“this is a mental health issue”
That is exactly what this is. What kind of sane person does this kind of thing?
To consistently blame guns, all the while shouting “we need more Laws”, is getting old.
I disagree. Every country in the world has people with mental problems. Only this country has many mass shootings. Why? Are American people with mental problems more dangerous than those in other countries? No. The problem is the ease of access to guns that only exists in this country.
Disagree. We do not take mental Health (or the lack of services) seriously. Add to that, our paradigm must change. When these things happen, how long does it take the media to report on the shooter?..His name, interviews with people he attended H.S. with, all have a memory to share with the media, who gladly report it. Who cares?...Evidently, the public is just "dying" to know. I would call that an issue, a Major one and you know what? It goes to this society and the things we deem important. You want to see things change?..How about we start by hanging these people?..How about lighting up the phones lines to your Congressman with the anger you feel toward the imbecile that did the shooting? Until we start holding the criminal responsible and Not the weapon, not a thing will change.
Most mass killers are either killed by police or commit suicide. The threat of hanging will be no detriment to people who do not expect to live. As for reporting on the shooters friend, family, coworkers or whoever, that has no effect on any shooting as it already happened. Ignoring the ease with which people can obtain and own guns will never solve the problem. A problem that only exists in this gun crazed country.
Our gun crazed country with a fascist holding the highest office.
I believe we as a country have more guns per capita than any other country of the world. In proportion to this is the number of gun related murders. Doesn't that seem logical? We're told that the answer is to arm churches, synagogues, schools, etc. The answer is always more guns. Yep, that will deter. Even Wayne LaPierre of the NRA said the answer is to arm more good people. The fall back is mental health. If we could just help all the mentally unstable people, we can beat this problem. That all makes sense. We produce more guns, arm more people, help the mentally challenged, and we'll all live happily ever after. All good.
Be honest. More guns equals more shooting. Don't try to deny that because you defend the second amendment.
Of course it is a mental health issue - this entire country is loaded to the gills on psych meds. That is only going to increase. I am convinced that these "weird" massacres are SSRI-related, in the majority of occurrences.
Every prescription for SSRI should require seizure of all weaponry, down to slingshots, with weekly verification.. Won't be a silver bullet cure, my bet is immediate drop of over fifty percent. The gang related shooting stats won't change - that is a separate issue and cause. I'm referring to the whacko "senseless" events.
You can't have your cake and eat it too. You want to take mind-altering pills, fine, but then you get a radio metal detector locked to your ankle to protect the rest of us.
The answer is always more guns.
In this Republic and the value we place on Liberty, that solution beats the Hell out of "We need more Laws"
The fall back is mental health.
I repeat, "Who in possession of a Healthy mind walks into any place where people have gathered and begins randomly killing, be it with a gun or a bomb"?
It is absolutely a Mental Health issue
Bullsh!t. in switzerland, people love their guns, but have strict laws on who can have them, the result??? hardly any gun massacres.
Let's see Switzerland has 8.7 million people and the USA has roughly 325 million......Factor in education, history, health and now tell me that was a relevant comparison.
If mental issues are the main problem behind mass shootings, how do we stop them? Let's look at the guy in Pittsburgh yesterday. Did he have mental health issues? If so, they were unknown. If you want to use his social media posts and the hatred he spewed on them, you now have to look at everyone who acts like that. Remember Charlottesville? Remember the chant "Jews will not replace us"? Did all of them have mental health issues? Should they be allowed to buy guns? The answer is far deeper than just mental health issues. Guns are the biggest problem and the ease of which anyone can obtain them.
I repeat, "Who in possession of a Healthy mind walks into any place where people have gathered and begins randomly killing, be it with a gun or a bomb"?
It is absolutely a Mental Health issue
And these are the people most easily preyed upon & likely to act upon targets amped up bombastic rhetoric such as anti-antisemitism, anti-immigration, and racism. They just need a reason to go off. When a president overtly speaks this at rallies and subtlety implies this as well, he is a lighting the candle for these mentally unstable types. Add in all of the social media language & reposting / retweeting, and it's a formula for bad things to happen.
Am I blaming all of this on Trump? No. On the other hand his rallies, his rhetoric, his willingness to speak / imply violence, and his tweets cannot be dismissed as catalysts and contributing factors. I can't remember a president who over spoke and used his pulpit in such a way anywhere near the extent as Trump.
I grew up in an area that’s full of both churches and guns. The idea of guards is new as I remember the church I went to had 4 unlocked doors during services. I don’t understand why a country that is so abundant can’t do more on what is clearly a poor mental health system. I’m no fire breathing gun supporter but I do believe in a person having the chance to be on equal footing when in harms way. Firearms, love em or not, are a part of that equation now.
If you want to use his social media posts and the hatred he spewed on them, you now have to look at everyone who acts like that.
Squeaky wheel gets the grease.
If mental issues are the main problem behind mass shootings, how do we stop them? Let's look at the guy in Pittsburgh yesterday. Did he have mental health issues? If so, they were unknown. If you want to use his social media posts and the hatred he spewed on them, you now have to look at everyone who acts like that. Remember Charlottesville? Remember the chant "Jews will not replace us"? Did all of them have mental health issues? Should they be allowed to buy guns? The answer is far deeper than just mental health issues. Guns are the biggest problem and the ease of which anyone can obtain them.
Thank you. I did not intend to make this another gun control thread and overshadow the growing xenophobia problem, unfortunately I guess it’s at the core of this
Did all of them have mental health issues?
Yes.
Should they be allowed to buy guns?
No.
If mental issues are the main problem behind mass shootings, how do we stop them? Let's look at the guy in Pittsburgh yesterday. Did he have mental health issues? If so, they were unknown. If you want to use his social media posts and the hatred he spewed on them, you now have to look at everyone who acts like that. Remember Charlottesville? Remember the chant "Jews will not replace us"? Did all of them have mental health issues? Should they be allowed to buy guns? The answer is far deeper than just mental health issues. Guns are the biggest problem and the ease of which anyone can obtain them.
Anger & hate are not mental health issues. One is an emotion & the other is learned behavior. Anti-Semitism & racism (against anyone different) have not been extinguished for thousands of years. The belief that anyone "other" is a threat to be destroyed is being perpetuated & others are buying into it for some unfathomable reason.
I'm 100% for gun control & better access to mental health treatment for those with diagnosable illnesses. However, mail bombs & mailed toxic substances aren't guns & being an angry white man isn't an identifiable medical illness for which there is a treatment. Not Guilty by Reason of Mental Illness/Insanity pleas are successful less than 1% at trial no matter how heinous the crime.
The only common denominator I see in any recent mass killings is low economic status. Hopeless young men (Dylan Roof) & middle-aged guys who once went to college but fell out of the mainstream (Cesar Sayoc) allied themselves w/groups who made them feel they were not responsible for their situations - it was someone else's fault. Blame-shifting.
BTW, I think taking things down a notch in all aspects of life is a good thing. I noticed the platform Disqus - often used for reality TV show discussions - has now added "Be Kind" to its tag line when posters sign in.
It is possible that social media has created more isolation and an amplification of the "little voices" that send these killers over the edge.
It is possible that social media has created more isolation and an amplification of the "little voices" that send these killers over the edge.
Absolutely. They can hide behind a computer screen and become part of hate groups or movements of destruction all the while feeling empowered.
I find it so ironic that whenever their is a mass shooting the right screams that it is a mental health issue and not a gun issue, yet one of the first things that the GOP and Trump did after Trump took office was to pass a law making it easier for mentally ill people to buy guns. Plus, the cut funding for mental health services every chance they get. If they want to blame mental illness, they sure don't seem at all concerned with it.
It is possible that social media has created more isolation and an amplification of the "little voices" that send these killers over the edge.
Absolutely. They can hide behind a computer screen and become part of hate groups or movements of destruction all the while feeling empowered.
X2. Almost no effort is required to become part of a SM group but the return of being accepted is huge. New members are accepted w/a click. Message/misinformation of the day, including cartoons & gifs, is spread w/a single "like" or retweet.
Mental health is a growing problem
Mental health is a growing problem
It is so incredibly wrong for including this in this discussion, you're so off here that I'm not sure if you're actually joking.
First, diagnosis of Autism has increased, not Autism itself. The understanding of Autism is relatively recent, only the past few decades, and it was often diagnosed as other disorders. Therefor, as it is more understood, diagnosis has increased.
Second, Autism does not cause racism, hate, anti-Semitism, nor the type of mental disorder that leads one to shoot other people. If you'd like to read more about it I'd be happy to send you some links.
This is where the no personal attacks thing becomes a challenge.
This is where the no personal attacks thing becomes a challenge.
Indeed, not that I want to make one because it's easier to ignore.
[Edited on 10/29/2018 by cyclone88]
[Edited on 10/29/2018 by cyclone88]
[They just need a reason to go off. When a president overtly speaks this at rallies and subtlety implies this as well, he is a lighting the candle for these mentally unstable types. Add in all of the social media language & reposting / retweeting, and it's a formula for bad things to happen.
So, sounds like you are saying it is the Presidents fault
Am I blaming all of this on Trump? No. On the other hand his rallies, his rhetoric, his willingness to speak / imply violence, and his tweets cannot be dismissed as catalysts and contributing factors. I can't remember a president who over spoke and used his pulpit in such a way anywhere near the extent as Trump.
So, which is it? The President's fault? Yes or No?
This is where the no personal attacks thing becomes a challenge.
Because people disagree with your view?
No, not at all, that never bothers me, honest.- I was zippin my lip on my reaction to the autism chart.
[They just need a reason to go off. When a president overtly speaks this at rallies and subtlety implies this as well, he is a lighting the candle for these mentally unstable types. Add in all of the social media language & reposting / retweeting, and it's a formula for bad things to happen.
So, sounds like you are saying it is the Presidents fault
Am I blaming all of this on Trump? No. On the other hand his rallies, his rhetoric, his willingness to speak / imply violence, and his tweets cannot be dismissed as catalysts and contributing factors. I can't remember a president who over spoke and used his pulpit in such a way anywhere near the extent as Trump.
So, which is it? The President's fault? Yes or No?
Evidently you didn't understand the post. To answer your "yes" or "no' question - It is not a binary choice. The first line of the 2nd paragraph stated, "Am I blaming all of this on Trump?" The key word here is "all". I even went as far as to say "no". Let me add this - I do believe Trump doesn't get a free pass and is complicit in actions like these.
[They just need a reason to go off. When a president overtly speaks this at rallies and subtlety implies this as well, he is a lighting the candle for these mentally unstable types. Add in all of the social media language & reposting / retweeting, and it's a formula for bad things to happen.
So, sounds like you are saying it is the Presidents fault
Am I blaming all of this on Trump? No. On the other hand his rallies, his rhetoric, his willingness to speak / imply violence, and his tweets cannot be dismissed as catalysts and contributing factors. I can't remember a president who over spoke and used his pulpit in such a way anywhere near the extent as Trump.
So, which is it? The President's fault? Yes or No?
Evidently you didn't understand the post. To answer your "yes" or "no' question - It is not a binary choice. The first line of the 2nd paragraph stated, "Am I blaming all of this on Trump?" The key word here is "all". I even went as far as to say "no". Let me add this - I do believe Trump doesn't get a free pass and is complicit in actions like these.
We disagree here, I don't think "Binary" has anything whatsoever to do with it. There is no "Kind of" or "sort of" either you are ultimately responsible for your actions or you are not.
[They just need a reason to go off. When a president overtly speaks this at rallies and subtlety implies this as well, he is a lighting the candle for these mentally unstable types. Add in all of the social media language & reposting / retweeting, and it's a formula for bad things to happen.
So, sounds like you are saying it is the Presidents fault
Am I blaming all of this on Trump? No. On the other hand his rallies, his rhetoric, his willingness to speak / imply violence, and his tweets cannot be dismissed as catalysts and contributing factors. I can't remember a president who over spoke and used his pulpit in such a way anywhere near the extent as Trump.
So, which is it? The President's fault? Yes or No?
Evidently you didn't understand the post. To answer your "yes" or "no' question - It is not a binary choice. The first line of the 2nd paragraph stated, "Am I blaming all of this on Trump?" The key word here is "all". I even went as far as to say "no". Let me add this - I do believe Trump doesn't get a free pass and is complicit in actions like these.
We disagree here, I don't think "Binary" has anything whatsoever to do with it. There is no "Kind of" or "sort of" either you are ultimately responsible for your actions or you are not.
I disagree. Charles Manson never actually murdered anyone. Should he not have not had to face punishment? He only encouraged violence. I guess only those who physically killed someone should be held responsible for those actions.
[They just need a reason to go off. When a president overtly speaks this at rallies and subtlety implies this as well, he is a lighting the candle for these mentally unstable types. Add in all of the social media language & reposting / retweeting, and it's a formula for bad things to happen.
So, sounds like you are saying it is the Presidents fault
Am I blaming all of this on Trump? No. On the other hand his rallies, his rhetoric, his willingness to speak / imply violence, and his tweets cannot be dismissed as catalysts and contributing factors. I can't remember a president who over spoke and used his pulpit in such a way anywhere near the extent as Trump.
So, which is it? The President's fault? Yes or No?
Evidently you didn't understand the post. To answer your "yes" or "no' question - It is not a binary choice. The first line of the 2nd paragraph stated, "Am I blaming all of this on Trump?" The key word here is "all". I even went as far as to say "no". Let me add this - I do believe Trump doesn't get a free pass and is complicit in actions like these.
We disagree here, I don't think "Binary" has anything whatsoever to do with it. There is no "Kind of" or "sort of" either you are ultimately responsible for your actions or you are not.
I disagree. Charles Manson never actually murdered anyone. Should he not have not had to face punishment? He only encouraged violence. I guess only those who physically killed someone should be held responsible for those actions.
[They just need a reason to go off. When a president overtly speaks this at rallies and subtlety implies this as well, he is a lighting the candle for these mentally unstable types. Add in all of the social media language & reposting / retweeting, and it's a formula for bad things to happen.
So, sounds like you are saying it is the Presidents fault
Am I blaming all of this on Trump? No. On the other hand his rallies, his rhetoric, his willingness to speak / imply violence, and his tweets cannot be dismissed as catalysts and contributing factors. I can't remember a president who over spoke and used his pulpit in such a way anywhere near the extent as Trump.
So, which is it? The President's fault? Yes or No?
Evidently you didn't understand the post. To answer your "yes" or "no' question - It is not a binary choice. The first line of the 2nd paragraph stated, "Am I blaming all of this on Trump?" The key word here is "all". I even went as far as to say "no". Let me add this - I do believe Trump doesn't get a free pass and is complicit in actions like these.
We disagree here, I don't think "Binary" has anything whatsoever to do with it. There is no "Kind of" or "sort of" either you are ultimately responsible for your actions or you are not.
I disagree. Charles Manson never actually murdered anyone. Should he not have not had to face punishment? He only encouraged violence. I guess only those who physically killed someone should be held responsible for those actions.
Agree. And bin Laden wasn't flying those planes on 9/11.
[They just need a reason to go off. When a president overtly speaks this at rallies and subtlety implies this as well, he is a lighting the candle for these mentally unstable types. Add in all of the social media language & reposting / retweeting, and it's a formula for bad things to happen.
So, sounds like you are saying it is the Presidents fault
Am I blaming all of this on Trump? No. On the other hand his rallies, his rhetoric, his willingness to speak / imply violence, and his tweets cannot be dismissed as catalysts and contributing factors. I can't remember a president who over spoke and used his pulpit in such a way anywhere near the extent as Trump.
So, which is it? The President's fault? Yes or No?
Evidently you didn't understand the post. To answer your "yes" or "no' question - It is not a binary choice. The first line of the 2nd paragraph stated, "Am I blaming all of this on Trump?" The key word here is "all". I even went as far as to say "no". Let me add this - I do believe Trump doesn't get a free pass and is complicit in actions like these.
We disagree here, I don't think "Binary" has anything whatsoever to do with it. There is no "Kind of" or "sort of" either you are ultimately responsible for your actions or you are not.
I disagree. Charles Manson never actually murdered anyone. Should he not have not had to face punishment? He only encouraged violence. I guess only those who physically killed someone should be held responsible for those actions.
I believe Manson was convicted of both, first-degree murder and conspiracy to commit murder.
Keyword here is, Conspiracy
Neo nazi trump supporters at work.
This crazy guy Robert Bowers that shot all of those people at the temple, apparently did not vote for, like, or support President Donald Trump.
I saw screenshots of his social media page where Robert Bowers wrote this himself.
Neo-Nazis-even the ones in European countries and the ones in North America in the United States and Canada, who are all in extreme minorities and only a tiny fraction of a percentage of the population even of small European countries, do not like Donald Trump because he likes Jews, completely supports Israel, has Jewish family members, and they feel he is too far left or a leftist/globalist.
Also, neo-nazis have always been around ever since the end of WW II, and are not some new phenomenon or coming out of the woodwork or having people join them-even in European countries or in North America.
I first saw evidence and actual neo-nazis in different European countries, and regions of Europe, and the United States and Canada in the late 1990s and very early 2000s during the Clinton years.
[Edited on 10/29/2018 by The_Newt]
[They just need a reason to go off. When a president overtly speaks this at rallies and subtlety implies this as well, he is a lighting the candle for these mentally unstable types. Add in all of the social media language & reposting / retweeting, and it's a formula for bad things to happen.
So, sounds like you are saying it is the Presidents fault
Am I blaming all of this on Trump? No. On the other hand his rallies, his rhetoric, his willingness to speak / imply violence, and his tweets cannot be dismissed as catalysts and contributing factors. I can't remember a president who over spoke and used his pulpit in such a way anywhere near the extent as Trump.
So, which is it? The President's fault? Yes or No?
Evidently you didn't understand the post. To answer your "yes" or "no' question - It is not a binary choice. The first line of the 2nd paragraph stated, "Am I blaming all of this on Trump?" The key word here is "all". I even went as far as to say "no". Let me add this - I do believe Trump doesn't get a free pass and is complicit in actions like these.
We disagree here, I don't think "Binary" has anything whatsoever to do with it. There is no "Kind of" or "sort of" either you are ultimately responsible for your actions or you are not.
I disagree. Charles Manson never actually murdered anyone. Should he not have not had to face punishment? He only encouraged violence. I guess only those who physically killed someone should be held responsible for those actions.
I believe Manson was convicted of both, first-degree murder and conspiracy to commit murder.
Keyword here is, Conspiracy
Ok, but when does a conspiracy become a conspiracy? Seems like whipping up a frenzy at campaign rallies when you are not even up for election might qualify. Screaming that any free press that is the slightest bit critical of you is the enemy of the people, and then your followers target that same press seems to fit the bill of conspiracy.
[They just need a reason to go off. When a president overtly speaks this at rallies and subtlety implies this as well, he is a lighting the candle for these mentally unstable types. Add in all of the social media language & reposting / retweeting, and it's a formula for bad things to happen.
So, sounds like you are saying it is the Presidents fault
Am I blaming all of this on Trump? No. On the other hand his rallies, his rhetoric, his willingness to speak / imply violence, and his tweets cannot be dismissed as catalysts and contributing factors. I can't remember a president who over spoke and used his pulpit in such a way anywhere near the extent as Trump.
So, which is it? The President's fault? Yes or No?
Evidently you didn't understand the post. To answer your "yes" or "no' question - It is not a binary choice. The first line of the 2nd paragraph stated, "Am I blaming all of this on Trump?" The key word here is "all". I even went as far as to say "no". Let me add this - I do believe Trump doesn't get a free pass and is complicit in actions like these.
We disagree here, I don't think "Binary" has anything whatsoever to do with it. There is no "Kind of" or "sort of" either you are ultimately responsible for your actions or you are not.
I disagree. Charles Manson never actually murdered anyone. Should he not have not had to face punishment? He only encouraged violence. I guess only those who physically killed someone should be held responsible for those actions.
I believe Manson was convicted of both, first-degree murder and conspiracy to commit murder.
Keyword here is, Conspiracy
Ok, but when does a conspiracy become a conspiracy? Seems like whipping up a frenzy at campaign rallies when you are not even up for election might qualify. Screaming that any free press that is the slightest bit critical of you is the enemy of the people, and then your followers target that same press seems to fit the bill of conspiracy.
Comparing a political rally attended by thousands that is taped or filmed for whatever future purpose, Imho, is hardly in the same ballpark as 5 deranged people, led by a certified lunatic, sitting around a table plotting someone's death and then carrying it out in cold blood.
