To the "longtime critics":

If the President organized a legitamite Quranic Council type of task force with scholars from Al Azhar in Cairo and other places to explain to the Islamic State where they believe they are wrong, it might accomplish something. The Islamic State believe that they have the religious right to burn people alive, only the scholars can convince them that this is not correct.

Even with oppressive rulers, people are supposed to put up with them until Allah removes them from power, at his will. Yes that is in the Quran. There are debates about using the voting process for this, because if all the candidates are corrupt, how can a believer participate in the elections, they could try to run candidates but if the corrupt regimes put the people on a terrorist list, they cannot run for office.

It comes down to interpreting the guidance from the Quran and the sunnah (ways of living that the Prophet showed the people who became Muslims). Rather than just scholars making a statement here or there, there needs to be a coalition of rightly guided scholars who receive protection from their governments.

Bombing and killing do not solve problems, it only leads to ethnic and religious cleansing, much like what the Nazis envisioned and put into place. ISIS is doing their version of this, either agree with them or get your head chopped off, or death by some other way. What will it take, for the world to become a global killing field? How much is too much, when is it out of hand? Assad gassed and killed his people, nobody complained.

Where is the humanity from civilized peoples of the world? Bunker busters are not an example of humanity.

[Edited on 2/6/2015 by gina]

I wonder what the scoreboard would read by now of casualties inflicted by Christian vs Muslim, if you tallied up the numbers since they started?

Is it really important what happened 1,000 years ago? How does that affect any of us today? Shouldn't we be concerned more about the present day?

I thought progressives were about looking ahead, not backward.

Unlike Obama, I'd say it's OK to get on that "high horse." No living Christian had a thing to do with what some medieval crusader was up to 1,000 years ago.

Unlike Obama, I'd say it's OK to get on that "high horse." No living Christian had a thing to do with what some medieval crusader was up to 1,000 years ago.

Once again, the point flew way over your head.

I wonder what the scoreboard would read by now of casualties inflicted by Christian vs Muslim, if you tallied up the numbers since they started?

You would be very surprised by the answer, though it has been posted on this site more than once. Easy to find tallies for wars, which kill many, many more people than witch hunts or the inquisition. Muslims were overtaking a large part of the Middle East, Africa, and Europe for hundreds of years. The Crusades were a response to that. Christians have killed each other in far greater numbers than they have killed anyone else.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_and_anthropogenic_disasters_by_death_toll

NY Times, Feb 5

WASHINGTON — President Obama may have thought he was giving a straightforward history lesson at the National Prayer Breakfast on Thursday when he compared the atrocities of the Islamic State to the bloodshed committed in the name of Christianity in centuries past.

But that is not how many of his longtime critics saw it.

“The president’s comments this morning at the prayer breakfast are the most offensive I’ve ever heard a president make in my lifetime,” said Jim Gilmore, the former Republican governor of Virginia. “He has offended every believing Christian in the United States.”

Rush Limbaugh devoted a segment of his show to what he said were the president’s insults to the “whole gamut of Christians” and Twitter’s right wing piled on. Guests on Megyn Kelly’s Fox News show spent 15 minutes airing objections to the president’s comments.

“Lest we get on our high horse and think this is unique to some other place, remember that during the Crusades and the Inquisition, people committed terrible deeds in the name of Christ,” Mr. Obama said. “In our home country, slavery and Jim Crow all too often was justified in the name of Christ.”

Still, the president went on to focus on the terrorism carried out under the guise of Islam, saying that the last few months have shown the degree to which faith can be “twisted and misused in the name of evil.”

“From a school in Pakistan to the streets of Paris, we have seen violence and terror perpetrated by those who profess to stand up for faith — their faith — professed to stand up for Islam, but, in fact are betraying it,” he said, describing the Islamic State as “a brutal, vicious death cult that, in the name of religion, carries out unspeakable acts of barbarism.”

Bill Donohue, the president of the Catholic League, said in a statement that Mr. Obama was trying to “deflect guilt from Muslim madmen.” He said the president’s comparisons were “insulting” and “pernicious.”

Mr. Gilmore said the comments go “further to the point that Mr. Obama does not believe in America or the values we all share.”

The White House had no comment on Thursday night about the criticism.

In his speech, Mr. Obama said the use of religion to justify violence and killings “is not unique to one group or one religion.”

“There is a tendency in us, a sinful tendency, that can pervert and distort our faith,” he said.

The talk of terrorism was the sharpest note in a speech that was otherwise a reflection on religion and humility, and it was Mr. Obama’s latest effort to avoid branding recent violence by the Islamic State or those professing common cause with it as “Islamic” extremism. His team has said that doing so would play into the hands of terrorist organizations, legitimizing their message.

Let's look at this from a different point of view.

Yes, there have been atrocities, centuries ago, by Christians in various forms. Not only against other faiths, but against differing Christian sects.
Those of you who would bring out that The Inquisition was about fighting heresy in the Catholic church need to remember that it evolved into the questioning, torture, and death of anyone not Catholic.

But, let's ask these questions:
1) When was the last time Christians burned someone to death?
2) When was the last beheading by Christians?
3) When was the last time someone was told to convert to Christianity or be put to death?
4) How long has it been since the last Christian was put to death because they dishonored their family?

Christianity has moved forward, the radical Muslims believe that the world should still be under the laws of the Koran, as written, almost fourteen hundred years ago.

Medieval Christian radicalism seems well under control in 2015, whereas ISIS and radical Islam is spreading to most every continent on the globe. Rarely a day goes by without some news of their horrific acts.

But to Obama they are one in the same, so get off that high horse!

Is it really important what happened 1,000 years ago? How does that affect any of us today? Shouldn't we be concerned more about the present day?

I thought progressives were about looking ahead, not backward.

What happened historically created migrations/cultural evolution. If you believe in the revelations from any of the religions, you know all that is going on leads up to a large war of God versus the secular world. God is not okay with secularism, he gave his edicts to all the peoples of the world, and then religions and governments got in the way creating variances in ways of living and resolving problems. Muslim fundamentalists want Shariah courts, non religious people prefer secular law because it has kept law and order in their societies, so why change it now.

The global world has a financial system based on usury, which is something God forbid. He didn't like it during the time Jesus was here, and he won't have it when he sends him back to straighten out people living today. That is just one issue that will change globally.

He did not accept the so called equal marriage concept, he told the Jews, the Christians, the Muslims the same thing. No. Etc., Etc.

There are other examples also. (ie. Britain's recently legalizing 3 parent IVF to manipulate the genetics in an embryo to eliminate defect before the child is born).

One of the biggest problems is there are too many people for the available lands and resources in the world. God laid out which tribes inherited which lands. The Muslims didn't just fall out of the sky and land in Arabian lands. They came from tribes, just like the Jews did, and then migrated. They have a right to some of the lands surrounding Jerusalem by virtue of their tribal heritages.
Nobody wants to acknowledge that. Modern day Israel just says that God promised all the land to them, and they are being nice letting Muslims live in Palestine. The Muslims will tell you Jerusalem belongs to them and they will take it. The secularists say, just create two states, it's the peaceful solution. God himself forbid two states in the Bible. He wants one nation, but you will not get modern day Muslims to sit down with Jews and look at the commonality in both religions.

It also requires ALL religions going back and seeing where they were changed. (ie. Christianity changed at the 4th century by Constantine - he changed the Sabbath to Sunday etc.). The Pope will not agree to it, no religious heads of state have agreed to do this. There is prophecy from 1300 years ago that Rome will come under war, the Muslims will be there. It may be Isis that does it. What is happening now is the beginning of the dissolution of governments and dominions, and this was prophecied even in the Bible. I Corinthians 15:21-24

One man will destroy all dominion/authority on earth. Do you know who that is? The anti-Christ. It will be the final test for mankind, bow down to him or suffer and have your reward later.

If you don't understand what happened then, the events happening now seem un-related but they are all part of the prophecies.

NY Times, Feb 5

WASHINGTON — President Obama may have thought he was giving a straightforward history lesson at the National Prayer Breakfast on Thursday when he compared the atrocities of the Islamic State to the bloodshed committed in the name of Christianity in centuries past.

But that is not how many of his longtime critics saw it.

“The president’s comments this morning at the prayer breakfast are the most offensive I’ve ever heard a president make in my lifetime,” said Jim Gilmore, the former Republican governor of Virginia. “He has offended every believing Christian in the United States.”

Rush Limbaugh devoted a segment of his show to what he said were the president’s insults to the “whole gamut of Christians” and Twitter’s right wing piled on. Guests on Megyn Kelly’s Fox News show spent 15 minutes airing objections to the president’s comments.

“Lest we get on our high horse and think this is unique to some other place, remember that during the Crusades and the Inquisition, people committed terrible deeds in the name of Christ,” Mr. Obama said. “In our home country, slavery and Jim Crow all too often was justified in the name of Christ.”

Still, the president went on to focus on the terrorism carried out under the guise of Islam, saying that the last few months have shown the degree to which faith can be “twisted and misused in the name of evil.”

“From a school in Pakistan to the streets of Paris, we have seen violence and terror perpetrated by those who profess to stand up for faith — their faith — professed to stand up for Islam, but, in fact are betraying it,” he said, describing the Islamic State as “a brutal, vicious death cult that, in the name of religion, carries out unspeakable acts of barbarism.”

Bill Donohue, the president of the Catholic League, said in a statement that Mr. Obama was trying to “deflect guilt from Muslim madmen.” He said the president’s comparisons were “insulting” and “pernicious.”

Mr. Gilmore said the comments go “further to the point that Mr. Obama does not believe in America or the values we all share.”

The White House had no comment on Thursday night about the criticism.

In his speech, Mr. Obama said the use of religion to justify violence and killings “is not unique to one group or one religion.”

“There is a tendency in us, a sinful tendency, that can pervert and distort our faith,” he said.

The talk of terrorism was the sharpest note in a speech that was otherwise a reflection on religion and humility, and it was Mr. Obama’s latest effort to avoid branding recent violence by the Islamic State or those professing common cause with it as “Islamic” extremism. His team has said that doing so would play into the hands of terrorist organizations, legitimizing their message.

Let's look at this from a different point of view.

Yes, there have been atrocities, centuries ago, by Christians in various forms. Not only against other faiths, but against differing Christian sects.
Those of you who would bring out that The Inquisition was about fighting heresy in the Catholic church need to remember that it evolved into the questioning, torture, and death of anyone not Catholic.

But, let's ask these questions:
1) When was the last time Christians burned someone to death?
2) When was the last beheading by Christians?
3) When was the last time someone was told to convert to Christianity or be put to death?
4) How long has it been since the last Christian was put to death because they dishonored their family?

Christianity has moved forward, the radical Muslims believe that the world should still be under the laws of the Koran, as written, almost fourteen hundred years ago.

The last time they burned someone to death was the witches.

I'm not sure about the beheadings (you have some of those fundamentalist groups in this country but nobody knows what they do on their private land).

The Quran and Bible both give guidance on how to live. The punishments told in both books, applied to how things were done then; but even the Taliban (the Afghans) if they feel the need to kill someone, they shoot them, because they have bullets now. The others still stone people in Pakistan. The secular world has pretty much done away with punishment for adultery or if someone wants punishment, they call their lawyer and financially punish the man and get a divorce. For other things, we put people in cages and call it a correctional facility.

Countries, societies are doing what they think is right, and living their lives by secular laws, that change with the will of the people. Fundamentalists object to that. I still say bring in the scholars to address the differences.

While some truth in the statement; Obama's comment is political suicide.

While some truth in the statement; Obama's comment is political suicide.

I don't think so, there was nothing offensive in what he said. his critics will try to paint him as an anti christian/jewish, muslim terrorist sympathizer 😛 but they have from day one of his taking oath.

[Edited on 2/7/2015 by pops42]

I'm no big O fan; and I agree that what he said was factually accurate. But given the current political climate re: terrorism it is akin to going to a funeral and pointing out the flaws of the deceased. I think he sincerely was trying to temper anti Muslim feelings and racism - I think the outcome will be the opposite

Unlike Obama, I'd say it's OK to get on that "high horse." No living Christian had a thing to do with what some medieval crusader was up to 1,000 years ago.

http://www.salon.com/2013/08/03/the_10_worst_examples_of_christian_or_far_right_terrorism_partner/ 10 examples of killing and maiming in the name of Christ in the present day.

[Edited on 2/7/2015 by pops42]

Ten examples? You mean a whole 10?? Those Christians are out of control!!!

Wow.

That's a good couple of days worth for a Muslim terror cell.

Unlike Obama, I'd say it's OK to get on that "high horse." No living Christian had a thing to do with what some medieval crusader was up to 1,000 years ago.

http://www.salon.com/2013/08/03/the_10_worst_examples_of_christian_or_far_right_terrorism_partner/ 10 examples of killing and maiming in the name of Christ in the present day.

[Edited on 2/7/2015 by pops42]

Ten examples? You mean a whole 10?? Those Christians are out of control!!!

Wow.

That's a good couple of days worth for a Muslim terror cell.

tim mcveigh was a christian.

Agnostic. He was raised a Catholic, but that doesn't make someone a Christian. He didn't embrace Catholism and later maintained that "science" was his religion.

Unlike Obama, I'd say it's OK to get on that "high horse." No living Christian had a thing to do with what some medieval crusader was up to 1,000 years ago.

http://www.salon.com/2013/08/03/the_10_worst_examples_of_christian_or_far_right_terrorism_partner/ 10 examples of killing and maiming in the name of Christ in the present day.

[Edited on 2/7/2015 by pops42]

Ten examples? You mean a whole 10?? Those Christians are out of control!!!

Wow.

That's a good couple of days worth for a Muslim terror cell.

tim mcveigh was a christian.

Agnostic. He was raised a Catholic, but that doesn't make someone a Christian. He didn't embrace Catholism and later maintained that "science" was his religion.

He was all over the map on that. He had stated that science was his religion, but he also stated that he had kept core Christian beliefs. I think he was whatever suited him at the time.

your hooded hero's of the kkk did lots more killing and maiming going almost to the 21st century.

[Edited on 2/7/2015 by pops42]

"My" hooded KKK? That would make me a Democrat. Not guilty, Senator.

your hooded hero's of the kkk did lots more killing and maiming going almost to the 21st century.

[Edited on 2/7/2015 by pops42]

"My" hooded KKK? That would make me a Democrat. Not guilty, Senator.

The Democratic party of the era when the KKK was very active was conservative.
The Republican party of that time was liberal.

I think his point might have something to do with a belief that an entire religion and people shouldn't be wiped out because of the actions of a minority.

Hopefully an understanding of history keeps us from making the same mistakes.

I personally don't want to witness a holocaust.

2) When was the last beheading by Christians?

Since you asked, last October in Stillwater, Oklahoma.

Yes, it is less often than what you see in the Muslim world, but we still see Christians wanting to force their beliefs on the entire population. Regardless of religion, I wish everyone would just keep their beliefs among their own groups and understand that there is no national religion in the US and that is one of the freedoms that makes America great.

Think Islamists Are the Only Religious Terrorists? Meet Some Famous Killers for Christ

Tens of thousands of Muslims flee Christian militias in Central African Republic

[Edited on 2/9/2015 by gondicar]

ISIS are barbarians no doubt and what they did is heinous but lets not kid ourselves thinking Christians do not kill innocents.

How many civilians have been killed by Christian troops in the Iraq/ Afghan wars?

And how about all the civilian's burned to death by napalm during the Vietnam war?

This idea that Muslims are the only ones doing the killing is naïve at best.

The question has become what is all of this supposed to accomplish. I've never heard a single person claim that Christianity has been perfect for the last 1,000 years, but maybe a rebuke of Christianity will absolve radical Islam?

The question has become what is all of this supposed to accomplish. I've never heard a single person claim that Christianity has been perfect for the last 1,000 years, but maybe a rebuke of Christianity will absolve radical Islam?

No but there are two sides to every coin and to consider only one side is being shortsighted. There are radicals in every religion Alloak and some on this forum that are using a broad brush to paint all Muslims as evil.

There are drivers that got a DUI twenty years ago, and there are some that got three in last five years. To say that the second group is more dangerous on the road than the first group would be shortsighted.

Further, that second group is no worse than anybody else because somebody else got a DUI seventeen years ago.

Seems to be the line of thinking.

There are drivers that got a DUI twenty years ago, and there are some that got three in last five years. To say that the second group is more dangerous on the road than the first group would be shortsighted.

Further, that second group is no worse than anybody else because somebody else got a DUI seventeen years ago.

Seems to be the line of thinking.

It's not the line of thinking at all. A more appropriate way to look it would be if you had two groups of people and Group A had some DUIs amongst them and Group B also had DUIs amongst them although maybe not as many, and Group B preaches that Group A should all be persecuted as evil because they are all nothing but a bunch of drunk drivers while suggesting that the drunk drivers from their own ranks are ok because Group A is all bad and Group B is not bad at all.

[Edited on 2/9/2015 by gondicar]

Unlike Obama, I'd say it's OK to get on that "high horse." No living Christian had a thing to do with what some medieval crusader was up to 1,000 years ago.

http://www.salon.com/2013/08/03/the_10_worst_examples_of_christian_or_far_right_terrorism_partner/ 10 examples of killing and maiming in the name of Christ in the present day.

[Edited on 2/7/2015 by pops42]

Ten examples? You mean a whole 10?? Those Christians are out of control!!!

Wow.

That's a good couple of days worth for a Muslim terror cell.

tim mcveigh was a christian.

Agnostic. He was raised a Catholic, but that doesn't make someone a Christian. He didn't embrace Catholism and later maintained that "science" was his religion.

He didn't carry out his atrocities in the name of Christianity. Nor for that matter did the KKK. Obama also conveniently leaves out the role Christians played in the abolition of slavery and the 20th century civil rights movement. It's really pretty grotesque for Obama to tell Americans to get off their high horse.

The question has become what is all of this supposed to accomplish. I've never heard a single person claim that Christianity has been perfect for the last 1,000 years, but maybe a rebuke of Christianity will absolve radical Islam?

No but there are two sides to every coin and to consider only one side is being shortsighted. There are radicals in every religion Alloak and some on this forum that are using a broad brush to paint all Muslims as evil.

There comes a time when a leader has to stop being nuanced and stop talking about all the different sides of the issue and stand up for his own people and the other people under protection of the West who are being threatened not by the Inquisition or Crusaders, not by the KKK or the American Slave Power but by crazed killers acting under the banner of Islam including the regime he is desprately apeasing, the Mullahs of Iran. We are tired of being scolded by him. Who the heck does he think he is?

From what I heard of the speech he did address the terrorism of today and I certainly didn't hear him "scolding" anyone.

Doug you ought to take a breath. And besides, I thought you were Jewish... how was he scolding you?