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Author: Subject: The NEW Impeachment Thread

Extreme Peach



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  posted on 1/11/2020 at 03:26 PM
quote:
Further during the prez debates, whoever the Dem candidate is should repeatedly bring this up on stage vs Trump hammering him over & over for details exposing his unwillingness for transparency. This and also bring to national attention buckets full of emoluments violations by Trump = using his office to make money off the American taxpayers. Tell it to the public in ads and in debates & watch him turn orange.

W/Trump nothing is ever certain & assuming he's not removed from office at trial, I wouldn't be at all surprised if he refused to debate the eventual dem nominee. He might think it's a better show of strength to basically say, "I'm POTUS, there was a witchhunt that exonerated me (not true), there was even an impeachment & I was exonerated (TBD), why should I go on stage to tussle w/some pathetic little dem?" He has nothing to gain. He does love to strut and preen, but he also likes to shock the status quo. His idol Putin doesn't have to debate given that he's a dictator. Why should he? He's DJT, POTUS & brilliant.

 

Extreme Peach



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  posted on 1/13/2020 at 08:21 AM
quote:
Watching the clip with Trump and plastic face Laura Ingrahm (the Fox Network may have the finest plastic surgeon on retainer in all of broadcast news) on Trump network earlier today proclaiming that he think's it's vital for future presidents that he invoke executive privilege was quite comical. I guess we're supposed to believe that Trump is now suddenly concerned for the future of not only the presidency but the republic too


This is exactly what he was tweeting in November when a federal judge ruled that the Exec can't override a subpoena (The Presidents are not kings ruling) - his concern was for future prezs. He was saying he WANTS testimony from patriots like Bolton while his DOJ was appealing the ruling. He'd be a lot more credible (if that's possible) if he could take a position & stick to it. He seems incapable of doing that.

Now, after repeatedly saying he WANTS a trial, witnesses, evidence, everything to prove he's done nothing wrong, he says on the eve of transmission of the Articles of Impeachment that he wants the Senate to dismiss them rather than have a trial. Hours earlier he said he wanted a trial to prove how harassed he's been. Sounds like running scared even though his removal from office seems highly unlikely.


 

Maximum Peach



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  posted on 1/13/2020 at 02:13 PM
Amendment XXV. Now.
 

Extreme Peach



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  posted on 1/15/2020 at 07:49 AM
Presumably, Pelosi will announce the HR managers who will prosecute the case in the Senate at 10 am today. Formalities follow w/a HR vote on the managers, engrossment of the Articles of Impeachment (declaraing it the final version), and transmission of the Articles to the Senate by walking it between House & Senate.

Pelosi didn't lose a thing by delaying this transmission. During the time between the HR vote to impeachment & today, Bolton publicly announced his willingness to testify, more emails re Trump's direct involvement w/Ukraine investigating the Bidens came to light, and constituents had to opportunity during the 2-week recess to let their senators know their expectations of comportment given that a trial would occur. Most importantly, there was significant coverage re The Rules - anyone who was interested learned that it was up to the Senate to set the rules, including witnesses, & a trial w/no witnesses is nothing short of a sham or cover-up. No one expected the delay in transmission to result in a different outcome where the Exec is removed from office.

 

World Class Peach



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  posted on 1/15/2020 at 09:22 PM
I have noticed differences in articles I've read on the impeachment process. Article 1, Section 3 of the Constitution says "And no person shall be convicted without the concurrence of two thirds of the members present." as stated in the Senate website.
Other articles (none associated with Wikipedia) say that there has to be a majority vote of two thirds of the Senate.
Now, if only 9 Senators show up, would a vote of 6 be enough for a conviction as that this wold be two thirds of members present, or, does the entire Senate have to be present?
if some do not show up for the trial, but arrive for the vote, would they be barred from voting since they had not been present for the trial?
I know that some of this is dependent on the rules the Senate places on the trial, but is there precedent for it?

Also found this:
https://lawfareblog.com/imagining-senate-trial-reading-senate-rules-impeach ment-litigation

OK, one more thing. If Trump is convicted, what are the appeals process?

 

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Peach Master



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  posted on 1/15/2020 at 09:44 PM
Today Pelosi said she hoped the Senate will honor their oath. If that's what she was banking on, then this was a complete waste of time.
 

Extreme Peach



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  posted on 1/15/2020 at 10:24 PM
quote:
OK, one more thing. If Trump is convicted, what are the appeals process?

As I've said before, I'm a lawyer with a strong interest in constitutional law not an impeachment scholar. It's an arcane topic & a little weird. The lawfare blog you cite is one of the most detailed best-guesses as to how things will unfold by someone who is a scholar.

Impeachment and trial are a legislative function. HR investigates, impeaches, and presents the case for impeachment at trial. The Senate sets the rules, considers the facts, and votes as to whether the charges rise to the level of removing the Exec from office. Theirs is the only vote that counts. The constitution is very specific as you note - 2/3 of those present. The end. No appeal.

The Senate generally doesn't meet or vote unless there's a quorum of 51 present. During Clinton's trial, CJ Rehnquist relied heavily on the Senate Parliamentarian as to protocol for conducting normal senate business & any deviation requires a vote. Because CJ Roberts clerked for Rehnquist & considered him a mentor, he's expected to behavior similarly.

Because the Senate sets rules for everything - like whether they're going to break at 12:30 pm or 1:00 pm - they can address the question you raise of attendance.

However, McConnell has announced that he expects ALL senators to be in attendance, in their seats, & quietly paying attention w/no cell phones throughout the entire trial. He & Schumer sent a letter to all senators today about decorum, access, and visitors during the trial. I've only seen it on twitter. I'm sure the text will be show up somewhere by tomorrow.

Hope that helps. Basically, the senate can make the rules as they go along - that's what McConnell wants to do about witnesses.


 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 1/16/2020 at 07:35 AM
Would be nice to see a "guest appearance" by Lev Parnas, the guy that Trump claims he really doesn't know. The revelations w/in the last few days of notes, text messages, e-mails between Lev and Rudy are damming, but Moscow Mitch may attempt to not allow testimony by anyone. Hopefuly a few GOP Senators will have a sense of ethics and vote for testimony of witnesses.

Why not vote to dismiss as the entire thing is is a hoax, right?

 

Extreme Peach



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  posted on 1/16/2020 at 08:15 AM
quote:
Would be nice to see a "guest appearance" by Lev Parnas, the guy that Trump claims he really doesn't know. The revelations w/in the last few days of notes, text messages, e-mails between Lev and Rudy are damming, but Moscow Mitch may attempt to not allow testimony by anyone. Hopefuly a few GOP Senators will have a sense of ethics and vote for testimony of witnesses.

Why not vote to dismiss as the entire thing is is a hoax, right?

McConnell - who argued vigorously FOR witnesses in the Clinton trial - can't re-write his past arguments. I suspect whoever is a witness will be treated exactly as w/Clinton - closed door testimony under oath before a handful of select individuals of which "relevant" portions are allowed before the whole senate. I don't think the charming Mr. Parnas will be among them although I suspect he'd be highly entertaining.

I doubt McConnell will authorize a motion to dismiss - especially since Trump changes his mind hourly as to whether he wants a full trial that will prove his innocence (wonder if he really believes that) or a quick exoneration (wonder if he really believes that, too).


 

Extreme Peach



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  posted on 1/16/2020 at 08:30 AM
quote:
Today Pelosi said she hoped the Senate will honor their oath. If that's what she was banking on, then this was a complete waste of time.


Pelosi gets to Trump like no one else. Quotes like that plus her handing out ceremonial pens used at signing the Articles of Impeachment on camera rev him up.

This should never be considered a waste of time or money. It's a constitutional process that separates us from the Russians, Chinese, N. Koreans, and dictators everywhere. When evidence of wrong-doing by the Exec is brought to the attention of the HR, investigated to the extent it could even though hampered by the Exec's ordering key witnesses to act in contempt of Congress and refused to produce subpoened documents, and a vote taken that there is sufficient merit to warrant a senate trial, the constitution and democracy are working. Whatever the outcome, the HR followed its obligations. We have an Exec who has been told by the judiciary that he's not god or above the law and a legislature that exercised its oversight role. It's reassuring to citizens to know that the constitution hasn't been gutted.




 

Maximum Peach



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  posted on 1/16/2020 at 03:22 PM
quote:
It's a constitutional process that separates us from the Russians, Chinese, N. Koreans, and dictators everywhere.


That explains why the Redhat hivemind is so against it.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 1/16/2020 at 04:05 PM
The steps in the impeachment process explained.

https://news.yahoo.com/donald-trump-senate-impeachment-trial-timeline-22093 0153.html


 

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Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 1/16/2020 at 10:11 PM


McConnell’s brilliant statement on Nancy’s “golden pens on silver platters”
By M. Dowling -January 16, 2020


The signing of the Articles of Impeachment took place on a table with a political slogan on it, Mitch McConnell noted today on the floor of the Senate. The Senate Majority Leader said that Speaker Pelosi gave out souvenirs, “golden pens on silver platters,” as he painted a picture of a garish atmosphere.

The Speaker claimed for weeks that impeachment was a most serious and somber affair. She was very prayerful, according to her. McConnell called her on her hypocrisy.

“Nothing says seriousness and sobriety like handing out souvenirs,” McConnell said of the partisan process.

It was partisan from beginning to end, the Leader said, which is why they rushed the process in the House and denied the President due process.

[It was like a Carnival, but they are clowns.]

The Speaker didn’t find anything strange about handing out souvenirs during only the third presidential impeachment in history, McConnell asserted.

The Senate was empowered to serve as a check against a factionalized government, he reminded the members. McConnell talked of “animosities” and “animal instincts” the Senate is meant to keep at bay. The House’s hour is over and it’s time for the Senate to fulfill their purpose.

McConnell quoted Alexander Hamilton: “the demon of faction will, at certain seasons, extend his scepter over all numerous bodies of men.”

 

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Peach Master



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  posted on 1/16/2020 at 10:39 PM
Hard to believe that a grown man is focused on pens instead of the President of the United States working with foreign adversaries to attack other Americans.
 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 1/16/2020 at 11:09 PM
I keep looking at those pens very closely and don't see "Trump Impeachment 2020" written on them anywhere. I fail to see how this is somehow proof of partisanship. It's not like she met with the accused to plot out a strategy for the trial or anything.
 

Extreme Peach



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  posted on 1/16/2020 at 11:54 PM
quote:
Hard to believe that a grown man is focused on pens instead of the President of the United States working with foreign adversaries to attack other Americans.

There was a woman reporter from Fox who noted the pens in the video of the formal signing. I don't know if that's their habit to focus on such trivia. It's SOP in government, law, and Wall Street to hand out duplicate pens of those used in the signing of significant documents. LBJ provided as many as 75 pens for documents he signed that were deemed to be of particular significance. I'm sure McConnell has quite a collection himself after 35 years in the senate. Where's the story?





 

Maximum Peach



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  posted on 1/17/2020 at 12:24 AM
Enough with the damn pens - I just had to delete some real bad jokes.
 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 1/17/2020 at 10:56 AM
quote:
Hard to believe that a grown man is focused on pens instead of the President of the United States working with foreign adversaries to attack other Americans.


He's going straight to the heart and matter as well as depth and substance of impeachment. IT'S THE PENS.

 

Universal Peach



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  posted on 1/17/2020 at 03:14 PM
quote:
quote:
Hard to believe that a grown man is focused on pens instead of the President of the United States working with foreign adversaries to attack other Americans.


He's going straight to the heart and matter as well as depth and substance of impeachment. IT'S THE PENS.


No kidding...It's uncanny just how similar the content Goob's posts are to what a bot would post....Come to think of it, bot's are far more sophisticated.


 

Maximum Peach



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  posted on 1/17/2020 at 03:24 PM


[Edited on 1/17/2020 by BrerRabbit]

 

World Class Peach



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  posted on 1/19/2020 at 01:02 AM
quote:
Enough with the damn pens - I just had to delete some real bad jokes.


I don't remember posting any in here.

 

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Maximum Peach



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  posted on 1/19/2020 at 12:47 PM
My jokes . Cant delete other peoples jokes

 

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Universal Peach



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  posted on 1/19/2020 at 04:51 PM
quote:
quote:
The dems have been talking about this since before the inauguration.


He spends his day reading stories about himself and responding to them on Twitter, doing what we're doing here in the Whipping Post, which is beyond sad to say about the President of the United States. We've all been talking about it since 2015 because it was obvious to detect his personality disorders that are a threat to national security. You want to direct the conversation towards policy or values, when you know damn well it's about his fragile and dangerous mental state. That you don't want better for the leader of our country is suprising. I would think someone who loves this country would want someone like Reagan, Bush Sr, or Bush Jr - men with dignity, integrity, and kindness, not this slop we have now.



[Edited on 12/18/2019 by Skydog32103]


Well said....I would only add that watching the party of Reagan/Bush/ the past near four years now and how it has allowed this to happen is the second scariest part of this entire reign of the American Caligula.

And so ends forever the lie that they, the Republican party, are more concerned about "National Security." Seriously, they can not carry that torch any longer.


 

World Class Peach



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  posted on 1/20/2020 at 05:12 PM
quote:
My jokes . Cant delete other peoples jokes


OK.

 

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Extreme Peach



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  posted on 1/20/2020 at 09:44 PM
So, McConnell's plan is for the senators to sleep through the trial according to his Organizing Rules. Each side gets 24 hours to present their arguments - over 2 days!!!! That's 12 hours of argument per day. Clinton's trial was 24 hours of arguments over 4 days for each side - 6 hours/day. Since the trial day starts at 1 pm that means they'll meet until 1 am. assuming there are no breaks.

I predict some pushback on that. I can't see 100 senators sitting silently in their seats w/o their phones for 12 hours/day.

 
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