I respect this logic but dont fully comprehend it.

The band's legacy ended when the band played their last show in 2014. Whether or not anybody thinks they were a cover band at that point in time is beyond the point. They were playing as The Allman Brothers Band until 10/282014.

Any performances beyond that time and as another name, The Brothers or anything else, does not impact the legacy of ABB, much like the work of Dead & Co does not impact The Grateful Dead.

The band ended in 2014. Its legacy didn't - but a legacy is an intangible thing, right? What they're essentially saying is they don't want to do something cheap or embarrassing or gross. If the band had called it quits in 2014 and then they'd all played together the next year or they year after, you probably would have had fans wondering what was the big deal with the band "retiring" and you'd have had people muttering things like "cash grab" - which happens whenever a band says it's retiring and then drags it out. (To be fair only a minority of fans would've said that and most probably wouldn't have minded.)

I'm not saying either side is right or wrong, really. I think they should do whatever they want to do and I hope they enjoy it. But I appreciate that the band members have a different relationship to each other and the music and its history than we do as fans. They think the band set such a high standard that they don't want to do anything that takes away from that. Given all the problems the band had in the early 2010s with Gregg's health and such it's incredible they went out on the high note they did. So at least in their minds, anything they do after that is going to have to live up to that. The MSG show, at least to most fans' ears, did. They seem very happy with it. Can they do that a third time or more? If the last ABB/Brothers/whatever date ends up being an unceremonious gig at a state fair for 800 people in 2023 with (picking at random) Jaimoe, Warren, Marc, Jack, and some guys who were never in the ABB, does that kind of suck and fall short of the standard Duane and Gregg and everyone set? At least in their minds, it does.

I think that as a society we put way too much emphasis on things like legacies when enjoying what you have during the brief time you have it is probably more important. When people tell every athlete to quit at the top of his or her game, I think 'Why? They're doing what they want, and at some point they'll have to quit anyway - why do it a second earlier than they want to?' BUT: Derek and Warren and the others feel like they're taking care of someone else's legacy and not their own. Whether or not we'd make the same choices in their shoes, they take that legacy very seriously and I respect that. It's not because they don't care about the fans or don't appreciate them, but they're not going to put aside their own judgment and let fans or promoters or ticket sellers make these kinds of calls.

you can bet if they did it again (and I hope they don't) there will be comments like "money grab"

example, the new Black Crowes tour.

Think about how great artists like Miles Davis, Bob Dylan, and Jeff Beck keep changing the line-ups they play with, even if it means disappointing some fans or losing some guaranteed bucks.

Derek is an artist. He does plenty to make his audience happy, but he's not likely to embark on a greatest hits tour.

The MSG show was absolutely fantastic ! Time to move on. Again. If another happens, great. If not, I'm still happy.

I totally understand Derek's stance!

He along with Warren out front had a huge part in holding up ABB's legacy for the last 15 years the band existed.

WHAT MORE DO YOU WANT OUT OF DEREK?

This is NO different than Robert Plant doing ONE reunion show with Zep in 2007 then saying goodbye. Just like Plant, Derek has moved on musically into other genres with TTB and that's where he is at, at this point in time. It's 2020, not 2010.

Good post rob. I pretty much mentioned the same thing in a prior thread with the Plant comparison.

Selfish reasons , I would love to hear more. But I get where he is coming from, that is his choice, and well deserved. Keep it sacred and special. Chuck, Jaimoe and Reese are up there in years. Not sure they would be up for a full tour. I personally don't see the unit that was "The Brothers" doing a full tour anytime soon or even at all. Maybe getting together individually for sit ins, yeah , for sure.

As long as the ABB family bands keep the music alive, I have no problem.

Plant is that way. He wants to move forward, create new music , not live in the past. Some of it might have to do with Bonham, maybe? I think if Jimmy got off of his rear and reached out to him and Jones with something new to create, possibly could.

Whatever happens, happens. We shall see what the future holds.

For the record, since I started this thread, I never said Derek owed anybody anything. I appreciate all the years he gave to the ABB and I respect his right to decide his own career path. I simply said I wish he would reconsider because the ABB music is so beloved by so many. Basically, I echo what Alan Paul said in an earlier response -- I just want to hear these guys play together more, and in my mind a short, annual Beacon run would be perfect, because it would still give them 11 months out of the year to pursue their own careers. You know, it is possible to have your cake and eat it, too...

Derek owes nobody.

He has said in interviews he will carve his own
path regardless of the disgruntled fan base that gets
left behind. He smirks in your disgruntled direction.

Derek, like every paid musician, owes his fans everything. It is naive to think otherwise.

"Naive"?.....Please....And just how long is he expected to "owe"? I would argue that the "Debt" is paid in full at the end of any performance he chooses and is financially rewarded to give.

He owes as long as he gains from what the fans provide, simple as that. Look, I'm not saying we as fans dont also get something from musicians. And I'm certainly not implying musicians are solely here for our entertainment but they get a lot from the "deal."

If not for Abb, for example, Butch would be a math teacher. I dont know many math teachers that have villas in the French countryside. In exchange for a rockstar lifestyle, why is it so outrageous for us (hardcore) fans to expect things like respect, gratitude, basic communication etc?

Also, and in other ABB examples, this forum has agreed that musicians owe their fans: I was on this site during the Gregg Allman autopen incident and many people believed he "owed" the fans beyond just a simple refund. I was also on this site from 2005-2012 when there was about 7000 threads abput how ABB and their management owed the fans better (or any) communication. So, feel free to disagree with me, that is your right but we all know there are plenty of instances when this site believes musicians owed their fans something.

Derek certainly gives respect, gratitude, and communication. That one is easy. The guy gives very articulate interviews, started a fan club so people could get more merch if they want, and has been broadcasting free concerts every Thursday night. That is plenty.

"As for Plant, it seemed pretty evident to me that the reason he didn't do a Zep tour is because he can't even come close to singing like he used to. I don't think he wanted to get on stage and sound 1000x softer than he did in the 70s. If I were Plant, I wouldn't want to sing those old tunes if I can't get up there anymore, especially while Page is still shredding."

It is definitely true that hard rock is a young man's game. However, Robert Plant has been singing songs lower in register since the early 1970s; watch the film "The Song Remains the Same," recorded in 1973. he has always changed the songs to suit his voice. He also did not do Zepp songs solo when he began as a solo act in the early 80s, when his range was higher than it is now. So, much of his choice to avoid Zepp songs is as philosophical as it is physical / practical.

You mention Jimmy Page still shredding; Jimmy has not been a consistently good live guitarist since 1977, from what I can see. If anything, I suspect Plant got frustrated by Jimmy Page's rusty playing and personal quirks that have interfered with their music being great.

As for Plant, it seemed pretty evident to me that the reason he didn't do a Zep tour is because he can't even come close to singing like he used to. I don't think he wanted to get on stage and sound 1000x softer than he did in the 70s. If I were Plant, I wouldn't want to sing those old tunes if I can't get up there anymore, especially while Page is still shredding.

[Edited on 4/6/2020 by Skydog32103]

Plant still has a great voice. Yeah, he might not be able to hit those notes, but his voice is far from being trashed, compared to others of his era and genre. We saw him a couple of summers ago and he still is in very fine form.

As for Plant, it seemed pretty evident to me that the reason he didn't do a Zep tour is because he can't even come close to singing like he used to. I don't think he wanted to get on stage and sound 1000x softer than he did in the 70s. If I were Plant, I wouldn't want to sing those old tunes if I can't get up there anymore, especially while Page is still shredding.

[Edited on 4/6/2020 by Skydog32103]

Plant still has a great voice. Yeah, he might not be able to hit those notes, but his voice is far from being trashed, compared to others of his era and genre. We saw him a couple of summers ago and he still is in very fine form.

Plant still has a great voice but he can't go full rock god for 2+ hours anymore, which is likely why he has turned down hundreds of millions over the years.

Even the couple of Zeppelin songs he still does live are rearranged to save his voice.

especially while Page is still shredding.

Is he? Who would know?

The last time he played a full concert was 2007. That was one show. Before that it was the short tour with the Black Crowes in 99-00.

What was the last piece of new music he released? Walking Into Clarksdale?

I love Led Zeppelin and Jimmy Page, but he's constantly saying he's going to be out doing something, but he rarely does.

you can bet if they did it again (and I hope they don't) there will be comments like "money grab"

example, the new Black Crowes tour.

I don't think it is the same as the new Crowes tour at all. Steve Gorman, Marc Ford, Sven Pipien (or Johnny Colt) are all still alive. Rich even put out an album with 2 of them earlier this year in Magpie Salute, then changed his phone number and never told him the band was no more to reform a new version of the Crowes.

OK, I'll buy that

you can bet if they did it again (and I hope they don't) there will be comments like "money grab"

example, the new Black Crowes tour.

I don't think it is the same as the new Crowes tour at all. Steve Gorman, Marc Ford, Sven Pipien (or Johnny Colt) are all still alive. Rich even put out an album with 2 of them earlier this year in Magpie Salute, then changed his phone number and never told him the band was no more to reform a new version of the Crowes.

Yeah that whole thing is somewhat of a mystery. Who knows what brought them back together? That tour,along with many others, might not even get off the ground this summer. I don't think there has been a word from the Magpie guys on that whole BC situation.
I am a big fan of Rich in and out of the BC's and love Chris's vocals.

In an interview with American Songwriter, Warren also says this was most likely a one-time thing. https://americansongwriter.com/warren-haynes-allman-brothers-band-reunion/

As warm as the feelings were and as transporting as the music was (check out online clips to hear for yourself), Haynes insists it was not a new beginning for another incarnation of the Allman Brothers. “I think we all looked at it as a one-time thing that needed to happen,” he explains.

you can bet if they did it again (and I hope they don't) there will be comments like "money grab"

example, the new Black Crowes tour.

I don't think it is the same as the new Crowes tour at all. Steve Gorman, Marc Ford, Sven Pipien (or Johnny Colt) are all still alive. Rich even put out an album with 2 of them earlier this year in Magpie Salute, then changed his phone number and never told him the band was no more to reform a new version of the Crowes.

Yeah that whole thing is somewhat of a mystery. Who knows what brought them back together? That tour,along with many others, might not even get off the ground this summer. I don't think there has been a word from the Magpie guys on that whole BC situation.
I am a big fan of Rich in and out of the BC's and love Chris's vocals.

Read an interview with Ford last week where he said he and Rich's contact after the last Magpie tour got less and less frequent as time passed then on day Rich just changed his number. He said he found out that the band broke up and the "Crowes" were back together when the news hit the internet.

So apparently Rich never told them.

you can bet if they did it again (and I hope they don't) there will be comments like "money grab"

example, the new Black Crowes tour.

I don't think it is the same as the new Crowes tour at all. Steve Gorman, Marc Ford, Sven Pipien (or Johnny Colt) are all still alive. Rich even put out an album with 2 of them earlier this year in Magpie Salute, then changed his phone number and never told him the band was no more to reform a new version of the Crowes.

Yeah that whole thing is somewhat of a mystery. Who knows what brought them back together? That tour,along with many others, might not even get off the ground this summer. I don't think there has been a word from the Magpie guys on that whole BC situation.
I am a big fan of Rich in and out of the BC's and love Chris's vocals.

Read an interview with Ford last week where he said he and Rich's contact after the last Magpie tour got less and less frequent as time passed then on day Rich just changed his number. He said he found out that the band broke up and the "Crowes" were back together when the news hit the internet.

So apparently Rich never told them.

Wow...interesting. I liked that band and what they were bringing to the table. Rich seemed pretty high on the group and especially having Marc back on board. I wonder if Ford will ever work with the brothers again after this situation?

I think they kinda over sold themselves booking some of these large outdoor sheds for the tour. Here in Indy, the place they booked holds about 24,000. I think if the filled half that amount , that would be pretty good. But I don't see even that figure though, Could be wrong.

A good part of this summer could be a bust for summer tours for everybody.

If nothing happens with more Brothers shows, I'm sure Jaimoe will call everyone again for a 55th and 60th anniversary shows.

I'll certainly go if I can find someone to push my wheelchair. I'll be 78 in five years and 83 on the 60th. Jaimoe will be about 81 and 86 years old.

you can bet if they did it again (and I hope they don't) there will be comments like "money grab"

example, the new Black Crowes tour.

I don't think it is the same as the new Crowes tour at all. Steve Gorman, Marc Ford, Sven Pipien (or Johnny Colt) are all still alive. Rich even put out an album with 2 of them earlier this year in Magpie Salute, then changed his phone number and never told him the band was no more to reform a new version of the Crowes.

Yeah that whole thing is somewhat of a mystery. Who knows what brought them back together? That tour,along with many others, might not even get off the ground this summer. I don't think there has been a word from the Magpie guys on that whole BC situation.
I am a big fan of Rich in and out of the BC's and love Chris's vocals.

Read an interview with Ford last week where he said he and Rich's contact after the last Magpie tour got less and less frequent as time passed then on day Rich just changed his number. He said he found out that the band broke up and the "Crowes" were back together when the news hit the internet.

So apparently Rich never told them.

Wow...interesting. I liked that band and what they were bringing to the table. Rich seemed pretty high on the group and especially having Marc back on board. I wonder if Ford will ever work with the brothers again after this situation?

I think they kinda over sold themselves booking some of these large outdoor sheds for the tour. Here in Indy, the place they booked holds about 24,000. I think if the filled half that amount , that would be pretty good. But I don't see even that figure though, Could be wrong.

A good part of this summer could be a bust for summer tours for everybody.

You never say never, but if you read Steve Gorman's book, you see how dysfunctional this band was and how at every turn the Robinsons found a way to shoot themselves in the foot.

I love the Crowes. Easily one of my top 5 favorite bands ever, but I'm so cold on this "reunion' because it's so obviously for the wrong reasons. When they were on, not many bands could touch them live.

Only for a very brief period in the early - mid 90s were they a band who could draw big on their own in the sheds. For the vast majority of their career unless they were in a package with someone else like Petty did they do those types of shows the rest of the time it was 2,000 seat theaters. Truthfully that's the perfect place for them. This whole tour is just Live Nation throwing a ton of money at them and hoping that nostalgia and beer sales will make up the difference on the investment since they own the sheds they will be playing.

But wouldn't it be great if there was a couple Dead & Co/Brothers double bill shows? Or a couple festival appearances where The Brothers' other bands are appearing?

Hell to the yeah!

[Edited on 4/8/2020 by BigDaveOnBass]

You mean TTB, Gov't Mule, Jaimoe's jazzass band, Widespread Panic and the Rolling Stones?

yes all those players from March 10, only this time co headlining w/the Allman-Betts Band - we’re lucky to have all these great musicians carrying the torch

yes all those players from March 10, only this time co headlining w/the Allman-Betts Band - we’re lucky to have all these great musicians carrying the torch

Sounds good...maybe a little DTB reunion of a sorts with special guest Doyle Bramhall II

A tour schedule for the Brothers could very easily be done the way Widespread Panic is "touring" these days. Ten to 12 weekends a year, 2 or 3 shows each weekend. Schedule around WSP, you get Duane T, the Stones seem to be doing 1 tour a year, so it's easy to get Chuck. Warren has done other stuff besides the Mule for years, easy to accomodate. Dead & Co are busy about 3 months a year, tops, Oteil would be available. Jaimoe would be the key, just don't give him an insane travel schedule. At minimum, a weekend or 2 at the Beacon, a Wanee-ish festival in the south, Peach festival in the east, maybe a fest in the midwest and one out west. I think they can make it work, if they want.

you can bet if they did it again (and I hope they don't) there will be comments like "money grab"

example, the new Black Crowes tour.

I don't think it is the same as the new Crowes tour at all. Steve Gorman, Marc Ford, Sven Pipien (or Johnny Colt) are all still alive. Rich even put out an album with 2 of them earlier this year in Magpie Salute, then changed his phone number and never told him the band was no more to reform a new version of the Crowes.

Yeah that whole thing is somewhat of a mystery. Who knows what brought them back together? That tour,along with many others, might not even get off the ground this summer. I don't think there has been a word from the Magpie guys on that whole BC situation.
I am a big fan of Rich in and out of the BC's and love Chris's vocals.

Read an interview with Ford last week where he said he and Rich's contact after the last Magpie tour got less and less frequent as time passed then on day Rich just changed his number. He said he found out that the band broke up and the "Crowes" were back together when the news hit the internet.

So apparently Rich never told them.

Wow...interesting. I liked that band and what they were bringing to the table. Rich seemed pretty high on the group and especially having Marc back on board. I wonder if Ford will ever work with the brothers again after this situation?

I think they kinda over sold themselves booking some of these large outdoor sheds for the tour. Here in Indy, the place they booked holds about 24,000. I think if the filled half that amount , that would be pretty good. But I don't see even that figure though, Could be wrong.

A good part of this summer could be a bust for summer tours for everybody.

You never say never, but if you read Steve Gorman's book, you see how dysfunctional this band was and how at every turn the Robinsons found a way to shoot themselves in the foot.

I love the Crowes. Easily one of my top 5 favorite bands ever, but I'm so cold on this "reunion' because it's so obviously for the wrong reasons. When they were on, not many bands could touch them live.

Only for a very brief period in the early - mid 90s were they a band who could draw big on their own in the sheds. For the vast majority of their career unless they were in a package with someone else like Petty did they do those types of shows the rest of the time it was 2,000 seat theaters. Truthfully that's the perfect place for them. This whole tour is just Live Nation throwing a ton of money at them and hoping that nostalgia and beer sales will make up the difference on the investment since they own the sheds they will be playing.

True.

I have heard a bunch of interviews from Steve after his book came out. The whole thing sounds interesting. He seems like a good guy. I will read his book at some point. I did snoop around about the Page stuff. Could not resist holding back on that.

Do you listen to the State Of Amorica podcast? Its a good one, and I recommend it. A few good ones recently with a couple of the backup singers. Steve was on there too.

I love the Crowes as well. Rich is one of my fav guitarists. After the first breakup in the early 2000's and Rich put out Live At The Knitting Factory. I was hooked on what he was doing and almost could have cared less if they got back together or not. I REALLY enjoy his solo stuff. They kinda lost me around Warpaint and Freeze and Frost. Just not my cup of tea. Rich even mentioned that Chris was moving the band into the GD arena. The music was a little different, and I cant remember the last time I played either one of those. I do like the cover of Gods Got it. This is just my opinion, but they are a RNR band at heart and on last two, they seemed to drift away from that.

I would like to see a compilation boxset release of all of they're B sides,imports,extra tracks and etc. They have a bunch of that . Some I have and some I dont. It would be nice to have it all in one package.

At first I kinda had the same reaction you did about the supposed reasons for the tour and lineup. I heard a few things that the Bros' explained and it seemed kinda ..eh.... dont know. There could be more to the story than what we know. I have softened my stance after watching recent footage of Brothers Of A Feather. If they came close enough to me ,I would be there in a heart beat. Chris is such an outstanding singer.