Other artist weighing in.
https://ultimateclassicrock.com/musicians-react-neil-young-spotify/
There are some funny quotes in there, like Nils Lofgren's wife saying they will miss the $3.28 a year! John Rich's might be the funniest! "Joe > Neil" LOL. Everybody can have their opinion.
There is no impact. NY, Warner, Rogan, Spotify got some publicity. There is no musician's revolt about the context for their music & most of them, including NY, don't own their publishing or sound - their labels/publishing companies do. It's those entities who make the decision as to best exploit their catalogues. NY can review everywhere his music is, but only his label can make requests to terminate because he sold them that right.
IMO, he shows zero understanding of how the business works now - if he ever did. There would be no music platforms if artists had veto power over who else is being aired. Do you think Spielberg worries about what other producer/directors are on Netflix? TV shows care about who else is on their cable channel? Big name musicians over who else is on their platform? If you go down that rabbit hole, then you're headed for the 1950s/60s when music was segregated into rigid categories. There was no such thing as crossover artists. Now, the entire world of music is available to all in multiple media - the consumer drives who they listen to the most.
If NY is worried about his legacy, he should be doing what other musicians are doing - selling their catalogues to people they trust as part of an estate plan when a person is nearing 80. He seems to trust Warner. Bundle it up, let the accountants work their magic, & make a deal.
There are standard clauses about following regulatory guidelines, but spotify specifically stated they aren't involved in his content. If required by a court, they will remove content & they have for Rogan & other providers. Way back w/Howard Stern, his station just paid the fines rather than censor him because he made them so much friggin money.
Looks like Peter Frampton has joined in the cause and is having his music removed...
I don't use these apps, is there a way that can show the rank of musicians/groups by popularity? I'm so out of the pop music world I have no idea who is popular other than like Lady Gaga and Taylor Swift. Then there is pop country and hip-hop, I am equally uninformed on those segments. I'd have to think those genres drive spotify's music popularity.
It would be interesting to see where Neil Young or Peter Frampton rank on spotify's popularity charts.
Looks like Peter Frampton has joined in the cause and is having his music removed...
He let Neil show him the way...
That's the second lyrical twist on this spotify thing.
Looks like Peter Frampton has joined in the cause and is having his music removed...
He let Neil show him the way...
That's the second lyrical twist on this spotify thing.
My My Hey Hey....
"Is that a real poncho or is that a Sears poncho?"
I don't use these apps, is there a way that can show the rank of musicians/groups by popularity? I'm so out of the pop music world I have no idea who is popular other than like Lady Gaga and Taylor Swift. Then there is pop country and hip-hop, I am equally uninformed on those segments. I'd have to think those genres drive spotify's music popularity.
It would be interesting to see where Neil Young or Peter Frampton rank on spotify's popularity charts.
Yes I think spotify has many of the modern artist that probably drive the platform more than who we all listen to. Who knows maybe a Taylor Swift will step up and that might make things a little different.
The people who want to live in conspiracy world will always seek it out and find it. They enjoy believing in chaos and mystery...I had someone tell me the reason we can't find Bigfoot is because they bury their dead... 🤔
They always have an explanation for the irrational. Even watch the flat earth special on Netflix....at the end they setup some test and it shows a curve and they still don't believe it.
There are standard clauses about following regulatory guidelines, but spotify specifically stated they aren't involved in his content. If required by a court, they will remove content & they have for Rogan & other providers. Way back w/Howard Stern, his station just paid the fines rather than censor him because he made them so much friggin money.
So then Rogan is free to say pretty much anything that pops into his head then.
Regarding Howard Stern, I am a big fan and yes the terrestrial Radio Station he last worked for paid his FCC fines but back in his WNBC New York days he had specific things written into his contract he was not allowed to say like bits related to George Carlin's 7 dirty words.
The station tried to use these restrictive contract clauses to control Stern's radio show content and ultimately stop payment on his contract when they fired him.
I think it is irresponsible of Rogan to push his antivax theories but on the other hand I do support free speech so I am not sure I think he should be taken off the air for them as where do we draw the line on censorship?
This one walks the line for me. It may be putting people at risk listening to his unscientific remedy claims but if people want to believe him is that enough to censor him?
Barry Manilow has joined in also having his music removed.
There's free speech and there's a time when that free speech is harmful and needs to be called out. If Regan hadn't removed the fairness doctrine we night not be here and Joe wouldn't be allowed to say the BS he does. But I guess the truth no longer matters when we have a large platform and can influence gullible people. It's really no different than a guy with a wagon and monkey trying to sell "potions"
Seems they're still are around and they have a podcast and a mic instead. Doesn't Alex Jones have his own supplement line? Wasn't Joe trying to push horse meds and piss while telling everyone he can suck his own c**k...phuck just get the monkey too and dress it up in a little red suit and call them what they are...Whackoos
What Neil Young is doing shouldn't upset Rogan's listeners, he's exercising his own form of free speech. Rogan can say what he wants, he's an entertainer with a podcast, not a sources of news. As we saw with Alex Jones, if what Rogan says brings harm or he defames someone they can sue him (and possibly Spotify).
Meanwhile, Young isn't trying to silence Rogan, there's no censorship occurring here. Obviously he didn't think Spotify would side with him, he just doesn't want his work (i.e. his business) featured on the same forum. He's using his song catalogue as a form of protest, just like when Trump supporters discovered Goya beans. Spotify isn't exactly known to be a financial boon to musicians, so it's an easy form of protest for Young and the others who didn't like what the streamer did to the music industry in the first place. If Rogan fans don't like it, well, Young has given them an easy way to boycott him.
Taylor Swift created her own controversy in about 2018-19 when she was unable to buy back her original masters from her 1st label that ended up being run by 4-5 various hedge funds & banks. Her solution - she re-created her original 6 albums (essentially covering her own songs) & owns those masters. She's always owned her publishing. All kinds of creators - authors, musicians, filmmakers - are more savvy about copyrights now, but the basic model is that the creators are in the weakest position to actually make $ from them unless they're already wealthy.
If Rogan fans don't like it, well, Young has given them an easy way to boycott him.
I don't understand your last sentence. NY has given Rogan fans an easy way to boycott who?
IMO, this is all much ado about nothing & spotify isn't the only music streaming service. All that's happened is the players got some PR.
Taylor Swift created her own controversy in about 2018-19 when she was unable to buy back her original masters from her 1st label that ended up being run by 4-5 various hedge funds & banks. Her solution - she re-created her original 6 albums (essentially covering her own songs) & owns those masters. She's always owned her publishing. All kinds of creators - authors, musicians, filmmakers - are more savvy about copyrights now, but the basic model is that the creators are in the weakest position to actually make $ from them unless they're already wealthy.
She is a smart lady and I do remember her doing that. I was just saying if some modern artists, her as an example, with a very large following step up it might make Spotify rethink who they support and who they don't.
I also know people want to scream cancellation madness. No it's taking stance and having some damn values, morals and ethics.
If Rogan fans don't like it, well, Young has given them an easy way to boycott him.
I don't understand your last sentence. NY has given Rogan fans an easy way to boycott who?
IMO, this is all much ado about nothing & spotify isn't the only music streaming service. All that's happened is the players got some PR.
If Rogan fans don't like [Young's actions], well, Young has given [Rogan's fans] an easy way to boycott him[self - because he's removed himself from Spotify]
What does New York have to do with all of this? 😉
People are free to be stupid, yes.
Yup, but that does not constitute a reason to censor him.
I respect NY and others for their stance and as a big supporter of getting vaccinated I am in full support of the artists right to want their music removed from Spotify.
For those calling Spotify to remove Rogan he is entitled to his opinions no matter how wrong they are. If people want to follow him that is their right.
As I've said, this is PR for NY to me. Rogan is FAR from the only noisy anti-vaxxer in the country. Frankly, I see no upside to any musician taking a righteous stance that they won't be on a platform w/him unless they've examined every single utterance by every single other artist on spotify, itunes, pandora, amazon, etc. for content w/which they disagree - racial, sexual, violence, white supremacy, misogyny. Artists can take a stance in far more productive ways - PSAs, vaxx requirements at venues, notes on their websites.
Seems Barry Manilow is not included in those who are asking to be removed
Seems Barry Manilow is not included in those who are asking to be removed
Whew!!! Thank God!!! I was going to go off the deep end if he was going to pull out of Spotify. All is good then.
Everyone has a plan, till you get punched in the face,
Not to worry about old Barry. Joanie Mitchell has joined in with her old boyfriend, Mr Neil. Off with Spotify's head for her. Guess that includes her old record, Both Sides Now, ha ha. Left Wing has to be the biggest mental illness out there.
Just in on AnOmoly's new YT. The plot thickens. Apparently Neil had sold half his music to a company called Hypnosis owned or joined with Blackstone who had hired former Pfizer Ceo, Geoffrey, I forget his last name. I guess that might turn you from lifelong rebel to Big Pharma Shill. Follow the money.
Just saw Joni Mitchell on TV and didn't recognize her. She looks like she is 95 years old now. Wow time is rolling right along. Here is recent footage of her.
She was on the news today to announce she stands with Neil Young and has terminated her relationship with Spotify. Her music no longer will be allowed.
They plan to play more Eric Clapton music to fill the void.
Neil Young stating he supports an authoritarian approach to fighting climate change reminds me of a man who is about my age (75) who is a member of the Sierra Club and their chief representative for my area. He recently told me that it is beginning to look as if Biden is going to fall far short of the radical changes needed in how America operates day to day to solve the dangerous climate crisis. Says Biden must declare a CLIMATE EMERGENCY as Bernie Sanders suggested a year ago and though these authoritarian emergency powers Biden then as FDR did in taking over industry and the economy in WW2, force the country to stop burning fossil fuels and order fossil fuels to stay in the ground. It will be costly and very inconvenient for many people as they will not be able to fly much or have electricity at every hour of the day and night and will walk or bicycle most places until they can get an electric car.
Okay I'm thinking. But what about the rest of the world? What about China, Russia etc. They are already run by a dictator of sorts but would they abandon fossil fuels to a similar extent?
And how could Biden win the next election or keep from being impeached by a Republican take over of Congress?
They better come up with new technology for carbon capture. Will will never abandon fossil fuels. To do such would start a civil war here.
David Crosby was on Howard Stern this past year and mentioned Joni is struggling with her health and can't sing anymore so is retired.
Sad to see the music heroes of my youth slowly passing on. At least their music with last forever.
IMHO there will never be another 10 year period for music like there was between 1965-1975. It was truly the Golden era for music, Live concerts and legendary FM radio.
@bill_graham You are absolutely right. 1965 to around 1975 was a monumental shift in popular music. The artists and song writers were the Bach and Beethovens of our era. The simplistic be bop rock of the 1950's was replaced by a level of creativity and musicianship that may never be duplicated in our time.
All the great albums during that 10 years are just unbelievable. And our main band was right there with AFE, Eat A Peach and Brothers and Sisters, albums that here 50 years later still sound great. They haven't aged at all.
These artists topped the big bands of the 1930's and 40's for creativity and equaled their musicianship.
One cable network ( I assume conservative) just had the story "Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in the embarrassing END to the hippie movement"
These rock icons of the hippie and protest movements now advocate for walking lock step with big brother, to follow Washington's orders or be slapped down and perhaps arrested.
And Young joins the radical far left green movement in calling for big brother authoritarianism to fight climate change.
I saw the clip on YouTube put I won't link it.
If the US shifts to big brother authoritarianism to fight climate change what is next? Will it last for decades? Will freedom return after the crisis is solved? Will those behind big brother authoritarianism to fight climate change include putting elections on hold to prevent a take over by politicians who disagree and run on overturning strict rules and regulations?? Would the Supreme Court be forced to the sidelines with these authoritarian emergency powers to block any possibility of the climate change rules and regulations from being ruled unconstitutional?
You are taking several leaps of “lack of faith”. We won’t go to authoritarianism for climate change. Sanders and AOC don’t speak for the entire Democratic Party. There is not the power or will to do it. Big Oil is too powerful and has too much influence to let that happen.
the fact is, the closest we got to an authoritarian state was 2017-2020.
the more likely doomsday scenario is the loss of free elections
back on topic: Neil and company are protesting what they believe are unjust business practices and are losing money in the process. I don’t think that is even close to the end of the hippy era
from what I know about the way Spotify (and others) treat artists, I don’t think anyone in the biz will feel bad for them, however this turns out.
I agree w/@billgraham that the 1960s-70s decade was a sea change for music - and movies (1970s being considered the best ever). Musicians have ALWAYS gotten shafted by someone - their own family (managers), record labels, promoters, tour operators, venues, sponsors. It's an industry built on talent in the hands of someone who can't - or doesn't know how to - make $ from it so I'm not ready to demonize spotify or any streaming platform as unique in artist treatment.
NY has always been an outlier & egotistical. He's not protesting unfair business practices; he's promoting himself by claiming his music can't be heard on the same platform as an anti-vaxxer. He never lost an outlet; he just moved everything over to apple. He's been playing one streamer against another for a while, using several simultaneously, & at one point took all his music down from streamers. He doesn't always give a reason nor does he have to. You're right. He loses money (mostly in penalties & legal fees not revenue), but it's not necessarily for a cause. Sometimes, it's a whim. At one point, he was anti-streaming technology.
In today's music business run by technology & hedge funds, NY is a non-entity. I'm suspicious that his fellow Canadian & childhood polio victim Mitchell has "joined" him in his protest given her age & poor health & his history of using her connections (she finally pawned him off on Buffalo Springfield). It doesn't matter to spotify because she's already on apple & youtube so she's still going to be heard & who knows if her request to her record label will translate to an early termination w/spotify.
Americans have always protested so I agree that's not a hippie method. Frankly, my concerns are less about whether anyone hears NY on vinyl, the car radio, or amazon than the future of democracy.
@stormyrider Yes you are correct. Authoritarianism is anathema to most Americans. Even during World War 2 when most Americans were on the same page about stopping Germany and Japan, my father told me about many here in my area irritated by long gas lines and gas rationing and forced blackouts at night to restrictions on travel to automobile manufacturers not allowed to build new automobiles etc etc. The emergency powers FDR had apparently was close to our President acting like a dictator.
Senator Sanders and AOC and some others want Biden to declare a national emergency over climate change and take over the economy as Roosevelt did in the 1940's.
But Biden just recently said again in a news conference that he is not a socialist but a capitalist. That he defeated the socialist in the primaries.
I guess it's not surprising my friend who runs the Serria Club in my area and carries placards denouncing oil and coal companies has decided an authoritarian emergency powers approach must be seized to fight climate change because people voting yes or no and trying to do it within a democracy doesn't work and is doomed to failure by the ignorance and complacency of most Americans.
It is interesting to me that Neil Young supports authoritarian government approach for Covid and climate change. When he was young ( excuse the pun) old Neil promoted individualism and tolerance of most views and was anti big brother with his rules, regulations, laws (especially drug and sexual laws), military and wars.
I've always enjoyed Neil Young's music. I guess many of us change as we grow older. I know I have. I haven't spent a penny on pot in years. I'm 75 now and when I was 45 it seemed to make me more accident prone, forgetful and early signs of lung issues. So I quit after close to 30 years of toking. Not enough that I couldn't work. But 30 years of red eyes some nights and every weekend.
One of my favorites.
Sometimes when I read posts I have the vision of someone screaming into the air "the world is coming to an end" running around waving their hands in the air...
if you're old enough to collect Social Security you can thank FDR...If you like the life you have and can deal with no cars were produced in the early 1940's because we had collectively agreed that winning the war against fascism was more important than a new car...you can thank FDR....you can also thank him for the term limits a president has. Or that we came out of the depression and a war to see the best years for the middle class we've ever had. Only to see every GOP administration other than Eisenhower do everything to destroy the middle class...turn our country against itself while clinging to conspiracies while telling experts they no nothing because Joe Rogan...a comedian with an opinion and microphone has the answers...sort of like a grifter from New York that "Tells it like it is" who would gladly phuck you in the ear for a penny...but he has the answer...and so does Joe...and taking a stance to have values and morals and ethic is now authoritarianism
Got it...
