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Author: Subject: Opening Up America Again

Zen Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 12:46 PM
quote:
quote:
"The new normal"How about a couple of examples detailing exactly what this means?

I used CA Gov. Gavin Newsom's description of what restaurants will look like in my post.


There's a problem right off the bat, like California is a gleaming example of how ANYTHING should be done.

 

____________________
Funny, the very same people yelling, "Wear a mask"! for the safety of others are the very same people from whom we hear nary a whimper about the riots.

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 12:48 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
"The new normal"How about a couple of examples detailing exactly what this means?

I used CA Gov. Gavin Newsom's description of what restaurants will look like in my post.


There's a problem right off the bat, like California is a gleaming example of how ANYTHING should be done.


Gavin Newsom and Eric Garcetti are f'n delusional morons. And I have voted Democrat all my life. But no more. And no that does not mean I will vote for Trump. Most probably will mean I won't vote at all.

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 12:54 PM
So this happened during the lockdown. So explain to me again how we were protecting those in nursing homes?

5,368 dead and counting: An investigation of state failures as crisis rampaged through N.J. nursing homes

https://www.nj.com/coronavirus/2020/05/5300-dead-and-counting-an-investigat ion-of-state-failures-as-crisis-rampaged-through-nj-nursing-homes.html




 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 02:26 PM
quote:
And yet another huge chunk of the Union written off in a one-liner


Just California and New York, Lived in California most of my and finally got out. Taxes and laws for everything, both of these states are the home of the mantra, "Well, we have to do something because doing something certainly looks better than doing nothing". Too much Government, too many people and taxes on everything but the air you breath.

quote:
Gavin Newsom and Eric Garcetti are f'n delusional morons. And I have voted Democrat all my life. But no more.


Different poster, but I agree with his decision and assessment. Both of these gents are the epitome of confusing "leadership" with the feeling that their fingerprints have to be on everything. Imagine arresting windsurfers while releasing criminals from jail because of overcrowding. "Let's put ocean goers into the same cells that were just inhabited by a criminal"....Genius.

California and New York, no thank you.

And here's another liberal gem while I am at it. I love the Pro-Abortion chant "My body, my choice"....Does this apply to the wearing of masks?

 

____________________
Funny, the very same people yelling, "Wear a mask"! for the safety of others are the very same people from whom we hear nary a whimper about the riots.

 

True Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 02:31 PM
quote:
Nevermind. If you don't get why I laughed. Probably good we all don't think alike.


I get why you laughed. Two interpretations in what he wrote.One could've been interpreted as humorous, the other one not. I understand. I went with not.

...and it's "piacere". Italian.


 

True Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 02:37 PM
quote:
quote:
And yet another huge chunk of the Union written off in a one-liner


Just California and New York, Lived in California most of my and finally got out. Taxes and laws for everything, both of these states are the home of the mantra, "Well, we have to do something because doing something certainly looks better than doing nothing". Too much Government, too many people and taxes on everything but the air you breath.

quote:
Gavin Newsom and Eric Garcetti are f'n delusional morons. And I have voted Democrat all my life. But no more.


Different poster, but I agree with his decision and assessment. Both of these gents are the epitome of confusing "leadership" with the feeling that their fingerprints have to be on everything. Imagine arresting windsurfers while releasing criminals from jail because of overcrowding. "Let's put ocean goers into the same cells that were just inhabited by a criminal"....Genius.

California and New York, no thank you.

And here's another liberal gem while I am at it. I love the Pro-Abortion chant "My body, my choice"....Does this apply to the wearing of masks?
You could infect and possibly kill someone or several people with your careless attitude, how does this relate to abortion?.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 02:39 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
And yet another huge chunk of the Union written off in a one-liner


Just California and New York, Lived in California most of my and finally got out. Taxes and laws for everything, both of these states are the home of the mantra, "Well, we have to do something because doing something certainly looks better than doing nothing". Too much Government, too many people and taxes on everything but the air you breath.

quote:
Gavin Newsom and Eric Garcetti are f'n delusional morons. And I have voted Democrat all my life. But no more.


Different poster, but I agree with his decision and assessment. Both of these gents are the epitome of confusing "leadership" with the feeling that their fingerprints have to be on everything. Imagine arresting windsurfers while releasing criminals from jail because of overcrowding. "Let's put ocean goers into the same cells that were just inhabited by a criminal"....Genius.

California and New York, no thank you.

And here's another liberal gem while I am at it. I love the Pro-Abortion chant "My body, my choice"....Does this apply to the wearing of masks?
You could infect and possibly kill someone or several people with your careless attitude, how does this relate to abortion?.


Dude I have lost all respect for you with your comment of "I hope you lose everything"..Take a hike

 

____________________
Funny, the very same people yelling, "Wear a mask"! for the safety of others are the very same people from whom we hear nary a whimper about the riots.

 

World Class Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 02:52 PM
quote:
And here's another liberal gem while I am at it. I love the Pro-Abortion chant "My body, my choice"....Does this apply to the wearing of masks?



no, it doesn't apply to masks. Masks protect other people.

If you are by yourself on a trail or in the street, fine.

But if you are in a store, breathing on items etc, you are affecting other people.

Personal freedom implies that your choices aren't harming others.

 

____________________

 

True Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 03:39 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
And yet another huge chunk of the Union written off in a one-liner


Just California and New York, Lived in California most of my and finally got out. Taxes and laws for everything, both of these states are the home of the mantra, "Well, we have to do something because doing something certainly looks better than doing nothing". Too much Government, too many people and taxes on everything but the air you breath.

quote:
Gavin Newsom and Eric Garcetti are f'n delusional morons. And I have voted Democrat all my life. But no more.


Different poster, but I agree with his decision and assessment. Both of these gents are the epitome of confusing "leadership" with the feeling that their fingerprints have to be on everything. Imagine arresting windsurfers while releasing criminals from jail because of overcrowding. "Let's put ocean goers into the same cells that were just inhabited by a criminal"....Genius.

California and New York, no thank you.

And here's another liberal gem while I am at it. I love the Pro-Abortion chant "My body, my choice"....Does this apply to the wearing of masks?
You could infect and possibly kill someone or several people with your careless attitude, how does this relate to abortion?.


Dude I have lost all respect for you with your comment of "I hope you lose everything"..Take a hike
Dude I have no respect for YOU, for your support trump and his agenda of destroying this country, I hope YOU suffer for your choices.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 04:22 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
quote:
And yet another huge chunk of the Union written off in a one-liner


Just California and New York, Lived in California most of my and finally got out. Taxes and laws for everything, both of these states are the home of the mantra, "Well, we have to do something because doing something certainly looks better than doing nothing". Too much Government, too many people and taxes on everything but the air you breath.

quote:
Gavin Newsom and Eric Garcetti are f'n delusional morons. And I have voted Democrat all my life. But no more.


Different poster, but I agree with his decision and assessment. Both of these gents are the epitome of confusing "leadership" with the feeling that their fingerprints have to be on everything. Imagine arresting windsurfers while releasing criminals from jail because of overcrowding. "Let's put ocean goers into the same cells that were just inhabited by a criminal"....Genius.

California and New York, no thank you.

And here's another liberal gem while I am at it. I love the Pro-Abortion chant "My body, my choice"....Does this apply to the wearing of masks?
You could infect and possibly kill someone or several people with your careless attitude, how does this relate to abortion?.


Dude I have lost all respect for you with your comment of "I hope you lose everything"..Take a hike
Dude I have no respect for YOU, for your support trump and his agenda of destroying this country, I hope YOU suffer for your choices.


You remain a real class act.

 

____________________
Funny, the very same people yelling, "Wear a mask"! for the safety of others are the very same people from whom we hear nary a whimper about the riots.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 04:43 PM
quote:
Personal freedom implies that your choices aren't harming others.


Interesting choice of words there: "Implies" as in "Strongly suggests".

May I suggest that you come up with absolutely irrefutable scientific proof that NOT wearing a mask "harms others" before I give up any of my rights that may only suppress or eliminate your fears.

 

____________________
Funny, the very same people yelling, "Wear a mask"! for the safety of others are the very same people from whom we hear nary a whimper about the riots.

 

True Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 05:38 PM
quote:
quote:
Personal freedom implies that your choices aren't harming others.


Interesting choice of words there: "Implies" as in "Strongly suggests".

May I suggest that you come up with absolutely irrefutable scientific proof that NOT wearing a mask "harms others" before I give up any of my rights that may only suppress or eliminate your fears.
if YOU are COVID19 positive, you likely will not know it, so not wearing a mask or keeping a distance from people WILL infect/possible kill others. YOU politicizing this issue is not only dumb but dangerous. saying "liberals" are the ones being too cautious and considerate of others lives and health is also like admitting, conservative trump lovers are inconsiderate, wreck-less morons, who think only of themselves. BTW, your statement that Biden being of of the same moral character as trump was pretty dumb too, big veetus.

[Edited on 5/20/2020 by pops42]

 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 06:18 PM
quote:
quote:
Personal freedom implies that your choices aren't harming others.


Interesting choice of words there: "Implies" as in "Strongly suggests".

May I suggest that you come up with absolutely irrefutable scientific proof that NOT wearing a mask "harms others" before I give up any of my rights that may only suppress or eliminate your fears.


I was just reading my copy of the Constitution, and for the life of me I couldn't find anywhere any mention of having the right to not have to wear a mask. Can you please direct me to where I can find that right in the Constitution?

 

True Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 06:32 PM
quote:
quote:
Personal freedom implies that your choices aren't harming others.


Interesting choice of words there: "Implies" as in "Strongly suggests".

May I suggest that you come up with absolutely irrefutable scientific proof that NOT wearing a mask "harms others" before I give up any of my rights that may only suppress or eliminate your fears.


Vince, I agree with you damn near all the time but, as I may have said earlier, not here.
Let me ask you this, and mind you, I'm not concerned all that much, just mildly curious, after all, you do you and I'll do me...
Are you not wearing a mask BC it's your right not to, a, b, there's no proof it works aside from alleviating fear and paranoia, c, the whole mess is overblown by the media. .or some other reason?
In all this time, what, 8, 10 weeks? I haven't asked one person why they don't wear one. You may have answered definitively prior but I missed it.
Thanks

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 5/20/2020 at 09:08 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
Personal freedom implies that your choices aren't harming others.


Interesting choice of words there: "Implies" as in "Strongly suggests".

May I suggest that you come up with absolutely irrefutable scientific proof that NOT wearing a mask "harms others" before I give up any of my rights that may only suppress or eliminate your fears.


Vince, I agree with you damn near all the time but, as I may have said earlier, not here.
Let me ask you this, and mind you, I'm not concerned all that much, just mildly curious, after all, you do you and I'll do me...
Are you not wearing a mask BC it's your right not to, a, b, there's no proof it works aside from alleviating fear and paranoia, c, the whole mess is overblown by the media. .or some other reason?
In all this time, what, 8, 10 weeks? I haven't asked one person why they don't wear one. You may have answered definitively prior but I missed it.
Thanks


No worries and your answer is right there "there's no proof it works aside from alleviating fear and paranoia,... the whole mess is overblown by the media". Both of these. If the only effect from wearing a mask is "alleviating fear" then the media has won and we've all lost. Everyday is Halloween! But, I will add, I certainly respect the social distancing requests and practice that....

 

____________________
Funny, the very same people yelling, "Wear a mask"! for the safety of others are the very same people from whom we hear nary a whimper about the riots.

 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 5/21/2020 at 06:49 AM
There's a lot of noise in this thread. We have 2 really good sources of information on this site (cyclone & stormyrider). Their jobs & specilizations are certainly closer subject matter experts than the rest of the "specialists" on this topic. I'll defer to these 2 posters. Thanks to the 2 of you for your input and clarifications.
 

True Peach



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  posted on 5/21/2020 at 07:39 AM
quote:


Save your fight for the vaccines that are being rushed through and wll be forced upon us without adequate testing. Then you may well find me in your corner, assuming your stand on rights includes vaccination. The vaccine stuff is going to be some serious controversy - this mask business is nothing compared to what is coming.


I'm actually concerned also.

Because of the rush, are dangers going to be overlooked in the to push this thing out and mass vaccinate everyone? It's going to have to come out in stages, so the first ones to get it will provide some further evidence of it's safety and effectiveness.

I really don't like to take medicine for anything, 9 times out of 10 I just deal with whatever. I got a flu shot one year and got sick twice that winter. Maybe not related, but I've never had another flu shot since.

I would want to get this vaccine, but really, I want to see how it goes first. I totally share your thoughts BrerRabbit.

 

Extreme Peach



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  posted on 5/21/2020 at 07:58 AM
quote:
There's a lot of noise in this thread. We have 2 really good sources of information on this site (cyclone & stormyrider). Their jobs & specilizations are certainly closer subject matter experts than the rest of the "specialists" on this topic. I'll defer to these 2 posters. Thanks to the 2 of you for your input and clarifications.

The entire time I was reading the last 2 pages of this thread, I kept thinking "stormyrider has explained the importance of masks earlier so why on earth are people demanding scientific facts?" Of course, I realize that the scientific fact has to come from a source acceptable to the questioner & then the provider of the source has to be interrogated as though they were defending a PhD dissertation, but I don't think we're going to get a more solid source than a practicing cardiologist.

Thanks, Martin, for your confidence, but we all have opinions. I participate in threads I find interesting or in which I might be able to clarify something or start topics that interest me (I'm fairly certain I'm the only one who really cared about impeachment - the process not the outcome). I have expertise in a couple of areas & point it out when it's relevant, but don't expect anyone to defer to me. I look forward to stormyrider's posts on many topics & appreciate his willingness to explain medicalese in basic language.

Most of us have expertise in something - a lot of us ABB followers from the 1970s have been working for a long time - so I weigh their comments more heavily than others. I also just skip comments from lazy noisemakers who can't be bothered to look up the most basic things & I appreciate the jokes in an attempt to lighten up or deflect the nasty place the thread is headed.

Mostly, I post my opinions. On the topic of masks, for the life of me, I don't know what the downside of wearing one around people not living in our households is. Presumably, the goal for all of us is to survive COVID19, make our way out into the world (although there's not much open yet in NYC), & eventually be rid of this infectious disease. If wearing a mask is useful, why not do it?

Thanks Martin for your posts about the market/economy & amazing musical knowledge. I defer to you, but I don't understand why anyone thinks GA was taking the lead in jump-starting the national economy by opening tattoo parlors, beach shops, & patio restaurants at 50% capacity. I can't imagine why anyone other than seasonal business owners would go to the expense of opening when their laid off employees are getting unemployment benefits (some at even higher rates than their former salaries) & rent is forgiven through July 31 when they have no guarantee patrons are ready to return. That's a whole thread!!!



 

True Peach



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  posted on 5/21/2020 at 09:18 AM
quote:
There's a lot of noise in this thread. We have 2 really good sources of information on this site (cyclone & stormyrider). Their jobs & specilizations are certainly closer subject matter experts than the rest of the "specialists" on this topic. I'll defer to these 2 posters. Thanks to the 2 of you for your input and clarifications.


What...no gina?

Seriously though, with all respect to those two (much deserved), whose posts I pay attention to, I defer to my PCP and cardiologist. I mean, who doesn't?
In the end, wearing one or not is a choice.

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 5/21/2020 at 01:10 PM
INteresting. Will see where it goes.

https://news.yahoo.com/as-more-states-reopen-georgia-defies-predictions-of- coronavirus-resurgence-whats-the-lesson-for-the-rest-of-the-country-1647348 15.html

 

World Class Peach



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  posted on 5/21/2020 at 01:47 PM
quote:
INteresting. Will see where it goes.

https://news.yahoo.com/as-more-states-reopen-georgia-defies-predictions-of- coronavirus-resurgence-whats-the-lesson-for-the-rest-of-the-country-1647348 15.html


yes
Florida and Texas have clearly increased since re-opening.

and this, from the article

quote:
In a sign, perhaps, of things to come, churches in both Texas and Georgia that briefly reopened for in-person worship services have had to close again as the virus spread in their pews. Holy Ghost Catholic Church in Houston closed after five leaders tested positive last weekend, following the death of one priest who had been diagnosed with pneumonia. In Ringgold, Ga., Catoosa Baptist Tabernacle started in-person services again in late April but stopped on May 11 after learning that members of several families had contracted the virus. And on Tuesday the CDC released a report about an outbreak in March at a rural Arkansas church: Of the 92 people who attended the church between March 6 and March 11, 35 tested positive and three died, the report said. Investigators found that 26 other contacts of these churchgoers later tested positive and one died.

 

____________________

 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 5/21/2020 at 03:10 PM
quote:
quote:
INteresting. Will see where it goes.

https://news.yahoo.com/as-more-states-reopen-georgia-defies-predictions-of- coronavirus-resurgence-whats-the-lesson-for-the-rest-of-the-country-1647348 15.html


yes
Florida and Texas have clearly increased since re-opening.

and this, from the article

quote:
In a sign, perhaps, of things to come, churches in both Texas and Georgia that briefly reopened for in-person worship services have had to close again as the virus spread in their pews. Holy Ghost Catholic Church in Houston closed after five leaders tested positive last weekend, following the death of one priest who had been diagnosed with pneumonia. In Ringgold, Ga., Catoosa Baptist Tabernacle started in-person services again in late April but stopped on May 11 after learning that members of several families had contracted the virus. And on Tuesday the CDC released a report about an outbreak in March at a rural Arkansas church: Of the 92 people who attended the church between March 6 and March 11, 35 tested positive and three died, the report said. Investigators found that 26 other contacts of these churchgoers later tested positive and one died.



And that paragraph certainly seems like cause & effect.

 

True Peach



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  posted on 5/21/2020 at 03:22 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
INteresting. Will see where it goes.

https://news.yahoo.com/as-more-states-reopen-georgia-defies-predictions-of- coronavirus-resurgence-whats-the-lesson-for-the-rest-of-the-country-1647348 15.html


yes
Florida and Texas have clearly increased since re-opening.

and this, from the article

quote:
In a sign, perhaps, of things to come, churches in both Texas and Georgia that briefly reopened for in-person worship services have had to close again as the virus spread in their pews. Holy Ghost Catholic Church in Houston closed after five leaders tested positive last weekend, following the death of one priest who had been diagnosed with pneumonia. In Ringgold, Ga., Catoosa Baptist Tabernacle started in-person services again in late April but stopped on May 11 after learning that members of several families had contracted the virus. And on Tuesday the CDC released a report about an outbreak in March at a rural Arkansas church: Of the 92 people who attended the church between March 6 and March 11, 35 tested positive and three died, the report said. Investigators found that 26 other contacts of these churchgoers later tested positive and one died.



And that paragraph certainly seems like cause & effect.
And the storms and flooding have not even begun yet,

 

True Peach



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  posted on 5/21/2020 at 07:26 PM
quote:
according to a database maintained by the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, Georgia’s rolling seven-day average of new daily cases — an important metric that helps to balance out daily fluctuations in reporting — has fallen for three weeks in a row.

Those figures are undisputed — despite a clumsy effort by state officials to present the data in a way that made them look even better. And they are a lot better than the experience in two other states that are moving to end lockdowns, Florida and Texas.

For the seven-day period ending on May 4, Georgia’s daily average stood at 746 cases.

By May 11, the average had fallen 12.6 percent to 652 daily cases.

By May 18, it had dropped to 612 cases, a further decline of 6.1 percent.

At the same time, Georgia’s seven-day average of COVID-19 hospitalizations fell from 1,432 on May 4, to 1,239 on May 11, to 1,049 on May 18 — a three-week decline of 26.7 percent.


I wondered about Georgia manipulating data and PattyG posted about it. But AJC is keeping their own numbers that shows decline.

 

True Peach



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  posted on 5/21/2020 at 07:34 PM
Driving home tonight, I have never, never seen the parking lot so packed at our TJ Max. I’m like ‘holy **** what is going on at TJ Max?’ My wife says there was a story on the news about a line as long as a football field of people waiting to get in.

Our mall parking lot had decent amount of cars, except Penny’s is closed. Most restaurants also had decent amount of cars. I can’t say busy because I’ve seen busy, but a couple dozen cars at big restaurants.

I was surprised to see how busy these places appear to be. Youngstown area Ohio.

 
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