Re: They should just move.
Re: If they try to sell it is now their fault they can't... .Donna has legal issues. I would be mad if I paid Florida taxes and prosecution time and jail cost were wasted on an intoxicated unloaded gun situation. ...
How would anybody know that a gun aimed in their direction was unloaded? I am reminded of Keith Richard's comments following the Altamont incident. The guy who got fatally stabbed was waiving a pistol at one of the Hell's Angels. A reporter pointed out to Keef that the gun wasn't loaded. "Tell it to Wild Bill Hickok!", said Richards.
I would be mad if I paid Florida taxes and prosecution time and jail cost were wasted on an intoxicated unloaded gun situation. When the murder, rapes, child crimes, gangs are all resolved, then I say go after the rowdy senior citizens.
Gang members and murderers take note: an AARP card is also a license to wave a gun at kids. Got it.
Have you seen COPS? Arresting and prosecuting people with guns is kind of why they are patrolling the streets. Sorry, but we don't get to pick and choose who gets prosecuted for pointing a gun at people based on age and social status. Typically they throw as many counts at a person with a gun just to get them off of the street, but I imagine she will plead out and there won't be a trial.
Maybe Miss Donna should shoot first and claim she was standing her ground! It is Florida after all.
From this article:
http://wfla.com/2017/03/29/wife-of-singer-dickey-betts-has-history-of-disrupting-events-with-guns/
"Christine Johnson, the president of the Conservation Foundation of the Gulf Coast said it hasn’t always been this way.
“In the early years we worked with the Betts, they approved [our] dock, we have signature off on the dock even though we didn’t have to receive it from them. They went and testified for our existence to be here when we were going to the county to purchase this piece of property, so I can’t explain how things have deteriorated,” said Johnson."
Maybe the Betts were promised it would be a much more low key activity center....
I like how some twist points.... the point was proportionality to bigger crimes, not 'IT was OK" good grief..... did it traumatize some kids? I wasn't there, but sure it was bad, and it probably did to some degree. There should be accountability. But nobody got hurt and there are violent physical crimes against people all around us that warrant bigger accountability than this will likely get.
I like how some twist points.... the point was proportionality to bigger crimes, not 'IT was OK" good grief..... did it traumatize some kids? I wasn't there, but sure it was bad, and it probably did to some degree. There should be accountability. But nobody got hurt and there are violent physical crimes against people all around us that warrant bigger accountability than this will likely get.
It's only a bigger deal in the media because it's a local famous person's wife. It's not like they sent in the SWAT team and diverted resources. She'll post bond. I'm not sure how much less you think should have been done. You point a gun at kids you become a pretty big issue, I'm not sure why it has to be relative.
[Edited on 3/31/2017 by porkchopbob]
When you point a gun at someone you are placing them in fear for their life. Period. That is not okay anywhere at any time.
We love the Bett's family so some of us are trying to justify her actions or vilify the rowing club.
Bottom line, what she is accused of is serious business and never ok under any circumstances.
Imagine for a second that it was not Dickey's wife but some rich, self absorbed family of the wrong political affiliation. Most of this board would have no mercy on them and the rowing club would be protected as if they were an endangered species.
I haven't anyone here justify her actions. I've seen some justify why they would be very frustrated. Big difference.
Can anyone explain why the gun is the option when there is not a imminent threat...or danger...were they going to hit her with a oar??? or try to run up on her property and hit here with the boat??...where they practicing viking raids on the neighborhood???
I don't own a gun so I don't understand why that, except in most extreme cases, seems to be the answer???
My dad always told me that he never saw anything good come out of a gun...here's another example of why there is a call for gun control...because people bring them into play long before there is a need...
So what did her gun do for her....well...it got her in trouble...
From the air photo the dock next door certainly is an eyesore.
Now, check the appropriate boxes
Meth
Oxy
Alcohol
Cocaine
Heroin
Makes people do stupid things
There's a band playing tonight here in Chicago called "The Dickies". 
Moid and I saw The TTB there a year ago.
Everything in Moderation. Including Moderation.
When you point a gun at someone you are placing them in fear for their life. Period. That is not okay anywhere at any time.
That gets folks killed all the time when it's the police they are pointing them at.
Unless they are white, of course.
Come to Chicago and point a gun at someone. Anyone. I guarantee you something bad will happen. On the local news in the morning I hate watching it.
Everything in Moderation. Including Moderation.
"Unless they are white, of course"
That's a special kind of stupid.
The guy on the 911 says hundreds of kids? WTF? How many kids are that into rowing?
Then they talk about weddings and social events which I could see becoming quite a pain in the ass after a while. If my neighbors started to have hundreds of kids there daily with weddings on the weekend, that would piss me off.
Not saying what she did was right or even the actions of someone sane but it is obviously someone who has had it. I imagine that a few drinks and some anger caused her to react.
I did get a laugh at reading that Dickey disrupts the wedding bands with loud electric guitar. Can't shake the image of Dickey out on his dock with a Marshall amp cranked right up and giving them an earful. Wonder if there were any tapers there? 😉
Green River? Born On The Bayou? Sitting On The Dock of The Bay?
LMAO! Proud Mary?
Nice to see that they gave you parole from the MT thread for a change.
😉
"Is that a real poncho or is that a Sears poncho?"
I like how some twist points.... the point was proportionality to bigger crimes, not 'IT was OK" good grief..... did it traumatize some kids? I wasn't there, but sure it was bad, and it probably did to some degree. There should be accountability. But nobody got hurt and there are violent physical crimes against people all around us that warrant bigger accountability than this will likely get.
It's only a bigger deal in the media because it's a local famous person's wife. It's not like they sent in the SWAT team and diverted resources. She'll post bond. I'm not sure how much less you think should have been done. You point a gun at kids you become a pretty big issue, I'm not sure why it has to be relative.
[Edited on 3/31/2017 by porkchopbob]
What I see issue with is the 18 felonies, and probably a disproportionate amount of Prosecutors Office time (tax money) that could be spent on this. I could be wrong on the time they will spend on this, I admit. Prisoners cost 50K a year so if we say: she deserves 10 years, we also are saying: we the taxpayers want to spend half a million bucks of our money making her learn and also showing society what can happen to them if they do the same act.
I would rather see: House arrest for a while when initially released. No wiggle room strict probation. No gun rule of course, she abused gun rights. And MOST important, mandatory mental health treatment very regularly like all the time maybe for a while. But 18 felonies? 1 to 4 might have sufficed. They are doing a gang level stomp out on the front line. But like I said, it may be a power ploy to force a tough plea bargain, with that weight over her head, any agreement that keeps one free is not a bad one.
What do you all think she "Should Get" spectrum being light probation I guess, as "getting off" is not happening we think, all the way to say 20 years or more..... which 18 felonies could indeed have her spending her entire remainder life in prison. So what is the opinion?
How would you feel if this was Rush Limbaugh standing out in his yard aiming a gun at local youth?
Rusty, with all respect, what kind of question is that?
I would think the same, I do not apply rules based on who someone is, to answer the question.
What if the Pope did it? 
It's only a bigger deal in the media because it's a local famous person's wife. It's not like they sent in the SWAT team and diverted resources. She'll post bond. I'm not sure how much less you think should have been done. You point a gun at kids you become a pretty big issue, I'm not sure why it has to be relative.
[Edited on 3/31/2017 by porkchopbob]
What I see issue with is the 18 felonies, and probably a disproportionate amount of Prosecutors Office time (tax money) that could be spent on this. I could be wrong on the time they will spend on this, I admit. Prisoners cost 50K a year so if we say: she deserves 10 years, we also are saying: we the taxpayers want to spend half a million bucks of our money making her learn and also showing society what can happen to them if they do the same act.
I would rather see: House arrest for a while when initially released. No wiggle room strict probation. No gun rule of course, she abused gun rights. And MOST important, mandatory mental health treatment very regularly like all the time maybe for a while. But 18 felonies? 1 to 4 might have sufficed. They are doing a gang level stomp out on the front line. But like I said, it may be a power ploy to force a tough plea bargain, with that weight over her head, any agreement that keeps one free is not a bad one.
What do you all think she "Should Get" spectrum being light probation I guess, as "getting off" is not happening we think, all the way to say 20 years or more..... which 18 felonies could indeed have her spending her entire remainder life in prison. So what is the opinion?
Like I said, the 18 counts are typically thrown at people using guns irresponsibly in order to get them off the street immediately. Typically when someone is arrested, any laws that are broken are listed in the charges as a matter of record. I'm sure she will plea out, resulting in most of those counts will be dropped. Maybe a handful weeks in jail, at most, but more likely a fine, probation, ankle monitor, and maybe some community service, etc. Nothing they are doing is out of the ordinary here, I just think you are being a little presumptuous and needlessly incredulous in regards to what they actually will do. Remember, she pointed the gun, I'm sure the DA's office would much rather not be doing any of this.
Had she just gotten one of these signs, I'm sure the situation would be over with:
Mrs. Betts is the spouse of a guitar player that we all know, love and deeply appreciate. Limbaugh - a gasbag commentator that most (around here) deplore. I was just wondering if you'd feel the same if he or anyone else less-loved pulled the same antics as Donna Betts. She was intoxicated and waiving a firearm around - aiming it at people.
Following mass-shootings, we always hear about stockpiles of weapons in the culprit's house, or of irrational behavior by the same. Then we wonder, "why didn't anybody see the signs?". Was she a "ticking-time bomb"? Was a disaster nipped in the bud, here?
That's all I got on this. Peace.
Just read that Dickey's wife blames rowers listening to Gregg's solo albums... they inspire them to practice early and put all their efforts into their workouts. She attempted to fax her concerns but was unable to operate the fax device... supposedly she threatened to use the newly renovated PT boat from the WWII museum in New Orleans to force the crews to stop rowing in front of the Betts' property. She said "The New Orleans gigs were some of the band's greatest performances ever and to have a boat representing The Big Easy was only fitting to preserve our way of life." There were no immediate comments from Gregg Allman or the mayor of New Orleans. Responses from the rowers included "Power 10" and "Remember Duane Allman".
http://www.heraldtribune.com/news/20170328/dickey-betts-wife-accused-of-pointing-gun-at-rowers
People have tried to downplay the seriousness of what occurred because no one was actually shot. The thing is people cannot and should not point a gun at anyone unless they plan to use it. The only permissible use for drawing a gun on someone is in self defense, or if they are hunting to provide food for their family. The description of events from the video of the man making the 911 call is disturbing if events were as he described them, how does someone look thru the scope of a rifle at a bunch of kids, and then say that it was not loaded, but that she would go and get a weapon that was loaded. Because she thought rowers might get out of their boat and come on her property? If someone shoots more than 2 person at the same event it is considered a serial shooting, if they die, it is serial murder.
Or the parents could sue the Preserve and or the Bett's civilly for causing stress and fear to their children. The Preserve legally has to protect them while they are in their care, if anything happens, they are responsible legally. The children have to be terrified after this, how could they not be?
Other things that would come up is whose rifle was that? If it was not hers, why did she have access to someone elses weapons?
Anyone who would point a gun at a group of children should not be able to own or have access to any guns. That is not responsible gun ownership.
Dickey is a martial artist, he could protect her if someone breached their property, but if they are concerned that they are targets, then they could consider getting some security guards for their property. Also get offsite satellite surveillance of the property, not just some cameras where the feed goes to one remote viewing station or stays in your home on a DVR. Let the professionals handle it. If he needs a body guard to go with him to the golf course, because he is a celebrity, he can do that also. That way he could just enjoy his game and know that security concerns are being handled. ADT will wire your house for free and you just pay a monthly monitoring charge. I think they are nationwide.
Put up signs that tell people (because there are many stupid people who cannot figure it out) that their property is private. "Private property, no trespassing". If someone does come on the property, calmly tell them they need to leave, and that they are on private property. if they do not leave, inform them you will call the cops to have them removed if they do not voluntarily leave. That is what sensible people do.
Beyond that, since the Preserve is causing so much problems, they could try to use the town zoning laws in regard to the noise from the weddings. Call the cops, have it documented that they are disturbing the peace, with their loud parties. If this does not stop them, consider moving to a quieter, more peaceful place.
The article says that both of them were using air horns and blasting music to express their disgust with the Preserve parties. Trying to overpower people is just a form of domination. It does not lead to peace or good outcomes for conflicts.
The situation with the Preserve is not likely to change anytime soon, and with summer coming, the weddings and noise will probably be more frequent. They should try to sell and get a more suitable place to live. Home is where the heart is, you can move your stuff to someplace else. A house is just a building with the stuff you bring in there. You can make a home anyplace.
It might take awhile to sell their home, they could rent a condo somewhere else till it is sold. Butch's widow and children may want to leave their condo and move to something more affordable. Maybe the Betts's could rent that, giving Butch's wife and children some income they need till they can sell that condo. Maybe the Bett's would even like to buy that condo. The neighbors are used to hearing ABB music so that would probably not be a problem, and it would get them away from all the problems at the Preserve. Palm Beach is nice. Butch's condo was estimated to be worth $200K. People can rent their condos without board approval, just a thought.
[Edited on 4/4/2017 by gina]
Rusty, with all respect, what kind of question is that?
Got to agree with you on this. Like him her not, I feel certain that Rush Limbaugh is smart enough not to pull such a STUPID ASS stunt, as are most people. This is about right & wrong not right & left. And our guitar heroe's wife was wrong, end of story. Easy to see why she was angry, but still wrong.
I guess it is a good thing she is white or the police might have shot her.
Met a real estate agent in Florida who has golfed with Dickey before. He carries a gun, on the golf course.
Mr and Mrs Betts must feel they are some kind of target and don't like people getting too close to what they consider their private space. No excuse for doing what Donna did, just saying it must be the mentality they have.
It's too bad the people on the water were put in that threatening situation, and it is too bad that Donna is facing the legal battle she is now. People do things without thinking some times and there are consequences for everything.
Rusty, with all respect, what kind of question is that?
Got to agree with you on this. Like him her not, I feel certain that Rush Limbaugh is smart enough not to pull such a STUPID ASS stunt, as are most people. This is about right & wrong not right & left. And our guitar heroe's wife was wrong, end of story. Easy to see why she was angry, but still wrong.
I guess it is a good thing she is white or the police might have shot her.
Hmm. Perhaps a bad analogy on my end.
Just trying to point out that several seem to be willing to cut Mrs. Betts some slack - likely because of her connection to our favorite band. I was wondering how they'd feel if she was a mere mortal.
AIQ mentioned Florida's "stand your ground" laws. I hadn't thought about it, but Mrs. Betts is lucky that one of those boaters wasn't armed. A Florida jury just might give a pass to someone who shot someone else who was holding a gun on them. Perhaps this was her lucky day.
To circle back to the property / permitting dispute, which I see as a separate issue from the civil disobedience / gun pulling incident, however intertwined they may be.... I read some comments in a Florida paper blog under the story. Tried to find them again to post and can't readily, will if I can. But a neighbor posted. He condoned the gun incident, firstly. But secondly he talked of the issues they face there. He is hundreds of feet away from the Non Profit lot. He said it is next door to the Betts. He said he can hear the wedding music at his house which is much farther away than the Betts are. He said the Betts have lived there 20 years. He called the subdivision tiny, with used to be 4 cars a day on the road. Now gets large traffic. (Kids need rides and parents and cars, etc) He says hundred of kids use this facility every day. So it sounds like the people that live there are severely impacted.
The issue really is a Planning and Zoning and land use issue. It is a residential subdivision, regardless of open water rights. It has a day use rental and essentially a commercial size and scope operation going on albeit under non profit status. In a residential subdivision. They obviously use property as a coffer filler, for wedding rental income, which has nothing to do with kids exercising or bay conservation. I would believe the residents will have a hard time getting a reversal on the bad permitting decision, but maybe the property owners can get some logical rules on use put in place, this outfit seems to have none. I'd move. Who would buy a place next door to a circus like that though?
As I wrote earlier, it looks like Dickey & his wife testified on behalf of this facility when they were acquiring and getting their use permit (per one of the managers of the site next door). I bet this turned out to be a significantly more busy and noisy facility than they thought when/if they really supported it.
Things like weddings end up funding programs (park facilities often rent their event space to weddings to raise money for groundskeeping or to keep fees low for youth leagues/teams/programs), but I sure wouldn't want that happening on my street.
(and no, I'm not writing the above to justify her actions)
Ne construction nice properties near Naples. New home, new start.
[Edited on 4/5/2017 by gina]
