truck.
But, if someone flips out and they already own multiple machine guns, it is pretty easy to go out and hurt a lot of people.
We have had bombings, but we do not have an epidemic of bombings. We have had car attacks, but we do not have an epidemic of car attacks. It is hard to hurt 600 people in an acid attack. It is hard to hurt 600 people in a knife attack. It would be hard to hurt 600 people by throwing hammers out of a 32nd story window before the cops can kill you. There a very few ways to do this much damage while you are committing suicide without machine guns.
Reasonable gun policy is not the "beginning of confiscating all guns" anymore than security checks at airports is the end of airplanes. It is simply doing something to address a deadly problem, INSTEAD OF DOING NOTHING.
There is a constitutional right to "bear arms" and we can continue to debate what was meant by that, but suggesting that James Madison was talking about machine guns is pretty flimsy.
Giving up something that you enjoy for the betterment of society is called civilization...
What machine guns are you talking about? If he had some then he had either gone through almost a year of multiple background checks, license checks, fees, fingerprinting, and very costly transfer fees.
Misinformation is one thing that goes rampant after an incident like this. There have been no reports of machine guns being used. There are reports of an aftermarket item called a SlideFire. This effectively makes the rifle push forward against your finger with forward recoil from the stock. The rifle can then be fired at it's cyclic rate, if you practice with it for a while. It does not make the rifle a machine gun or an assault rifle. To me, it's just a way to burn through ammo. It's not effective of putting rounds on target, but it does help you spend more money on ammo.
The shooter was from 900 to 1200 feet away from where the bullets hit, he wasn't aiming at anyone in particular, just doing a "spray and pray" in my opinion.
Now, for a question. did the Founding Fathers set up the 1st Amendment for TV, Radio, Movies, DVD, CD, VHS, cassette, photography, internet, or for Facebook, Snap-chat, Google, Instagram, and other social media venues? It's about your comment on James Madison.
Look, you know what I meant when I said "machine gun". I don't care if I am technically correct or not. I do not care to know about the differences between classes of guns other than ones that are used for reasonable purposes and ones used to commit mass murder or make some loser feel like he has more power than his little ego tells him everyday. I am talking about guns that some P.O.S. can use to shoot 600 people in a matter of a few minutes. I don't care how they were modified or any of the other stuff that doesn't have any relevance to the innocent dead and injured people.
And... No, I don't think James Madison was talking about VHS or DVD or anything else we use without harming people today. HOWEVER, I doubt he was talking about child pornography either, yet that has since been correctly banned to protect innocent lives.
They avoid addressing the topic by playing word games...Our legislators have made it clear that the right to own assault weapons is greater than the right to the safety of our children and all innocent people....Their actions speak loudly or in this case inaction....
"New York v. Ferber, 458 U.S. 747 (1982), is a precedential decision given by the United States Supreme Court, which ruled unanimously that the First Amendment right to free speech did not forbid states from banning the sale of material depicting children engaged in sexual activity, even if the material was not obscene.[1]"
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That's just quickly from wikipedia, but as you can see, people use the Bill Of Rights to argue in favor of some really bad stuff. But, anything can be regulated to protect innocent people............even if some other American enjoys it.
Assault weapon what does it mean? does it mean a gun that is black and scary looking? does it mean a weapon used in war? I think the later so, if that is the criteria then lets have a adult look at war weapons lets start with the Brown Bess a single shot flintlock muzzle loader used in the revolutionary war it at that time was a assault weapon, but it was also used and adapted to civilian use, just like the lever action Winchester, and the WW! Mauser, bolt action that has become the most used action in gun history, then also the M1Garand a semi auto that has been copied and adapted to civilian use and now it is the AK 47 and the M16 adapted as the AR15 for civilian use. You see they were all assault weapons at one time or another the only difference is they are in your generation and most of you know nothing about them and hence you think they are scary.
They are just improvements over the last weapon used by the military, now they are made of plastic and Aluminum and are anodized instead of wood that breaks and swells when wet and get beat all to hell and they no longer rust, and they are modular you can make one fit anyone so even kids learning about guns can shoot them, you see they are vastly superior to the old steel and wood guns and they are just the next evolution in hunting and target weapons adapted from the military....
Assault weapon what does it mean? does it mean a gun that is black and scary looking? does it mean a weapon used in war? I think the later so, if that is the criteria then lets have a adult look at war weapons lets start with the Brown Bess a single shot flintlock muzzle loader used in the revolutionary war it at that time was a assault weapon, but it was also used and adapted to civilian use, just like the lever action Winchester, and the WW! Mauser, bolt action that has become the most used action in gun history, then also the M1Garand a semi auto that has been copied and adapted to civilian use and now it is the AK 47 and the M16 adapted as the AR15 for civilian use. You see they were all assault weapons at one time or another the only difference is they are in your generation and most of you know nothing about them and hence you think they are scary.
They are just improvements over the last weapon used by the military, now they are made of plastic and Aluminum and are anodized instead of wood that breaks and swells when wet and get beat all to hell and they no longer rust, and they are modular you can make one fit anyone so even kids learning about guns can shoot them, you see they are vastly superior to the old steel and wood guns and they are just the next evolution in hunting and target weapons adapted from the military....
More thumb violins music coming....rhetoric.....Why can't I have a tank??? or a bazooka or an anti aircraft gun...that's just an improvement on the musket??? how far was a musket accurate??? could it kill from 500 yards away and mow down 500+ people from one shooter?? without reloading after every shot...did a musket have belts drums and magazines full of high caliber projectiles???
No....we regulate many things within our amendments...like ya can't yell fire when there isn't one
We can't buy tanks or bazookas or anti-aircraft guns...or cannons...they're all improvements on the musket
I'm fine with assault weapons put in the same category as tanks, bazookas and anti-aircraft guns...because that is what they are intended for
[Edited on 10/5/2017 by goldtop]
Rydethewind, are you against people having to demonstrate complete responsible operation of a firearm before exercising their 2nd amendment right, and what are your thoughts on our police forces subjecting recruits to psychological evaluations prior to hire?
