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Author: Subject: The day Duane died, the facts the papers never heard

Zen Peach

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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 12:04 AM
I just want to add here what I have in my ABB bible of notes. (once again)

Shortly after leaving the Big House - around 5:45 PM -Duanee swerved to avoid a truck which was moving in the same direction, but which he had evidently not seen in time after it had turned onto the street. The bike skidded and turned over, apparently pinning Allman underneath as it traveled another 50 feet. Dixie and Candy had been following Duane but had not seen the accident happen. They came upon the accident shorty after it happened and stayed with him until an ambulance arrived. He reportedly ceased breathing twice in the ambulance but was revivied each time by mouth-to-mouth resuccitation. He died after two hours of emergency surgery at Macon Medical Center.
Dr. Charles Burden, the attending surgeon, said afterwards that any of the injuries sustained, a collapsed chest, resulting in massive internal injuries, including a ruptured coronary artery and a severely damaged liver - would have probably caused death, but that the combination of injuries left very little hope from the outset.


Windsinger, thank you for coming here and taking the time to explain what happened from your side of the sad events. I am going to add your post to my endless folder of ABB notes. Peace be with you...
I stand corrected on the direction the truck was headed on Hillcrest. I do believe Duane was trying to pass on the left when he lost control.




Zen Peach

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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 12:39 AM
I don't know the names of the streets or the directions, but from the first post in this thread, I gathered the truck was heading in one direction and turned left into the lumber yard. Duane was coming from the opposite direction and swerved to the left to go around the truck that would have been turning left but to Duane's right. It would make sense if the driver stopped before he turned left to make certain no one was coming and then Duane crested the hill. Any other thoughts on this?


Sometimes we can't choose the music life gives us - but we damn sure can choose how we dance!


Peach Master

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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 09:54 AM
found i n the gallery the road. Is this correct?

Below are two posts I made on "Anything Goes" ... the "Duane Allman's Last
Gig" thread from a few months ago :

posted on 9/22/2006
I can add some info to the truck debate. I grew up in
Macon ... was 17 when DA had his horrible accident. The
next summer ... of '72 ... I had a summer job with the
construction company that owned the truck. These are
the facts as I have always known them. The name of the
company and the driver exist in public record ... I'm not going
to name them here.
The truck had nothing to do with Marshal Lumber Co. ....
which was/is? just west of the intersection. PeterNelson is right...
the truck turned off of Hillcrest north into Bartlett St. ... because
it's destination was the constuction company's yard or shop. Look
at the Yahoo map ... the company was located on the corner of
Bartlett and the other street that parallels the railroad tracks ( I
don't remember the name of this street). This is where the truck
was heading that late Fri. afternoon ... back to base to park for the
weekend and to get a paycheck.
The company was general construction ... and they exist today and
have existed since the 1930's. Their specialty ( at least then ) was
pipeline construction. That particular summer I worked there we
were doing a water main extension project in Perry, GA ...about 25
miles south. PeterNelson is dead on about truck ...we called it the
boom truck ... but was probably about a late '60s year model. Have
you ever noticed how they prepare to do new water mains? They
stockpile the pipe at approximate intervals along the side of the
road ... then days later the crew comes through ...digging the trench
and laying the pipe. That is what the boom truck was used for ... to
hoist a length of pipe and lay it over into the ditch. I know for fact
this was the truck ... I both rode in and very occasionally drove it .

About the accident itself. I don't know as fact why the truck stopped
in midturn. I do know Bartlett is very narrow there.. the street was a
combo of industrial and dilapidated residential ( read shanty) ... curb
parking was the usual. I truly think he turned into the street ... and
1) had a very bad angle
2) encountered another car approaching or a parked car
3)maybe rough pavement.. but this truck wouldn't have shied from that..
plus it would have expected it because it traveled there every day
I don't believe DA's Harley hit the hook ... this would have been secured ...
usually hooked to the bumper area and then tension put on it.

I knew the driver ... we called him Chuck. Was about DA's age probably...
had a wife and kid ... clean-cut ... straight arrow type. He was a crew foreman.
Kinda quiet guy.... I'm sure he was tremendously affected by it all ... this was
only about 8 months after the accident. Who could have guessed that BO would
have a similar fate in just a few months ( he hit a city bus ).

There was some sort of settlement between the construction company and DA's
estate I believe ... insurance I guess .... is public record . Small $ amount if I remember
correctly ... something like $20,000

Also this :

posted on 10/13/2006
In those days , Hillcrest was a concrete roadway .... is probably blacktop now.
That is a pretty steep hill Duane was coming down ... the intersection of
Bartlett is very close to where the hill suddenly bottoms and flattens
out . If you're coming down that hill at a pretty good clip ... as DA reportedly
was ... you would kinda get that "stomachy" feel as you bottom out. Would
prob be a bit of a thrill to hit it just right on a motorcycle on a good day.
But when he had to adjust his steering due to the truck ... and given the
fork setup BD on Bass describes .... and hitting that bit of dip in the road ...
well ... that was a bad recipe. I can close my eyes and still see that intersection .... coming down that steep hill... it flattens very briefly where the intersection crosses.... and then slightly downhill again for about 20 yards or so before it flattens out.

Looking at this picture .. this is indeed the view Duane would have had as he came
down the hill ... this view is looking west. Big Dave is correct ... that is Bartlett on the
left ... Marshall Lumber Co. is in the background on the right. But before the lumber
company property you can barely see the opening to a street on the right. This is also
Bartlett St. ... it crosses Hillcrest and continues north apx. 1/2 mile ... then it tees into
another street running parallel to the railroad tracks.
The construction truck was coming from the opposite direction ... it was heading east
on Hillcrest. It never turned into Marshall Lumber Co. at all ... it was not associated with
Marshall or even the lumber business. It was a flatbed with a boom crane set up for
medium-duty use ... specifically in this instance it was used to hoist lengths of terracotta
pipe to construct water mains. The truck passed by the lumber company and turned
left (north) onto Bartlett .... it was heading back to headquarters at end of the work
day.... headquarters was located on Bartlett up near the railroad track end.

Windsinger contacted me thru PM a coupla days ago because she had found my earlier
posts and realized that I had known her husband ... however briefly. The construction
company was a family-run business. My family was friends with them ... same community,
church, school, even schoolbus. I had known them all my life ... that is how I came to have that summer job. Windsinger and I probably never met ... but we knew lots of the
same people ... and she mentioned family member names and trivia stuff to me so that
I have zero doubt as to her genuiness. I believe that she has known for all these years
that she had a real connection to all of this ... however tragic for all of the parties. She
had a story to tell and she has seeked out this forum specifically to do so. That is why her
first coupla posts concern this ... she may not have much interest in debating over which
version of Whipping Post is best, etc. I'm glad to hear from her ... thanks Windsinger!

One other thing ... looking at this pic see how seamless the
road appears. It has been blacktopped. Not the case in '71..
it was concrete ... constructed in apx. 20' sections with
expansion joint separations. It would have been a much
rougher ride than this pic makes it out to appear.

[Edited on 12/21/2006 by crosstownbar]


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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 10:17 AM
I've been you realize how many people have never been interviewed about so many things?! I wonder why no one ever followed that particular lead to get that side of the story for any of the books written so far!

My dear friend, this is a point I've been trying to make since we first met. This man passed away over 35 years ago, wasn't in this world for 25 full years, had tremendous impact on so very, very many lives. An impact that continues to evolve in so many ways.
Kunio comes to mind. So do the families that Pam has helped this Christmas. Derek Trucks and Susan. Their kids. Jimmy Herring. The scope of his legacy can't be underestimated. And I believe history will be kind to him, as later generations come to grasp what a visionary he was. I haven't seen the impact of sloppy journalism through your eyes, seen a family member misrepresented, seen friends inaccurately portrayed, seen people use people I knew and loved used for commercial purposes. But I have a passion for an accurate account of this amazing life, and the events around it. So many of those that were actually there, who actually lived it with him, are still available as original sources. But they won't always be. 'Twould have been nice had someone spent the day fishing or hanging out with the young truck driver, with tape recorder in hand, to get his reflections. Thank you for what you've brought to help us learn about the life and times of the man. I'm grateful for all the planned books from the original sources, and grateful for the work Randy Poe, Scott Freeman, and others have done. Perhaps, before I leave this world, there will be enough in the public domain to get things pretty accurate. I believe it is a tale worth telling, and telling accurately. For those to come, for those whose lives will continue to be affected by the way Howard Duane Allman chose to live his brief life.

Thank you Windsong for your contribution to the record. May you and your family be blessed with peace this holiday season.

....And thank you Pam for trying to keep it sorted out.


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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 10:21 AM
Dr. Charles Burden, the attending surgeon, said afterwards that any of the injuries sustained, a collapsed chest, resulting in massive internal injuries, including a ruptured coronary artery and a severely damaged liver - would have probably caused death, but that the combination of injuries left very little hope from the outset.

Dave, my wife knows the doctor and she is pretty sure his last name is spelled 'Burton'.


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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 10:27 AM
While it's great to get the facts right, and to get a fresh perspective from someone so close to one who was involved, it also is bringing back the horrible empty feeling of loss of which i haven't experienced in years.
I haven't felt the pain of loss in some time over this, and after reading the posting, and all the replys, it is becoming difficult to deal with...Again!
Don't get me wrong..I love the story, and glad it was posted, but the wave of sorrow that has come over me is overwhelming...I didn't think I had any tears left to shed over Duane..I was wrong.
Geeze, I never met the man, and it was more than half my lifetime ago..What is it?
Is it just the music? How can a guitar player, a man I have never met..have not much in common with, outside of our love of music, have such an emotional hold on me?
All I know is, it now feels like an open wound again that will never heal.
Again.I love all this, and i am glad for Windsingers posting. I could hardly respond when i first read it, and I will deal with my emotions.
I think I need a dose..of Duane.
Peace all,




Zen Peach

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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 10:28 AM
Thanks Dan. I will correct that. When transfering a southern drawl of voices to tapes I sometimes get my spelling off. I type what I hear in other words.


Good lucks never really been a strong suit of mine, can't get a nickel for a dime...

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Zen Peach

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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 10:48 AM
Crosstownbar, I appreciate you helping get the details of what happened the day of Duane's accident straight in this thread. All I know about it is what I have read, or heard though second hand accounts from people who were close to the situation, but weren't actually at the scene. After all, many of the people involved are gone or have fadded into anonymity. Candace is still in Macon, Chuck has passed, Dixie is living somewhere in anonymity. Windsinger, who is Chuck's wife, wasn't actually present at the accident scene but knows what Chuck went through. Like Buppalo said, it may not be a pretty picture, but accuracy is important.

Again, thanks to Windsinger for coming to the forum and posting her recollections.




True Peach

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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 11:37 AM
windsinger... THANKS for posting your recollections. Must still be hard. I understand....

Typing through tears...

I try and visit this place every time I'm in Macon. This area of Macon is today as it was on that fateful day....

God Bless Chuck and Duane....


"Political correctness is a doctrine -- fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rapidly promoted by mainstream media -- which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a piece of $hit by the clean end."


Maximum Peach

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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 01:27 PM
Thank you for your post, Windsinger.


"You shouldn't confuse things that are popular with things that are really good"--paraphrasing Bob Dylan.


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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 09:21 PM
Guys, I don't know where this is gonna pop up in the order of things, but at the bottom of the first page of postings, I just, (Finally, Thank goodness) found a 'reply' buttom to comment with........

First off ( a couple of you were already informed of this, privately, yesterday)

The meandering way i wound up arriving here, may be of interest to folks....

A couple of months ago, at a party, I happened to overhear a man, who's wife I casually know (and tease un-mercifully for some of her, uh, sewing techniques....I'm a construction details perfectionist, and she's better at a flashy show)

Well, His name is Stan.
I overhear him mention the ABB.

First chance that shows itself, I get him aside and tell him what I'd overheard.
Turns out he's musician.
Also turns out he's a big ABB fan.

So, I'm curious.
It's been a lotta years, and I've suddenly realized I'd never really found out what all the press had ultimately recorded about the whole history of the event.
(life in those days was a dailey, hand-to-mouth existance, I had learned shortcuts to surviving on so little, that a mouse would literally have starved to death in our home, if it had gotten past the cat we fed just enough of other folks scraps, to keep alive, but still fond of mice)

i.e. after the worst of the nightmare had passed us, we were too busy trying to keep our heads above water to ever try and find out what had happened, beyond what had involved us, directly. All the remaining years I had left, with Chuck (yes, that's how he was known) were all that way, right up until his own loss. After that, I had moved from the area, to the N. Ga. Mountains general area, where I/we, still live today. Chuck's ashes are exactly where he would have wanted, them, below a lovely wooded stone terrace, that's never known any other construction to it, but a plow, 100 + years ago.

We'd been given the land, (half an acre) to build on, someday, if we could ever find ourselves able to. He and I had come up here to walk over it, about a year or two before his accident. We'd stepped down a wet-weather-creek-made 'path', just past the tallest wild blueberry bush I'd ever seen, growing into the terrace, and when we'd turned back, to look at the terrace from that direction, we had both been struck by how wildly beautiful it looked, with the roots of a maple tree hugging the stones in one place, and a wild cherry in another. He'd made an intake of breath......and said something like "That would be Sooo beautiful....planted with Sweet Violets.........(that was the first I'd ever heard that he loved them)

But we secretly knew we'd never be able to move here. You dream when you're surviving, but you live on reality; and the reality of our situation was that our's would never be a life of comfort, except in our minds.

But, then he died. I've already given Dave the details of why it was totally impossible for us to even consider staying in Macon. It was some serious stuff that's too personal to share here, but it had Nothing to do with D.A.

So I left the city, as soon as I could pack what-ever belongings we'd be able to take with us. It took many months, as I was alone without family support, or physical help, and I was dealing with my grief in a state of mind, that defies sane understanding. I sleightly touched on that with D., but this morning, my present husband got the benefit of my 30 year battle flashback.........Thank God he's known me as long as he has. he understood ...didn't try and say any soothing words, just waited til it passed, as he knew it would.......sometimes the best thing to say, is nothing at all, just don't leave the room.....

(oh, yeah, I know I've gotten side-tracked, I do that, but I'm horribly sleep deprived, (note the hours of my posts) But there's just something I MUST say before I go on with the story high above now...

When I first posted that story. it was at the culmination of what I'm going to tell.
It was a late night decision, based on the series of events leading up to my finding y'all . I've been dealing with allergy re-actions/cold since last Friday morning (and yes, Dave, I Still went to that Christmas party on Sat. I/we plus our favorite fur princess, had been invited to AND offered crash space at !!! What a deal !!! Fun, good company, great food, and a soft warm bed to sleep in, for the night.....

(Dave, you remember me mentioning that I was viewing some things in my current life as an 'adventure' and other folks were telling me the situation 'sucked' ?)

Well, let me put it this way....that soft bed and warm room were something we haven't had around here in longer than I wanna think about...........BUT, that will be fixed in the coming months !!!
So guys, no pity packages !!!!

There's one thing I wanted to be sure to say/address, before I space out on y'all......

When I placed that first long post....:
I never thought ahead to what I expected to result from it.
It was late, and I was still sick, and wiped out, and all I was thinking of was the need to tell a story that would both clear up some questions, fill in some misconceptions, and let people see what was going on on the other side of that window-in-history, the one that for 30 years had always been clouded to public record.

What I had hoped for, I guess, somewhere in the back of my mind, was acceptance of my story, for the record.
Maybe, in some small way, I was looking for some closure to a dark time in my life.
Maybe I just wanted to face the lion, and hope he'd been fed.
Yes, it did cross my mind 'he' might still be looking for more, but I hoped time had soothed him to understanding....

The one thing I KNOW I had not been prepared to deal with, was so many kind hearts.

I came here, Not as an ABB fan to sing the praises of an idol.
I came here to seek some answers of my own, and, if I could find a way to do it,
post a true-as-I-knew-it, record and quietly leave again.

I confess.
Time and again, your posts brought me to tears.
I never foresaw that !!!

But, for heaven's sake !!! Don't ANYone apologise !!!!!!!!!
Acts/words of kindness should Never be reduced scales and bargaining.
If they are rewarded with tears, then they have been sincerely received and valued accordingly.......don't add tin to their original value by saying you were wrong in the offering.

I came here, barely knowing who D.A. was apart from the short time his existance crossed paths with my own.
And I sit here, now, knowing the names of real people with good hearts, who allowed me, in, and gave me warm hugs of the spirit.

My present husband, On Tues. I think it was, came in and strarted rattling off names of ABB songs he was Sure I MUST recognize........
When he started to tell me, I'd interrupted, "No, honey, I'm Sure I never knew any of their work......"
..So he blurts out the first one..
hang on, I Do know that one,......They did it !!! ??????
("Yeah !!!...I Knew you'd heard, it ! I've heard you SING it !!!" )

Poor man.
Y'all have NO idea how much he's had to suffer at the demand of my need to express myself, when I'm happily working on something, or cruising down the road on a long trip............

Back to the party.
So I ask Stan "How did you hear D.A. died?"
He thought a moment....."Peach truck .......a friend of mine wrote something on the band" peaches in it....
"How do you know?" (or words to that effect)
Because I was married, at the time, to the guy in the truck that was there, then.

Somehow the conversation got interrupted at that point.
But I'd gotten one answer as to what the public record had had to say.

Couple of months pass.
Dec. 16th arrives, night of the Christmas party.
I'm sick, but not too bad, yet, and I have this luchious black crepe blouse I'd had zero excuse to ever wear, and a long-tailed vintage (?) tux jacket I'd found couple of years ago at a thrift shop for a song. ...uhhhhh 20....
I'm Not missing that party !!!! I've got torn tight jeans, and that to top it, and I'm darn well gonna show those people I know how to be more than a plain-brown-hen....!

My sweet friend Mimi laughes in delight when she sees my outfit, and absolutely coos when I whirl to show my tails.......

(Note that name, She soon becomes important to how/why I came here.)

The party grows with guests. My son by Chuck, arrives, with one of his buddies who's shown an interest in joining our group,.....he's come to meet folks.
Finally 'Stan' arrives.
I coax him to come sit by me,.......I have more questions about D.A. He's more than happy to help me.
He volunteers "My buddy wrote a book on the subject,'s called 'Midnight Riders"....and his name is Scott Freeman.......I think the local library has a copy.......or maybe Mimi would loan you her's.......... "

(Huh, what's Mimi got to do with this ?)
"Oh, didn't I tell you? she's his sister"

Small world.
35 years and D.A.'s life, and mine have been no-where near each other.
Suddenly we've met again in the middle of a time warp.

I catch Mimi as she's leaving.
I urgently request a bit of her time.
I make it short.

Her brother wrote a book on D.A. ?
(YEAH!!!) (she offers to loan her's to me, if I want to read it)

I let her know my husband was the man in the 'truck' in the story.
She looks stunned "Oh Shara !!!!! He was your Husband !!!!??? the one who died ! ?, Oh, mi gosh, I never knew !
No reason she should have.......we'd known each other 10 years, my marriage hadn't made it that far (That one) it just wasn't the sort of thing we usually talked about...we're both 'artsy' and sometimes writers, we talked 600 year old history....rarely, if ever, current history.

I told her Stan thought SF's book would be helpful to me, and I thought maybe SF might, as a writer, be interested in Chuck's side-of-the-window.
She got excited. Oh ! she was Sure he would be !!!! sure he'd wanna talk to me, perhaps even meet me.......I told her an e-mail exchange would most likely be less time consuming,.....I can be long-winded when I'm telling a story,...lotsa facts can get lost as the listener falls asleep......besides, I Really didn't have much to share, just some little stuff.

She said she'd be talking to him soon, she'd tell him, get him to contact me.

That was Sat. eve, last.
Sunday, I come home to sleep for over 24 hours, into Monday.
I check my e-mail, letter from Mimi,......she's talked to her brother, on Sunday, I Should be hearing from his soon.
By Monday eve, no word from SF
By Tues. eve, still no word.
I'm getting antsy for answers, now that I've decided to get this mystery solved.
I start doing a net search. It's something to 'do' I'm feeling better, but still too sick to get back to the toil kind of work needed doing,here.....and I'm bored when my hands are idle. Chuck wasn't the only work-a-holic in this family........
So, eventually, I find y'all, and the rest is history......(did I mention I Love history ? and fairy tales with happy endings.......oh, yeah, and I found H (present mate) on a pad in a pond, in rusty chainmail armor.......
Diana/Shara/winsinger careful the Black-haired Irishmen in the deep forrests.......
sometimes they turn into the Best husbands, if ya kiss um right !!!


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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 09:40 PM
Thanx for your thoughts,Windsinger.


Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty,well preserved body,but rather to skid in broadside,a guitar in one hand,a beer in the other,thoroughly used up, totally worn out,proclaiming loudly: WOW.....What a Ride!


Universal Peach

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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 10:08 PM
My God. My God...

Windsinger, read your first post last night with tears in my eyes. It was a beautiful thing that you shared such a tragic part of your life (& ours, vicariously) with us. It chocked me up too much to reply. It was such a tragic lose for us all. You've done it again tonight with your posting. You have a wonderful way of sharing your experiences and relating them in a way we here find compelling and poignant and relate so much to our common bonds.

I hope the sharing of experience with us is catharthic for you & you gain some amount of peace and closure for yourself. May you only find happiness from here on.

Thank you for sharing.
...From a formerly black haired (part)Irishman.




Zen Peach

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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 10:34 PM
Late this morning/early afternoon I emailed Scott Freeman the link to this thread. I kid you I just saw the latest windsong post.
Coincidence? I don't think so a bit.


Good lucks never really been a strong suit of mine, can't get a nickel for a dime...

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  posted on 12/21/2006 at 11:20 PM

So there never was any blame to be given here other than Duane, true to form, going much faster than everyone else. He died like he lived, trying to get airborn.

dobroden, thanks for expressing such sweet sadness...

windsinger, the truth always seems to have a certain unmistakable ring to it. so glad you came to share with this family that you are now a part of...

skydog, sail on brother, sail on...


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  posted on 12/22/2006 at 01:50 AM

I feel deeply honored that windsinger has chosen to share her stories with our famABBly. And I am so happy that we have a new famABBly member -- so eloquent and so loving -- with such a tenuous yet tragic link to the Allman Brothers Band.

Windsinger, I hope you come to visit with us often!


"Don't Ask Why"

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  posted on 12/22/2006 at 01:58 AM
This was written, on/for/at the 'anything goes forum' but I wanted to be sure to share this isolated part, here, for anyone who may not go there and might miss it.

This is the Only time I will be making y'all suffer through one of just be greatful for small favors, and even more greatful I'll never sing here.........
<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>> Windsinger

(in response to Rhydethwind's question)

"No, I never morned for his loss to himself, only for my own , of losing him from the reality of my own world. The lightness of heart he introduced into my life, when I most needed it, the endless moments of self-abandoned peels of laughter he inspired in me.......THOSE are the Treasures to hold tightly to !!!"

There was a poem, I won't name the author


For heaven's sake
don't pity me
for love I've had and lost.

The years were good!
the time was sweet!
whatever it has cost.

To pity me would
cloud the time
the time I treasure so

I've had his smile
I had his heart
His spirit didn't go !

So waste no tears
or sympathy for days
I didn't lose.

I wouldn't trade
a single one, for tears
I couldn't use.

(rdw, 12-21-06)

Consider that my thankyou, and my answer, for all the kindness I never expected to ever discover when I came here.


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  posted on 12/22/2006 at 10:54 AM
Have no doubt--none at all.....There is a powerful spiritual force at work among us. I can't explain it, but I know it is a force for good, and I have a role to play in it, as do many of you. So many things like this are playing themselves out, people finding each other, closure, issues resolved. While there is still time. As a Christian, I hope Duane is directly involved, helping. Maybe given a bit more involvement? I can't explain, don't understand. But I don't believe Windsinger's finding us came through a series of random events.

Merry Christmas to all of us.


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A Peach Supreme

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  posted on 12/22/2006 at 10:58 AM
Windsinger, Thanks for posting your memories here. May God bless you.




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  posted on 12/22/2006 at 11:06 AM
wild. there are so many conicidences and odd events that are linked to this band, to our lives, etc.

it helps me alot to see that we are all connected to a certain extent. its very powerful.

thanks to this thread as well, because it was by clicking on the link BigDave posted to the Social Security DB that i found out the news of my own fathers passing. Very recently i had begun to seek some closure to that relationship, and as usual, the band and this place, helped to facilitate that.

thank you very much for sharing your story windsinger. it is nice to hear your words, and i hope you find abundant health and prosperity in the coming years.



you know there just ain't no telling

what a satisfied girl will do.

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Zen Peach

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  posted on 12/22/2006 at 12:48 PM

Can someone here who has been there, because I haven't, tell me if that is a fire hydrant on that street corner to the left? I will explain why I ask a little later.


Good lucks never really been a strong suit of mine, can't get a nickel for a dime...

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Zen Peach

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  posted on 12/22/2006 at 01:01 PM
It looks like a hydrant to me in the photo.


Sometimes we can't choose the music life gives us - but we damn sure can choose how we dance!


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  posted on 12/22/2006 at 05:46 PM
looks like one to me too.
Windsinger, who can see things better at a 2 inch distance than the end of my arm
Now, what's up ?

Oh yeah, I went to bed around 4:30 am this morn, took the phone off the hook, took something prescription I rarely use, to ensure I slept, and then planned to sleep til,...well, about 'now' ( 5/6 pm-ish) today, or longer. One hour's sleep in 3 days had had me so messed up, that when I sneezed, I thought I should be looking down from the ceiling going "wow ! it's So cool up here !!"

so much for the plans of mice and men.

I passed out, on clue.

Only to awaken (at 1 pm, today) to the (YUCK!) taste of kitty paws treading back and fort across my face (and mouth) and insistant demands I get up and 'do' something........

H. finally alerted me to the fact my son (by C.) was outside hollering "Mom ! Oh, Mom !"
anyway, (yawn) I'll be back in a minute......did anyone ever find Scott while I was napping ?


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  posted on 12/22/2006 at 05:51 PM
It looks like a fire hydrant. Water utilities usually paint them different colors, that one looks green, to indicate to fire departments how much water pressure that particular hydrant can provide in case of a fire.


"Y'all know the fire marshal...the cat that can't get the job as a policeman." Duane Allman


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  posted on 12/22/2006 at 08:14 PM

posted on 12/22/06 at 20:05
Bigann posted something I'd like to comment on, now that I know how that's done here.

[That happens sometimes when the whole story isn't known. As for the blood...I know in times of stress we actually see our own blood rushing through our's what's known as 'seeing red.' Perhaps that's what happened to make the young man believe Duane was bleeding. ]

I'd never thought anything about what C. had told me, about what he'd seen at the accident. There's been a bad accident, someone had died. could there 'not' be that ?
What I'd repeated had just been 'reporting' what I knew and/or had directly heard from someone/people who had.

If part of that was contrary to what was somehow known to be otherwise, then it didn't mean 'I 'wasn't for real, I've pointed out to someone,....the story I unfolded for y'all was in pretty complicated/woven details.......I'd have to be awfully smart, to create something like that from my imagination, and for what purpose ? To see if it might be believed, and see if it would eventually come back around as 'truth' ?

Any ole way
back to the 'smart' part.
nope, not me.
not the dumbest cookie in the jar, just have too bad a memory for remembering 'created' stuff....i.e. I can't lie worth a flip, because I think it's a worthless waste of brain cells to keep trying to remember which creative facts went in what order. (and, I may add, I don't have the required arrogance to believe I'm too smart to get found out/caught...and I'm terrified of facing the consequences of digging myself out of one of those firing squad situations.....:<.......

(Real facts, I have a mind that stays on the 'record' button, either as actual words, or a mental picture of what they represent, until they're solidly recorded. Then they tend to stick with me, until needed)

So, think about it.
If I'd been smart enough to fabricate such a story, wouldn't I have also been smart enough to make sure there weren't those blatant discrepencies about the blood ?

Which brings me to something I suddenly need to address regarding Chuck, himself.
Bigann's (see above explanation by her) struck a cord with me, about something peculiar about him during times of stress.
The 'seeing red' thing.

I never knew that could 'happen'
I mean I just thought it was some sort of creative/abstract expression for trying to say someone was beyond a certain point of 'upset'
I never knew it had a very real physical something tied to it.

I knew Chuck had SOME sort of apparent problems with his vision, when he became upset beyond a certain point......I'd never asked him exactly what that was. But I'd witnessed it first hand on so many occassions. I'd always been far more concerned with the need to calm the situation, rather than try to analize his physical re-action to it.

But I can tell you what I 'saw'
When he was totally stressed out, he went, what I kept thinking of as 'blind'

I don't mean he couldn't see, at all, but it was clear that 'something' was wrong with his vision, because there would be a glazed look to his face, and he had a strong re-action to sound and movement and yet he couldn't seem to recognize faces, At All !!!

I wasn't afraid of him, ever, but twice.
There were two occassions when I stood directly in front of him, when he was in this state, in the closest of the two, I was a mere arm's length away, holding my infant son in my arms.
I'd gone to the back door. It was getting dark and I was wondering why C. had not yet come in from putting in the fence for the children in the back yard. The back porch light was on, but I couldn't see him beyond it. So I finally, cheerfully called out into the darkness "Shawn wants to see his daddy, where are you ? "

Something suddenly went 'wrong' out in the darkness in the yard.
The next thing I knew, C. was suddenly standing in front of me, that frightening glazed look in his eyes, and I watched in horror as his arms moved to swing something at my head from shoulder level,....a heavy come-a-long he'd been using to tighten the fence with. The baby's head was against my shoulder, he was only months old.

You have not known fear, until you have been that close up to seeing someone you love/who loves you, looking right through you, in total lack of recognition, and about to
.......well, I've painted the picture......
I screamed out his name, and he blinked, and clearly saw us, now.
He looked confused.
The bunched muscles in his arms and shoulders suddenly went lax, and the heavy tool dropped down to his side, then to the ground as he released it. He looked at me a moment longer, almost childlike in his confusion, and I wanted to reach out and touch him, he looked so bewildered.
But my heart was still racing wildly in fear of what had almost happened and I burst into tears and fled back into the safety of the house, my baby clutched tightly to my shoulder.

As I was turning away, out of the corner of my eye, I saw him, too, turn back toward the dark yard, shoulders slumped.

When he finally came in, later, we didn't speak of what had happened/almost happened.
It was clear he didn't want to.

Was he 'seeing red' ?
He was 'seeing' Something.....but he clearly wasn't 'seeing' me and the baby.

So the 'red' Bigann explained about is as good an explanation as any, and so, perhaps the Oct. 29 day, that's what was actually going on when he told me what he did about what he's seen. I'm going to do a net search and see if I can find out more about this condition,..........I talked to Shawn about this while he was here today. he said it was something he also wanted to find out more about.. He'd long ago heard this story, but this new info. puts a new light on it.

Before I get out of this one, and onto a surprise I'm gonna see if I can put up here, there's one more possibility I wanna toss into this part of things.

I know, that accident reports, and (perhaps death certificates/coroner's reports) (i.e. public records) give a detailed list of observable injuries.
But I was un-aware that any of these things listed an actual physical accounting of the amount of blood on or surrounding the victim. Wouldn't only an actual witness be likely to make a mental/verbal note of such a thing ?

I mean I don't know where y'all found out that there was none, dispite him apparently losing his helmet during the accident and making what I understand to be the equivelent to a 110 +, mph impact onto a solid concret surface, then, as I understand, sliding quite aways afterward......

i.e. after C's accident, I read his accident report closely, wanting to know what happened, and I clearly read that it had taken (x-amount of hours, 3, I think it said, but it may have been 4)(definately no less) hours, 'with-the-jaws-of-life' just to get to ('him')
and his condition was recorded as "Crushed, completely, from the waist, up"
but no where, was there any kind of description to the amount of , well, you know, on the scene. It simply wasn't there. (if it had been, what use would it have been to make a note of it....
that would have been like saying a person in that condition 'appeared dead'
i.e. stating the obvious.

When they returned his wallet, hair comb, keys, and coins from his pocket to me (they kept his DL, and there was no paper $ in the bag I got)(but that didn't bother me, he tended to have me doll out his lunch money to him dailey, a whole 2 dollars, saying if that's all he had on him, no-one could try and bum it off of him as apparently was normal where he worked. The accident had happed around 3 pm, he'd already had lunch)

Anyway, dispite his injuries, there was no apparent blood on the items returned to me.

But when I searched through his wallet, looking for any small personal stuff, I found several small pieces of paper (notes he'd tucked in with things like job site directions, or lists, the usual stuff one tucks away) that were red with (his DNA)

Anyway, I'm not mentioning any of this to start some sort of arguement about things already generally believed. Just tossing it in as another something to be considered since it had been that statement of C's regarding the amount of dna in physical presence that had apparently caused a couple of folks to doubt my idenity at the beginning. Think about it.
Windsinger, off to try and stick that surprise in here

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