I doubt he is taking it. Just a distraction.

He's been obsessed about it for a while now. He desperately wants to prove he's smarter than all the medical experts OR someone in his family has stock in the maker OR he's tested positive. After 3 WH staffers tested positive, I don't believe any test results coming from there.

From media reports, it's not given outside a hospital or a clinical trial except to malaria & lupus patients. There are 1st responders who have COVID19 who are part of clinical trials to see if it's an effective treatment. It's already proven to be ineffective as prevention. Worse, it causes cardiac problems (& death) if someone already has a cardiac condition like Trump does. He didn't actually say his doctor prescribed it.

It's a helluva distraction if he's really taking it. Of course, he could be washing it down w/bleach...

He didn't actually say his doctor prescribed it.

There was a statement released by the WH doc that was very carefully worded. My guess is that IF Trump IS TAKING and just not another lie or distraction, then Dr. Trump more than likely told the doc what to say in the released statement. See below:

"After numerous discussions he and I had regarding the evidence for and against the use of hydroxychloroquine, we concluded the potential benefit from treatment outweighed the relative risks," physician Sean Connely said.

All of the the legit doctors that I've seen interviewed after this announcemnet criticized this and spoke of the significant dangers. But hey, Dr. Trump knows best.

My concerns are not for Trump because he's going to say or do what he wants to advance a narrative. The concern is more for cult followers or those who would follow the leader walking the plank into shark infested waters.

President Plump knows best!

If the war hero said he was taking it, that means he hasn't taken it. Everything that comes out of his mouth, means the opposite.

There was a statement released by the WH doc that was very carefully worded. My guess is that IF Trump IS TAKING and just not another lie or distraction, then Dr. Trump more than likely told the doc what to say in the released statement. See below:

"After numerous discussions he and I had regarding the evidence for and against the use of hydroxychloroquine, we concluded the potential benefit from treatment outweighed the relative risks," physician Sean Connely said.

All of the the legit doctors that I've seen interviewed after this announcemnet criticized this and spoke of the significant dangers. But hey, Dr. Trump knows best.

My concerns are not for Trump because he's going to say or do what he wants to advance a narrative. The concern is more for cult followers or those who would follow the leader walking the plank into shark infested waters.

In that same statement the doctor also says this is a direct result of Trump's valet testing positive so Trump must not believe COVID19 isn't dangerous or is "like the flu." He's scared.

I'm stunned that a doctor would prescribe it to a man who is over 60, obese, has a pre-existing heart condition, & has been exposed to COVID19. Of course, his doctor is in the navy & Trump is CIC.

Agreed that the message "what's the harm?" is false. Studies have proven it's harmful/fatal when used except as intended. Trump's disciples will do whatever he says. The good news is that they have to have a doctor's prescription so there's a barrier that Trump doesn't have. The bad news is that there was a shortage of the drug for lupus patients when Trump was touting it in March. He & his TV Dr. Oz stopped talking about it when the first reports of deaths & halted trials were released a few weeks ago.

I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but I don't trust this WH to tell the truth about staff testing after 3 staffers were positive. Should anyone test positive it will be announced that person was "working from home" if the results are made public at all.

It's not a distraction, it is just standard operating procedure. Even when there is some good news that Trump should let ride, he steps all over it with some tweet or bonehead comment.

Trump is just doubling down. He's never wrong, he never backs down. This is just him proving that he is right and everyone else is wrong. Only he knows what is best. It's Trump being Trump doing what Trump does saying what Trump says. It is all very normal for this President.

There are soooo many studies and trials still ongoing for the prevention and treatment of this drug related to covid19. NIH's website lists 197 studies for hydroxychloroquine for covid19. Almost 200! To say based on a handful of studies it does this or that or doesn't do this or that is all premature.

Every drug has a laundry list of side effects and precautions. And really, this is what we do in society now. We are inundated with commercials and advertising for prescription drugs, for supplements, for treatments for one ailment, disease, irritation, diagnosis, whatever - we are told "hey this can help you" so immediately people think they know something about their condition and are like "why hasn't my doctor mentioned this?". "Why am I hearing about this for me on TV instead of my doctor's office". The patient thinks they know more than the doctor. Doctors should be recommending drugs to their patients, but that isn't how we are trained now. And if every doctor is an expert, why do people get second or third opinions?

Trump's touting of hydroxychloroquine is a product of where our society is. The patients are empowered to figure out what might work for them first and ask the doctors second. Coupled with word of mouth and anecdotal stories of so-and-so took it and it worked or my friend's cousin's aunt's co-worker's brother took it and saved his life.

Sure some people still look towards the "experts" to tell them what to do and how to do it. But what about when the experts don't all agree, or all the data isn't in to really say one way or the other. Or what about variables that make a study unreliable to apply to other conditions with different variables.

Trump is just another advertisement for another drug for another problem that is so common these days. To me it doesn't mean anything else than any of the throw away ads we see all day long. But Trump sure does love himself some hydroxychloroquine. Wish I watched Laura Ingram last night, she loves herself some hydroxychloroquine too. Her and her medical cabinet.

There are soooo many studies and trials still ongoing for the prevention and treatment of this drug related to covid19. NIH's website lists 197 studies for hydroxychloroquine for covid19. Almost 200! To say based on a handful of studies it does this or that or doesn't do this or that is all premature.

Yes, big pharma buys a lot of TV ads.

This is different because Trump - who has a devoted disciples who believe everything he says - is putting people at risk. Most everyone knows not to drink bleach when he proposed that but the 2 leading manufacturers re-designed their packaging w/large warning labels not to ingest it. They know Trump's America's #1 Influencer.

It's not too soon to say things about a drug. Clinical trials don't just happen in the US funded by NIH. They're conducted throughout the world, funded privately, & guess what - negative findings or lethal drug trials don't get published. Trump himself latched on to a French article (not a clinical trial) about 20 people - 4 of whom died or stopped taking the drug combination because of side effects. That summary was about a drug cocktail of which one ingredient was hydrochloroquine.

Doctors conducting proper trials in France, Brazil, & Sweden as well as the US have all published reports that the drug is dangerous & sometimes fatal to people w/heart conditions when used as a prophylaxis as Trump says he's doing. Cardiologists all over the world are refusing to prescribe it. So why argue that it's too soon to draw a conclusion?

Do we know how many people drank bleach after Trump talked about it? No, but we know poison control centers were overwhelmed w/calls. Do we know whether hydrochloroquine by itself might work as a treatment? Not yet; it may work on people who already have COVID19. What we do know is that it doesn't work as a prophylaxis & can cause death.

Having a lying president saying "there's no harm" to his disciples is beyond irresponsible. It's Trump saying "give it a try just like I am." He's a conman. A huckster. Remember, TRUMP HAS BEEN EXPOSED. Not all of his disciples have. The only thing that saves his disciples is that doctors - fearing malpractice & wrongful death litigation - won't prescribe it.

Should Trump develop any cardiac symptoms & stop taking the drug, he's not going to announce it. What people will remember is that he touted it & took it himself.

If there was ever a time for the 25th amendment, it's now. The man is off the rails.

There are soooo many studies and trials still ongoing for the prevention and treatment of this drug related to covid19. NIH's website lists 197 studies for hydroxychloroquine for covid19. Almost 200! To say based on a handful of studies it does this or that or doesn't do this or that is all premature.

Yes, big pharma buys a lot of TV ads.

This is different because Trump - who has a devoted disciples who believe everything he says - is putting people at risk. Most everyone knows not to drink bleach when he proposed that but the 2 leading manufacturers re-designed their packaging w/large warning labels not to ingest it. They know Trump's America's #1 Influencer.

It's not too soon to say things about a drug. Clinical trials don't just happen in the US funded by NIH. They're conducted throughout the world, funded privately, & guess what - negative findings or lethal drug trials don't get published. Trump himself latched on to a French article (not a clinical trial) about 20 people - 4 of whom died or stopped taking the drug combination because of side effects. That summary was about a drug cocktail of which one ingredient was hydrochloroquine.

Doctors conducting proper trials in France, Brazil, & Sweden as well as the US have all published reports that the drug is dangerous & sometimes fatal to people w/heart conditions when used as a prophylaxis as Trump says he's doing. Cardiologists all over the world are refusing to prescribe it. So why argue that it's too soon to draw a conclusion?

Do we know how many people drank bleach after Trump talked about it? No, but we know poison control centers were overwhelmed w/calls. Do we know whether hydrochloroquine by itself might work as a treatment? Not yet; it may work on people who already have COVID19. What we do know is that it doesn't work as a prophylaxis & can cause death.

Having a lying president saying "there's no harm" to his disciples is beyond irresponsible. It's Trump saying "give it a try just like I am." He's a conman. A huckster. Remember, TRUMP HAS BEEN EXPOSED. Not all of his disciples have. The only thing that saves his disciples is that doctors - fearing malpractice & wrongful death litigation - won't prescribe it.

Should Trump develop any cardiac symptoms & stop taking the drug, he's not going to announce it. What people will remember is that he touted it & took it himself.

If there was ever a time for the 25th amendment, it's now. The man is off the rails.

Great post, cyclone. Full of good info & to the point!

It's bullish!t. He's not taking it.

I think he is taking it. He really believes it works. I don't think it works, the virus was designed like Sars with some HIV1 material tweaked into it. There is no malaria in it.

Yesterday over on State Run TV, even Neil Cavuto argued against Dr. Trump's assertions. You know something is going badly for Trump when FOX TV counters his position and advises against it.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1262484050964631557

I think he is taking it. He really believes it works. I don't think it works, the virus was designed like Sars with some HIV1 material tweaked into it. There is no malaria in it.

After all these years - a post from Gina I can agree with.

If you look at Trump's behavior in the last couple weeks, he's even more unhinged than previoulsy. I'm convinced it's his cocktail of hydrochloroquine and the ajax he injected into himself. The racoon look around his eyes is gone, but that behavior...off the charts. Can only imagine what surprise he gifts us tomorrow.

Yesterday over on State Run TV, even Neil Cavuto argued against Dr. Trump's assertions. You know something is going badly for Trump when FOX TV counters his position and advises against it.
https://twitter.com/i/status/1262484050964631557/blockquote >

"Based on the VA study of a vulnerable population hospitalized with the disease, they died. THIS WILL KILL YOU." Can't get any stronger than that.

I think Cavuto made this particularly strong statement to counteract Trump saying it's harmless. It's dangerous to a public taking it as a prophylaxis because their idol Trump does. Trump has the benefit of 24/7 monitoring. It's alarming not only to the American public, US health professionals, but foreign leaders as well. No one is wild about POTUS taking an extremely risky drug.

Agree w/Gina that he's taking it & not just saying he is. He was shocked that his valet tested positive & insisted on getting this drug knowing he'd been exposed to COVID19. The second he shows any cardiac problems, his doctor will discontinue it & the public won't be told.

I'm mystified as to why he's fixated on this particular drug other than someone convinced him it's a miracle drug & he wants to prove he's smarter than all the doctors when it works. He believes his own hype. It doesn't seem to occur to him that it might not work & he could end up on a vent in ICU. Hubris.

 

If you look at Trump's behavior in the last couple weeks, he's even more unhinged than previoulsy. I'm convinced it's his cocktail of hydrochloroquine and the ajax he injected into himself. The racoon look around his eyes is gone, but that behavior...off the charts. Can only imagine what surprise he gifts us tomorrow.

The scary part is that hallucinations & confusion are symptoms of the virus AND side effects of the drug. Other drug side effects include paranoia & agitation. How can anyone tell if it's the normal Trump or a drug effect since he exhibits 3 of the 4 all the time? I also think he sounds more hoarse than usual & his voice has gone up about 1/2 an octave - signs of a respiratory illness, but I don't pretend to be a doctor.

At least Pence isn't taking it. Still, he chair the NASA meeting today & not a single person in the room wore a mask.

What we do know is that it doesn't work as a prophylaxis & can cause death.

There trials ongoing for hydroxychloroquine as prophylaxis (Henry Ford Health Detroit, Perelman School of Medicine University Pennsylvania, Hospital Clinic of Barcelona, Tunisia military health professionals are the ones that showed up on page 1 of a google search, I assume there are more listed on additional pages).

Has there been some trials already completed revealing it didn't work as a preventative?

Regarding Cavuto, he's the best thing Fox News has going. I have always said for years now that the 4:00 hour on Fox is pretty good subjective news from Neil. Many also liked Shep at 3, but Neil at 4 has always been a favorite of mine. He's not a lock-step Republican spokesperson.

Cavutos show is a milque-toast business recap and rarely offers a politcal side or agenda. Its a corporate talking head like a corporate HR department head explaining the days events being careful to not upset the people who pay his salary.

Jury still out?

The more you look the more you see active trials to study prophylaxis:

From the existing data, which need validation in a trial, it looks like hydroxychloroquine could be a good agent for prophylaxis. It actually blocks the entry of the virus into the cell, so the hypothesis makes a lot of sense: if you have the drug in your system and you get exposed, you won’t let the virus get into your cells and you won’t get onset of disease. That is what the trials are aimed at showing.
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The second study is investigating pre-exposure prophylaxis, just like what we do for HIV — the equivalent of PrEP but for coronavirus. This would be for highly at-risk individuals: front-line healthcare workers, first responders and others who work in situations where they’re coming in contact with people.

This trial will be done by the University of Oxford and is being funded by Wellcome through the Accelerator. It will be a much longer study — two years.

https://www.gatesfoundation.org/TheOptimist/Articles/coronavirus-interview-trevor-mundel-drug-trials

There trials ongoing for hydroxychloroquine as prophylaxis (Henry Ford Health Detroit, Perelman School of Medicine University Pennsylvania, Hospital Clinic of Barcelona, Tunisia military health professionals are the ones that showed up on page 1 of a google search, I assume there are more listed on additional pages).

Has there been some trials already completed revealing it didn't work as a preventative?

You're missing the point that the drug KILLS people when used for something other than malaria & lupus. Trials ARE HALTED when lethal side effects are significant & a high number of patients die.

Otherwise, human drug trials take years - 18 to 24 months at least. I know, I've run them for 20 years. Hydroxychlorquine trials have been HALTED because patients developed life-threatening cardiac problems. The largest were in Brazil. Reports of deadly cardiac side effects were published in both The Lancet & JAMA in April 2020. On 4/22, Dr. Bright was fired for daring to say the Trump administration was pushing pursuit of hydroxychloroquine - as a vaccine, prophylaxis, treatment - rather than other drugs w/preliminary findings that were far more promising & he refused.

Perhaps you should read Dr. Bright's testimony to the Senate committee earlier in the week for further enlightenment. I don't understand your persistence in proving that hydroxychloroquine is really Trump's "miracle drug." You don't have to wait for trials to be finished to know that when a drug is killing patients when used for something other than its intended use & it's not something to spend $ on when there are drugs w/preliminary findings are effective & aren't killing anyone. Worse, Trump has the cardiac condition that hydroxychlorquine causes & exacerbates until it kills patients. Do you need a study to understand that's not a great idea for the POTUS? Especially one that already has 2 strikes against him - age & obesity?

nebish, you're smarter than this. There is absolutely nothing other than Trump's "good feeling" that indicates this drug is effective for COVID19 in any way & there is science that says it can be fatal when used off-label.

Cavutos show is a milque-toast business recap and rarely offers a politcal side or agenda.

Some might call that....news.

Yes, some drugs can kill people. I am aware of warnings and side effects. Hydroxychloroquine is not the first or only prescription drug that might have a lethal effect on a person taking said drug as prescribed or off label.

Some trials may have been stopped. Some trials are on going. Or have all the preventative studies been halted and I missed that? If the other trials have not been halted, why haven't they if the drug is so deadly? People dying when using this drug as a prophylactic, why would any other trials still be ongoing then, why haven't all the trials been stopped, are you saying they have?

The only thing I am interested in doing is stating that not all the facts are in on the use of this drug. Trump can take it, Trump can not take it. Trump can lie about taking it. My position and postings has nothing to do with Trump. It might work, it might not work. Some people might die, it might help some people. Some people might have died without it, some people might have only died due to taking it.

You can take the information to date as the be all end all, I take a more open look that more information and data is yet to come. I didn't say any results would be in tomorrow or next week or next month. I'm just trying to say that more results on the effectiveness of this drug for different uses are yet to come. I don't know what they will all yield. I don't think anyone should suggest they know what all the results of the pending trials will yield, good, bad or indifferent.

You mentioned The Lancet, this article from April 17 states it might have some prophylaxis use, they suggest studies:

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(20)30296-6/fulltext

When questioned about hydrochloriquine for details, his response was he's been "hearing really good things". He makes these genralizations all the time. Who knows if there is any truth to his paint brush strokes. By all means - "hearing really good things" is a great reason for Dr. Trump to take the drug and try to sell the public.

I am reminded of the comedic line, "the operation was a success but the patient died". Hydrochloriquine just might kill ya - but then you won't get the virus. I can see where some might declare victory.

You can take the information to date as the be all end all, I take a more open look that more information and data is yet to come. I didn't say any results would be in tomorrow or next week or next month. I'm just trying to say that more results on the effectiveness of this drug for different uses are yet to come. I don't know what they will all yield. I don't think anyone should suggest they know what all the results of the pending trials will yield, good, bad or indifferent.

As professional who works in this field, I consider data we know to date. Hydroxychlorquine has not proven effective as anything vis a vis COVID19 but it has definitely been reported to cause cardiac problems & fatalities. Fact. It is a high risk thing for Trump as POTUS to do. First & foremost, it is dangerous to his health. Further, his use of it despite all medical evidence to the contrary confuses the American public & unsettles other world leaders. Between that & his bleach comment, he sounds irresponsible at best & unhinged at worst.

I can't speak to every study you find on google, but I can say there are federal laws that govern human research trials from funding to informed consent by the participants to ethical guidelines to liability to oversight to factors that must be reported & when a trial must be ended. There are equivalents in most other countries. Heads roll when a non-starter is allowed to continue past the checkpoint of likelihood of success.

The most important research issues for COVID19 are a vaccine, antibody tests, & treatment(s). Right now, we have nothing - no more than when this started. We're on a tight timeframe. The logical thing to do is follow the courses that are the most promising.

You state the obvious that in the future, vaccines & drugs may be developed that address COVID19. Or there may not; there still isn't a vaccine for HIV even though there is a non-lethal prophylaxis that is sometimes effective. Obviously, researchers & drug manufacturers make their living study prevention & treatments for every disease on the planet. What's your point? You're not going to say you don't know the results of every trial for every drug in the world? Has anyone ask you to do so? No one else - especially those who allocate resources to researchers - should rank probabilities of success for COVDI19 as of today when decisions have to be made?

Intentionally or not, you sound like a Trump apologist.

You said:

What we do know is that it doesn't work as a prophylaxis

I'm saying we don't know.

How do you know so confidently to put it in bold?

When questioned about hydrochloriquine for details, his response was he's been "hearing really good things". He makes these genralizations all the time. Who knows if there is any truth to his paint brush strokes. By all means - "hearing really good things" is a great reason for Dr. Trump to take the drug and try to sell the public.

Yes, he's been saying "hearing really good things" since he read the French anecdotes about 20 people which the doctor who wrote it has said has no scientific value. It was really more a journal of his patients. The other favorite line is "I've got a really good feeling."

He's been exposed. Maybe he genuinely believes in the drug & is willing to risk making his heart condition worse. I still think he or one of his handlers has a stake in the manufacturer. Trump doesn't do anything that doesn't feed his ego or offshore bank account.

You said:

What we do know is that it doesn't work as a prophylaxis

I'm saying we don't know.

How do you know so confidently to put it in bold?

This is getting tiresome & insulting.

Rusty answered your question - it worked but it killed the patient.