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Author: Subject: Different song, different guitar?

Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 04:53 PM
quote:
and on a different note, don't let ANY object become your "identity." Guitars can be (and often are) destroyed. No matter how much I love my guitar, at the end of the day the guitar is the MEANS not the ENDS. It is a tool I use to make music - and the MUSIC is the ENDS - and there are other tools (of varying quality and qualities) I can use to get there.


I really agree with this statement..
One of the coolest things that ever hapened to me was when I played a friends strat ( upside down) through his amp , and he said,"ya know, it still sounds like you'...

I think his point was that it is the music from your soul that identifies you..

I played my Black Telecaster for 13 years until I got my Goldtop....I feel equally comfortable on both ..and my 335, and my strat...and my Ovation...
Why do I switch on stage ? Primarily, for tuning or tone reaseons stated above..
But man, some nights , Goldie just brings it and she ain't going nowhere..

 

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Peach Head



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 04:54 PM
Some of the guitarists I've worked with and their guitar preferences.
(Disclaimer: in my OWN experience during the periods I worked with them. Many musicians tastes & preferences evolve as time goes by... it's the nature of their game.) :

DEREK TRUCKS - Uses his Gibson SG almost exclusively. Has multiple "identical" backup SG's, but still prefers to go virtually the whole show with his one main ax... the one with the Sharpee autographs all over it. If he wants to modify his sound at all, it will generally be with alterations to his amplifier setup.

GREGG ALLMAN: Uses his acoustic Taylor primarily for strummed rythym songs, such as "Melissa" and his Gibson J-200 acoustic for fingerpicked songs like "Midnight Rider". For electric guitar he likes either a Fender Tele or Strat and will generally use the same gutar for all electric songs in a set.

WARREN HAYNES: Lots of guitar changes... Brian Farmer knows the why's & when's.

PAUL KANTNER - Used about half a dozen 12-String Rickenbachers with varying alternate tunings + capos depending upon the song list. (Most stressed Paul moments: His habit of looking over at me, usually at about one minute from the end of the song, make a setlist change and mouth the title of the 'new' next song at me.
I would quickly, and hopefully, look to see which guitar would be tuned and/or capoed in that song's key...
...just to find that NONE of the offstage guitars would be anywhere near in tuning, leaving me with less than a minute to frantically rework 12 strings of one of the guitars to get it set up in time for the switch...
...all the time hoping that I hadn't just retuned the guitar I was going to need for whatever song Paul wanted to follow with... aaaaahhhhhh!!!!!!!)

STU HAMM : Generally used 6 Kubicki basses and one Fender Precision bass. Of the Kubicki's, three were stock 4-strings with varying "attachments" , two were fretless, and one was a 5-string, his Hartke amp set up NEVER changed).

CARLOS SANTANA: Generally had around 3 or 4 similar PRS guitars with minor varied configurations (pickups, wiring, etc.). He used a selector pedal onstage to switch between several amp setups hidden under the drum riser for varied crunch, clean, overdriven tone selections, etc.

ROBBEN FORD: Has a variety of guitars in storage for different sounds and styles when recording, but generally takes onlt 3 guitar "sounds" on the road when touring... his mid-60's Fender Tele, one or two Gibson Les Paul's, and a semi-acoustic such as a Gibson 355 or Fender RF Elite style guitar.
His amp is always the Dumble Overdrive Special with a Dumble 2-12 cabinet whenever possible. If it can't be used for whatever reason, there are a selection of Fender amps (2-channel Twin Reverbs, Superr Reverbs, Deluxes, etc.) that he will use along with his Zen pedal.

 

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Peach Head



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 05:14 PM
quote:
One thing I don't quite understand is the switching of same models of guitars by guys. In songs that are clearly still standard tuning clapton will play multiple strats. Warren has a good number of Les Pauls despite using them in standard tuning. I can only figure its because they have different pick ups that produce slightly different tones? That and I guess the neck shape/size and body size may vary slightly?


Performers I have worked with who like or prefer one specific make of guitar... say, a "Springsteen" Tele player or a Stevie Ray Vaughn Strat guy, may have multiple guitars made of different woods/materials (Ash, Birch, Oak, Cedar, metal, acrylics, etc.) with subtle shape and thickness differences, or different styles/makes of pickups (single coil, double coil, varied windings, magnet strength, coil taps, etc.) or wiring configurations (in/out-phase pickups, splitting of coils, capacitor sizes, combination selections, tone/ volume controls, etc.)...
... ALL of which effects the individual way the guitars sound, play, and respond, even though they could potentially all look virtually the same from the audience.

[Edited on 8/6/2007 by (}:-Daved]

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 05:21 PM
Dave, check your pm's..

 

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Universal Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 05:21 PM
This thread was NOT about music or any players, it is about guitars. What or how you play is for another thread...

 

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Peach Head



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 05:32 PM
quote:
This thread was NOT about music or any players, it is about guitars. What or how you play is for another thread...



That might be the fundamental disconnect. This thread WAS about music and players. The question was: why players change guitars when playing music? The answer (as was posted previously) is - it varies. Often it is for very musical reasons, but sometimes it isn't.

If you are of the opinion that changing guitars is not necessary, fine - don't change guitars.

IF, however, you make the blanket generalization that there is (in your words) "no reason to switch guitars with the exception of tuning", then please allow us to correct this FACTUAL mistake.

[Edited on 8/6/2007 by vaylor]

[Edited on 8/6/2007 by vaylor]

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 05:38 PM
As I stated in another thread on an entirely different subject, maybe one reson for not changing instruments is brand loyalty. There is a long running Strat vs. Les Paul feud perpetuated by two brothers from different mothers. They act just like a couple of Hayseeds...right SPDB and Bluedad?

 

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Universal Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 05:39 PM
"don't let ANY object become your "identity." Guitars can be (and often are) destroyed. No matter how much I love my guitar, at the end of the day the guitar is the MEANS not the ENDS. It is a tool I use to make music - and the MUSIC is the ENDS"

That Vaylor Trucks is a pretty deep cat....

As for myself, I can see both sides of the argument. I play percussion, and I have lots of drums--Vaylor can vouch for that. They all have unique tones and sounds, and when I used to play in a band, I would often change drums from song to song, based on which drum I thought "fit" the song in question better. As Vaylor says, it's all about serving the music.

HOWEVER, I have to say that I play my one djembe more than the others combined, probably for the same reason Brent likes to play Mona Mae. It's a damn good instrument, with excellent tone and range, and it just sounds better than the others, to my ears.

In other words, you're both right!

 
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Extreme Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 06:03 PM
most jazz players i've heard live - and that's been many since i moved to DC - do not change their axe.

the exception? Pat Metheny. to me he sounded like Pat Metheny on each one, save the little 42 string job. obviously i'm not talking about the difference netween acoustic/electric.

as to ABB, regardless of which axe he welds, Warren sounds the same to me.

i heard Derek play that Washburn Signature model in Mobile once for a couple songs. he sounded just like himself! when he switched to the SG he SEEMED more comfortable.

like many, i have several rails (my Les Paul is gone: i traded it in on my Custom Shop order) but i stick to one at at a time, because i really get locked into the feel of a guitar and when i change the next one feels very different!

right now i'm sticking to my Epi Dot Studio, because it has the same size neck with no inlays as the Gibson Pat Martino model i'm supposed to take delivery of in oct/nov. !!!!

speaking of Martino, he sticks with his Gibson too, but he also says the letter doesn't care which pen wrote it.

do what makes you comfortable?

 

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Peach Pro



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 06:07 PM
Its all about the sound of the Guitar......the tone.

Look at Derrick.....All i've ever seen him play is the Gibson SG. I love his tone, which he gets several from also switching amps. Derricks tone is killer and the closest i've heard to Duane.

Look at Warren......he switches guitars alot through out a show. His primarys are the Gibson Les Pauls, Most have great tone with the Humbuckers and gets a variety of tones. Now, a Les Paul with P90 Pickups get a totally different Tone.......so beautiful. Other guitars that Warren switches to are the Gibson 335's......its a Hollow body with humbucker pickups......very nice tone and probably what he uses in the studio.

Look at Oteil.......his main weapon this year is his 1964 Jazz Bass, he also has on stage his favorite P-Bass, he still has his 6 string but i doubt we'll see that much this year either.

Swtching to a vintage guitar also bring a different tone. Those built in the 50's and 60's are some of the most beautiful guitars......where those built in the 70 are different, and the same with the 80's and 90s.

So there are so many reasons why players like to use so many different guitars. Warren is great at that.

Duey.

[Edited on 8/6/2007 by Duey]

 

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Universal Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 06:23 PM
Whatever tunes your ax, go for it.
spdb

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 06:27 PM
quote:
Whatever tunes your ax, go for it.


Would you tune my Les Paul? I don't have enough talent be it trained or by ear to do it. Should I switch to Fender?

Although I can't play for **** what little I do play on any guitar sounds like me.

 

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Peach Head



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 06:28 PM
I have seen a guy in a metal band switch guitars 6 times in one small set.
They were all the same models...
just different finishes...
tsk tsk

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 06:34 PM
I saw Stevie Ray Vaughan at least 20 times. He played 4 or 5 different Strats every show they all sounded like Stevie. But on a personal note Stevie had a butterscotch Strat that he used when he played Superstition and couple other songs I thought that guitar had the best tone.

I think back to what Leslie West said about Allen Woody at the One For Woody show "It's in his **** in hands man"

 

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Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 06:35 PM
quote:
Wind / Brass: If you are part of a horn section then you will almost never switch instruments as you will have parts arranged for your instrument If, however, you are a lone soloist then it is not out of the question to switch from tenor sax to alto, from sax to flute, from trumpet to flugalhorn, etc.



Rahsaan Roland Kirk was king of this!

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 06:40 PM
quote:
quote:
Whatever tunes your ax, go for it.


Would you tune my Les Paul? I don't have enough talent be it trained or by ear to do it. Should I switch to Fender?

Although I can't play for **** what little I do play on any guitar sounds like me.


Dan, you crack me up!! LOL!

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 06:47 PM
quote:
By IDENTITY, I refer to a players personna...ie: You think of Dickey, doesnt his image conjure up a Goldtop LP? and Duane, his Tobacco LP?, and Derek? his red SG? Warren, the LP? Now, ya wanna go TONE? Let's look at a few players IDENTITY WITH TONE.
Duane, BB King, Dickey, SRV, Derek, when you hear that TONE, you "know who it is...
hence, IDENTITY. Some players need to IDENTIIFY WITH TONE, and switching guitars ain't gonna help. Gibson or Fender.
spdb


But as I mentioned, Warren frequently switches guitars, especially with the Mule. So this defeats your point. Different axes for different jobs.

Doug

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 06:52 PM
Warren is very versatile and his sound changes GREATlY from song to song, ESPECIALLY with the Mule. I imagine this is why he changes guitars so frequently. Derek has a signature tone he is really known for and he uses it all the time with the ABB and the DTB. So I would guess he has less reason to change.

Doug

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 07:05 PM
Hell, even the STRINGS can make a difference between the same models!

Even I know that and I have never been able to play.

i.e. try a slide on a flat wound A vs. one on a different wind. (don't know that other term, I hope y'all follow me).

Much different sound even from the same guitar.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 07:07 PM
spdb is bordering on troll behavior here.

Try to be civil.

 

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Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 07:30 PM
Pirated from the LP Forum, but some people do search for different tones...

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 07:45 PM
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Pirated from the LP Forum, but some people do search for different tones...






There should be a wet spot in the middle.

[Edited on 8/7/2007 by DanB]

 

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Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 07:51 PM
I guess I could only switch twice. I only have two guitars. I could switch 3 times if I knew how to play my mandolin better. However it's for sale, so I would gladly only switch twice if it meant I could sell my little buddy!

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 07:53 PM
quote:
switch twice if it meant I could sell my little buddy


little buddy?..don't get so attached it isn't technically right

 

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Maximum Peach



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  posted on 8/6/2007 at 08:13 PM
My understanding is that people like Keith Richards and Rich Robinson use so many different open tunings, so that's one reason they switch.

The most recent time I saw Emmylou Harris (in May), she used different guitars based on where she wanted the capo. And she commented openly about how lame she was with tuning.

I didn't care for the tone of Derek's signature Washburn a few years ago and was very glad he returned to an SG.

I certainly feel that certain songs call for different "moods" for some players. For example, a 335 for "Woman Across the River" or "Firing Line" versus a Les Paul for "Rocking Horse" or "Whipping Post".

I've never been able to afford having many instruments at once, but I could see switching if I felt the "need" for it...

I bring only one bass to my gigs now--and vary my tone by how and where I pluck or attack the strings.
(But that's for another thread. )

 

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