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Author: Subject: At least 6 hurt in shooting at California high school, suspect in custody

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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 08:28 AM
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Right wing heroes, left wing liberals, moderates, BLAH - has nothing to do with it
There’s no answer/solution to gun violence
Would also hesitate to call it an epidemic, they happen occasionally, not often IMO - one of these are one too many, of course there have been several
All the ensuing discussion will have been posted many times before (see POTUS thread)


https://www.vox.com/a/mass-shootings-america-sandy-hook-gun-violence

This is a great graphic that Vox keeps current about mass shootings. I know some have a problem with Vox's perceived liberal slant, but it is worth a look. They use 4 people shot in the same incident as their definition - nobody has to die. They also do not exclude gang-related shootings as some other researchers do.

When I first looked at the calendar on this study a few months ago, there had only been one Sunday through Saturday calendar week in the USA since the Sandy Hook shooting in 2012 without a mass shooting. Many weeks or even single days have multiple incidents.

My opinion is that it qualifies as an epidemic or, at the very least, something that deserves to not just be shrugged off.





[Edited on 11/15/2019 by adhill58]

 

True Peach



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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 08:39 AM
Mental Illness - we’ll never know, he’s in the hospital w/a self inflicted shattered skull
Horrific Parenting - unsure about where the Canadian vs US parenting angle comes in - it might yet come out that he was raised in an abusive environment, triggering his rampage - or mayb bullied at school
The words Republican & Democrat don’t belong here - neither do temporary insanity, it’s no different from a temper tantrum & would’ve been no defense against what the kid did

 

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True Peach



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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 09:22 AM
Good post indeed Skydog32103 - less a part of the problem, the frustration I feel in saying nothing can be done about gun violence is that, That Very Thing You Mentioned - let’s brainstorm & figure out a plan right away - has been done so many times before - yet the carnage continues
As you said, as long as there are guns in every home, & easily purchased from stores.....there will be more such tragedies - that is how I see it as well

Thanks for the graphic adhill58 - gosh just a quick look at it shows how widespread gun violence is - certainly a lot more so than what I thought

[Edited on 11/15/2019 by Stephen]

 

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Peach Pro



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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 09:40 AM
quote:
Mental Illness - we’ll never know, he’s in the hospital w/a self inflicted shattered skull
Horrific Parenting - unsure about where the Canadian vs US parenting angle comes in - it might yet come out that he was raised in an abusive environment, triggering his rampage - or mayb bullied at school
The words Republican & Democrat don’t belong here - neither do temporary insanity, it’s no different from a temper tantrum & would’ve been no defense against what the kid did




The question about parents in Canada was because they don't have a sliver of a fraction of the number of mass shootings that we have here. If horrific parenting is the main contributor to mass shootings, Canadian parents must be astonishingly better at parenting than parents in the USA.

 

True Peach



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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 10:28 AM
Mayb that could be a start - whether it’s superior parenting, realistic attainable gun control measures we haven’t thought of or enacted here, or how they might approach mental illness etc.....
......Open lines of communication w/Canada, investigating if we could model our approach after theirs in hopes of lessening mass shootings here

[Edited on 11/15/2019 by Stephen]

 

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"I know y'all came to hear our songs, we like to play 'em for you but without Gregg here it's really hard for us to do. He sings & plays so much & does such a good job. He's really sick, 103* He might've come, but no one would let him." Duane

 

A Peach Supreme



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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 12:34 PM
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quote:
I am right there with ya BV but that is a cause not a solution. Try this, BETTER (as in not liberal) parenting.

Now I must edit. Even liberal parenting is better than horrific parenting. Knee Jerk reaction for me to assume there is not much difference. But that is my flaw.

[Edited on 11/14/2019 by KCJimmy]


My wife and I are liberal. One daughter, 16. 3.8 GPA, choir, varsity cheer, rep theatre, National Honor Society. Works 20 hours a week, works on homework as many or more hours a week. Career goal is Medical Lab Scientist.

You and the rest of the perfect conservatives and perfect conservative parents can GFY, pal.
GOOD JOB! and right back at bro.

 

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A Peach Supreme



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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 12:37 PM
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quote:
I Know a Little.


Was asking BigV - you strike me as a parent type. I have noticed "liberal dads" tend to help out more with the dirty work, more equality and respect between men and women in general.
I am a parent but not as good as BHAWK. I do dishes & laundry if that's what you mean. I even make coffee on occasion. Tried making Cofevet once but couldn't spell it right and didn't have a proper tweeter machine.

[Edited on 11/15/2019 by KCJimmy]

 

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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 12:53 PM
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Unfortunately, sometimes it takes the people to revolt for politicians to listen and act, and if both sides can come together with an honest effort to create a plan of action, then we can reverse this trend.



It has nothing to do with a "Plan of action" or a "trend" and the only "Revolution" that will avail itself is the Parent seeking help for the Son or Daughter who is exhibiting behaviors that require an opinion from a Mental health professional. Tough call?......I can only imagine. Otherwise give us one valid reason a minor would have for turning a weapon of any kind on his fellow classmates.

 

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A Peach Supreme



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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 12:56 PM
quote:
.Let's start holding the Parents responsible for the actions of their Minor children.....
THAT is a GOOD solution.

quote:
Shooter was the son of an alcoholic father who had recently committed suicide.

Definitely liberal parenting. There’s no conservative alcoholics and conservatives don’t commit suicide.
Look man I realized how bad the post looked immediately and edited it to indicate that. I could have deleted that part but felt like it would be dishonest. So I poked at my own flaw. You sound like an excellent parent. I am sorry that your political beliefs are flawed, But clearly mine are as well. Perhaps somewhere in middle....yeah not likely, I've seen a lot of your posts and you have seen a lot of mine.

quote:
Some friends of ours go to school at Saugus High. Fortunately, they don't have a first period class so they were on there way there when the shooting happened. They returned home and are safe. Right now, that's all the matters to me and my family.
Amen to that.

quote:
The words Republican & Democrat don’t belong here
Amen to that too.

 

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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 04:51 PM
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Look man I realized how bad the post looked immediately and edited it to indicate that. I could have deleted that part but felt like it would be dishonest. So I poked at my own flaw. You sound like an excellent parent. I am sorry that your political beliefs are flawed, But clearly mine are as well. Perhaps somewhere in middle....yeah not likely, I've seen a lot of your posts and you have seen a lot of mine.


There's no reason for any lingering bad blood. Wasn't even comparing my worth as a parent to you. We've never met.

But, politics is very mean and very nasty these days. We all make our own choices when it comes to responses. I used to give a lot of thought to them and at one time I was committed to finding better conversations. Sure, there were always swipes at each other, but some of the best conversations I've ever had about a lot of political issues I've had on this website.

Over time, people cared less and less about the longer, more analytical responses, I realized no one cares, so I gave up. Why bother if no one reads it?

The only way to survive in political discourse is to always reply in kind. Rush Limbaugh went on air 30 years ago and the demonization of liberals hasn't stopped since. I wish more liberals would stand up for themselves and reply with the same vitriol that they receive, just as much as I wish that more liberals would realize that the right will always hate them. Always. No matter what, nothing trumps that hatred, and nothing ever will. Pun intended.

But, in the end, I'm only one schmo with an opinion.

I wish you well.

 

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A Peach Supreme



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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 05:55 PM
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quote:
Look man I realized how bad the post looked immediately and edited it to indicate that. I could have deleted that part but felt like it would be dishonest. So I poked at my own flaw. You sound like an excellent parent. I am sorry that your political beliefs are flawed, But clearly mine are as well. Perhaps somewhere in middle....yeah not likely, I've seen a lot of your posts and you have seen a lot of mine.


There's no reason for any lingering bad blood. Wasn't even comparing my worth as a parent to you. We've never met.

But, politics is very mean and very nasty these days. We all make our own choices when it comes to responses. I used to give a lot of thought to them and at one time I was committed to finding better conversations. Sure, there were always swipes at each other, but some of the best conversations I've ever had about a lot of political issues I've had on this website.

Over time, people cared less and less about the longer, more analytical responses, I realized no one cares, so I gave up. Why bother if no one reads it?

The only way to survive in political discourse is to always reply in kind. Rush Limbaugh went on air 30 years ago and the demonization of liberals hasn't stopped since. I wish more liberals would stand up for themselves and reply with the same vitriol that they receive, just as much as I wish that more liberals would realize that the right will always hate them. Always. No matter what, nothing trumps that hatred, and nothing ever will. Pun intended.

But, in the end, I'm only one schmo with an opinion.

I wish you well.
Back at ya again. I couldn't find one damn thing to disagree with in that post. I might add a vice-versa to the 2nd to last paragraph.(That's wice-wersa in Russian) Guess I'll look somewhere else for conflict.

 

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Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 09:22 PM
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quote:
But it's NOT a Mental Heath issue...


Who is saying this? Any links? Or is this just more huffing and puffing about Democrats?



It's just a way to try to change the discussion away from guns. I have yet to hear somebody who thinks these shootings are due to mental health issues propose that the government put more resources into treating mental illness, and most also oppose expanded background checks to keep guns out of the hands of those with mental illness.

It basically means that I support the status quo, it's not the guns, so just move along.

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 10:04 PM
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It's just a way to try to change the discussion away from guns.


No. "It's a way" of saying the gun is not to blame when someone with Mental health challenges turns a gun on innocent people...

 

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True Peach



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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 10:30 PM
His condition was initially listed as “grave” but the shooter has now been upgraded to critical & might survive
There was no apparent mental illness on his part, it took everyone by complete surprise
On a more positive note an apparently-credible threat at another school was thwarted, so mayb some of the anti mass-shooting measures in place, are proving out

 

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"I know y'all came to hear our songs, we like to play 'em for you but without Gregg here it's really hard for us to do. He sings & plays so much & does such a good job. He's really sick, 103* He might've come, but no one would let him." Duane

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 10:44 PM
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There was no apparent mental illness on his part, it took everyone by complete surprise


"Took everyone by complete surprise"....."no apparent mental illness"

What other possible reason could there be that does not lead back to Mental illness?

 

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True Peach



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  posted on 11/15/2019 at 11:01 PM
I get ya, for sure - mayb he had some sort of undetected dormant imbalance that got activated who knows how - was described in one account as “a quiet dude” - they found other guns at his house apparently

 

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"I know y'all came to hear our songs, we like to play 'em for you but without Gregg here it's really hard for us to do. He sings & plays so much & does such a good job. He's really sick, 103* He might've come, but no one would let him." Duane

 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 11/16/2019 at 12:42 AM
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quote:
It's just a way to try to change the discussion away from guns.


No. "It's a way" of saying the gun is not to blame when someone with Mental health challenges turns a gun on innocent people...


Yet I see you propose zero solutions to the problem. You oppose increased background checks. I haven't seen you propose additional resources going toward mental health. So, what is your solution?

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/16/2019 at 12:33 PM
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I'll never understand why some people get so defensive whenever we acknowledge the gun part of this issue.


Because they believe that all you want is to take all the guns away, and there is no middle ground.

If you say you only want compromise, they’ll never believe you anyway.

The core tenet of hyper-polarization and hyper-partisanship is that the “other” lives their lives in a way that is unacceptable...it’s about how people live their lives.

That’s why phrases like “agree to disagree” and “honest, respectful debate” have become so silly and quaint.

There’s no going back.

 

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True Peach



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  posted on 11/16/2019 at 12:45 PM
Guns became a problem the minute they were invented. They continue to be today, always will be & no rhetoric, conversation or legislation will change things
One media outlet is reporting that the shooter has passed away

 

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"I know y'all came to hear our songs, we like to play 'em for you but without Gregg here it's really hard for us to do. He sings & plays so much & does such a good job. He's really sick, 103* He might've come, but no one would let him." Duane

 

Maximum Peach



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  posted on 11/16/2019 at 01:14 PM
Bhawk nailed this ages ago. Honest fatalism, hard to take but easier to listen to than all the bullsh!t wishwash.

The gun bought us our liberty, now it has taken it away.

Gotta get real, accept we live in ballistic hell, might as well be in shootemup shantytown in Kingston Jamaica.

So we have chosen the Way of the Gun. That is a whole new world, with a whole new set of rules.

Bummer - hate to say this, but generally when folks start running around with guns and killing people it is a state of war, or emergency.

National emergency. Martial law. A soldier with a machine gun in every classroom, armed squads in every public gathering place.

 

True Peach



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  posted on 11/16/2019 at 01:52 PM
Yes he did, & the grim possibilities portrayed by you & he of armed squads in public places/classrooms, as part of national martial law in addressing Gun Violence/Mass Shootings

....we saw the makings of it in airports after 9/11, with armed US marshals & federal lawmen posted in every major airport & on some flights - it was very intense the one or two times I went to an airport (Logan) around then - soldiers in fatigues & berets, machine gun in hand

We can only Monitor, not control the ebb & flow of GV/MS - continued communication/conversation (brainstorming as skydog3210 said) is also paramount

 

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"I know y'all came to hear our songs, we like to play 'em for you but without Gregg here it's really hard for us to do. He sings & plays so much & does such a good job. He's really sick, 103* He might've come, but no one would let him." Duane

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/17/2019 at 12:17 AM
quote:
quote:
I'll never understand why some people get so defensive whenever we acknowledge the gun part of this issue.


quote:
Because they believe that all you want is to take all the guns away, and there is no middle ground.


What was that statement by "Beto" the former Candidate for President of the United States?

 

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That Pro-Abortion chant, "My body, my choice"....Can this be applied to the wearing of masks?

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/17/2019 at 12:23 AM
quote:
quote:
quote:
It's just a way to try to change the discussion away from guns.


No. "It's a way" of saying the gun is not to blame when someone with Mental health challenges turns a gun on innocent people...


Yet I see you propose zero solutions to the problem. You oppose increased background checks. I haven't seen you propose additional resources going toward mental health. So, what is your solution?


I am not opposed to increased background checks, I do however feel they are not the solution, because more Laws are never the answer. Imho, this is an issue that can not be "fixed" until the public takes individual responsibility....which at this rate will never happen.

I am not a Legislator.

I suggest you purchase a gun and protect you and yours.

 

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That Pro-Abortion chant, "My body, my choice"....Can this be applied to the wearing of masks?

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/17/2019 at 08:51 AM
quote:
quote:
quote:
I'll never understand why some people get so defensive whenever we acknowledge the gun part of this issue.


quote:
Because they believe that all you want is to take all the guns away, and there is no middle ground.


What was that statement by "Beto" the former Candidate for President of the United States?




Your commitment to asking the most ridiculous questions just to remain smug and obtuse at all times will never cease to amaze me.

 

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True Peach



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  posted on 11/17/2019 at 11:34 AM
Gunfire erupted at a high school football game yesterday in NJ, leaving a 10 year old boy caught in the crossfire & in critical condition

It’s sick - yes am convinced it’s an epidemic - all the recent one-year stories of the Pittsburgh synagogue & Ft. Hood massacres, now these most recent two
It’s an epidemic for which there’s no cure or end in sight

 

____________________
"I know y'all came to hear our songs, we like to play 'em for you but without Gregg here it's really hard for us to do. He sings & plays so much & does such a good job. He's really sick, 103* He might've come, but no one would let him." Duane

 
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