Seems to be how the conversation goes these days...
Quote:
“You've got to wonder if Mule actually thinks he is convincing anybody of anything. He is proven wrong and a liar over and over. Does he actually believe the stuff he posts? Is he that dumb? The facts here are proven that the timetable for withdrawal was Bush's and that ISIS existed when Bush was in office, yet somehow Obama was the one who cut and ran and Obama created ISIS? Since we are blaming Obama for things that happened before he was president, maybe you should blame him for the US cut and running in Beruit and the creation of Taliban as well.”
________________________________________________________________________
No wonder son. I do not think I am convincing any liberal of anything. The liberals are so full of hate they cannot be reasoned with.
My posts are factual. The fact that you, so lacking in research skills, cannot disprove them simply shows you ineptitude.
The timetable for withdrawal was set by President Bush but the final date was set for after his presidency and the responsibility fell to Obama. President Bush was able to craft and get an agreement with the Iraqi government on a framework for a SOFA. It was Obama who never pursed the final SOFA, a force protection agreement or anything else with the Iraqi government as evidenced by his refusal to even talk with the Iraqi government.
Subsequently Obama cut and ran which did allow ISIS to spring onto the scene.
But in keeping with the liberal’s mantra, first you lie and then blame everything on President Bush.
You and your little band of far-left loons consistently come out on the wrong side of the important issues.
Did you see senior Democrat Senator Diane Feinstein and Obama’s former Sec. of Defense Panetta rip Obama a new asshole yesterday on national TV? When Sen. Feinstein sounds more like Sen. McCain, Obama has a problem.
In a new Washington Post/ABC News poll says that 65% of American disapprove of Obama’s handling of the Islamic state. In that same poll 54% of Americans say The U.S. should not take Syrian refugees even if they are screened for security. This poll by two left-leaning organizations should tell you that you and your little band of far-left loons are wrong.
The Washington Post’s editorial board is describing Obama as petulant and defensive.
After Obama’s embarrassing news conference in Paris a group of CNN anchors wondered on-air why Obama spent more time and energy railing against his political opponents than he did about ISIS.
You can choose to keep your head up your political ass or join with the majority of American citizens and senior Democrats and Obama administration officials and put national security first.
It is entirely up to you and don’t for a minute think I care.
Quote:
“You've got to wonder if Mule actually thinks he is convincing anybody of anything. He is proven wrong and a liar over and over. Does he actually believe the stuff he posts? Is he that dumb? The facts here are proven that the timetable for withdrawal was Bush's and that ISIS existed when Bush was in office, yet somehow Obama was the one who cut and ran and Obama created ISIS? Since we are blaming Obama for things that happened before he was president, maybe you should blame him for the US cut and running in Beruit and the creation of Taliban as well.”
________________________________________________________________________No wonder son. I do not think I am convincing any liberal of anything. The liberals are so full of hate they cannot be reasoned with.
My posts are factual. The fact that you, so lacking in research skills, cannot disprove them simply shows you ineptitude.
The timetable for withdrawal was set by President Bush but the final date was set for after his presidency and the responsibility fell to Obama. President Bush was able to craft and get an agreement with the Iraqi government on a framework for a SOFA. It was Obama who never pursed the final SOFA, a force protection agreement or anything else with the Iraqi government as evidenced by his refusal to even talk with the Iraqi government.
Subsequently Obama cut and ran which did allow ISIS to spring onto the scene.But in keeping with the liberal’s mantra, first you lie and then blame everything on President Bush.
You and your little band of far-left loons consistently come out on the wrong side of the important issues.
Did you see senior Democrat Senator Diane Feinstein and Obama’s former Sec. of Defense Panetta rip Obama a new asshole yesterday on national TV? When Sen. Feinstein sounds more like Sen. McCain, Obama has a problem.
In a new Washington Post/ABC News poll says that 65% of American disapprove of Obama’s handling of the Islamic state. In that same poll 54% of Americans say The U.S. should not take Syrian refugees even if they are screened for security. This poll by two left-leaning organizations should tell you that you and your little band of far-left loons are wrong.
The Washington Post’s editorial board is describing Obama as petulant and defensive.
After Obama’s embarrassing news conference in Paris a group of CNN anchors wondered on-air why Obama spent more time and energy railing against his political opponents than he did about ISIS.
You can choose to keep your head up your political ass or join with the majority of American citizens and senior Democrats and Obama administration officials and put national security first.
It is entirely up to you and don’t for a minute think I care.
First you said Bush had nothing to do with SOFA and now you said it was signed without a formal date. What would be the point of that?
http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/122074.pdf
Once again, this is the actual treaty. Article 24 on page 20 clearly states:
All the United States Forces shall withdraw from Iraqi territory no later than December 31, 2011
Care to revise your story one more time?
[Edited on 11/23/2015 by jkeller]
Prince Charles thinks that climate change is partially causing terrorism and refugees leaving Syria. And these are the people leading nations. I wonder what they will tell him at the Climate Change Summit in France next week (besides 'gimme some of what you're snortin' )
Terrible setback to his golf and campaign schedule.
Obama the Campaigner in action here. He really doesn't have a clue when tone and words matter most and when its ok to talk cute and tap dance in circles. he should have left the g20 summit immediately and went back to Washington or meet in Europe to aid France in an appropriate response.
We provided France with the intelligence to bomb those targets yet left it up to them to decide on their own course.
Obama doesn't have to campaign. He kicked your bull$hit party's ass twice idiot.
You ever hear of multi tasking?
I love listening to how morons would run the world.
We also bombed 100's of oil tankers in Syria today. Oil is how ISIS funds their operations.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/17/world/middleeast/us-strikes-syria-oil.html?_r=0
No matter what we do ISIS will not be stopped without Islamic countries, particularly Saudi Arabia stepping up and condemning, not only the actions of ISIS, but also changing their own extreme fundamental practices of beheading and flogging individuals. We need to stop selling them weapons unless they change the way they rule.
[Edited on 11/16/2015 by BillyBlastoff]
So Obama has an ISIS target list? Glad he shared it with a country willing to DO SOMETHING
________________________________________________________________________
Yes Obama has an ISIS target list.
It is the targets Obama will not hit because there might be civilian casualties.
Note to Obama, there are always civilian casualties in war.France is stepping up and into the war against ISIS where Obama tinkers around the edges to cowardly to do his job.
Even better, The Obama administration announced late Sunday that five Yemeni detainees who had been held at the detention facility at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba have been released.
Five more terrorists back on the battlefield.
What happens to Israel when they fight back against their attackers who hide among the innocent and it causes civilian casualties???? They get blasted by us and everyone else around the world. We could certainly do it that way but bear in mind that we would all of a sudden be considered the bad guys and the families and friends of the innocents killed would become our lifelong enemies many of whom would then become radicalized themselves. Remember what you said here next time the Israelis do exactly what you say we should do and watch how they are made out to be the bad guy monsters for defending themselves. If it were that easy we would just nuke the whole place.
We will see how many Americans agree with that assesment in November.
Obama is running for a third term? That's interesting news.
Heartwarming to see the resident neocon have issues with current events. Who was it again that wanted to destabilize the region and topple Saddam?
No invasion of Iraq, no ISIS.
Own it.
_______________________________________________________________________
There was no ISIS until Obama cut and ran from Iraq.
Hillary Clinton is running for Obama's third term.
Of course it was on Obama and Hillary Clinton's watch that ISIS was born.
WRONG!!!! There was no ISIS until W Bush/ Cheney ran Saddam and his Suuni army out of Iraq. ISIS is made up largely from Sadam's old army. When we took the Shia's side and ran the Sunnis out of town and the Shias started taking out revenge on the Sunnis after years of being horribly ruled by them ISIS was born and has recruited and grown since. Should have never ever ever ever ever ever ever invaded Iraq!!!! Huge mistake that led us where we are now.
Your cute little graphic doesn’t mention the fact that France did join President Bush’s coalition to fight against terrorism and actively participated.
Unlike Obama’s phantom coalition.
Obama gets the blame because of his complete foreign policy failure.
WRONG AGAIN!!! Boy are you wrong a lot!!! France joined the coalition to fight in Afghanistan where the people who attacked us and those who helped them train for it were. France were dead against us invading Iraq and they were demonized here for it. Remember the stupid Freedom Fries bull_hit??? They turned out to be 100% right about Iraq. That graphic shown above is exactly correct!!!!!
Your cute little graphic doesn’t mention the fact that France did join President Bush’s coalition to fight against terrorism and actively participated.
France opposed the Iraq invasion (the primary reason why there was no UN resolution about the invasion even brought to a vote was because France would have vetoed it) and the graphic is an accurate representation of the reactions of the individuals noted.
_______________________________________________________________________Your cute little graphic does not include the word Iraq.
France most certainly joined in The War on Terrorism.The UN? Now that is funny. The UN became irrelevant long ago.
Wow, are you really this big a fool, or is it that you just can't read?
The first 15 words in the graphic are this (bold and underline added for emphasis): "In 2003 the haters attacked France because the French refused to join the Iraq invasion"
_________________________________________________________________________The word Iraq is in the commentary, not in any of those loosely quoted.
Stop trying to back track and just admit you were wrong. France were dead set against us invading Iraq. They got blasted by us for it and they were right! PERIOD!!!!!
Sorry but those are both Bush's legacy. He invaded Iraq and sent Sadam and the Sunnis running and those Sunnis are the ones who formed ISIS.
"facilitated by the Obama administration’s December 2011 withdrawal from Iraq"
The entire sentence read "His strategy was greatly facilitated by the Obama administration’s December 2011 withdrawal from Iraq and the anti-Sunni policies pursued by the Shiite-dominated government in Baghdad. " Which means that he was alfeady up and running. And, as i have pointed out, Obama was pulling the troops out because of the agreement signed on 11/17/2008 which is before Obama was in office. You should really try reading the links you have been provided with, not to mention the links you put up. Thanks for proving me to be correct and you wrong again. Maybe you should just back away from this.
________________________________________________________________________
ISIS came about because Obama cut and ran from Iraq and then paid no attention to its rapid growth.
This is another reason Obama tries to call ISIS the JV and was humiliated for that naive view.
Why do you keep repeating something that is just plain wrong and incorrect. You really are trying to make yourself look dumb!!!
Prince Charles thinks that climate change is partially causing terrorism and refugees leaving Syria. And these are the people leading nations. I wonder what they will tell him at the Climate Change Summit in France next week (besides 'gimme some of what you're snortin' )
Gina - you don't think the drought has anything to do with fomenting insurrection?
When people don't have water they move to urban areas taxing already taxed resources.
I agree Billy people will migrate when their land produces no food and there is no water for the crops due to drought, but I think it is a stretch to think that people migrating will become militants because of the climate change. Militancy as I understand it has more to do with many other things, but even al Qaida would not allow people to become suicide bombers just because they were disgusted with their lives and the conditions in their lives, Ayman al Zawahiri said it is great sin to kill oneself because they are disgusted with poverty or the conditions in their life. They can only legitimately do it if they are fighting for their religion. Osama allowed it if young boys wanted to do it, Mullah Omar forbid young children from even going out on the battlefield at all. There are differing beliefs among the religious factions.
I don't know what Isis's protocol is but the fact that one of the French attackers dropped his suicide vest and left means He was not convinced he should do that for his religion.
In so far as climate change is concerned, it is just good sense if a land produces no crops, you go to some other place. If there is no rain in an area it is either a) because God wants to punish that area and those people, b) because of climate change and carbon emissions, or c) because certain rogue groups have been screwing around with the weather in an attempt to control and punish certain other nations/states, but they're not stupid and they have some of that technology also.
That harp technology and those transmitters fry the atmosphere, so why is the world allowing their use? It's not just the US using the technology.
[Edited on 11/25/2015 by gina]
Cute picture. But you already posted this link:
http://www.hudson.org/research/10584-on-the-origin-of-isis
Which said this:
ccordingly, it might be most useful to see the current sectarian conflagration tearing through the Middle East as an extension of the Iran-Iraq war. After that nearly decade-long conflict (1980-1988), Saddam Hussein, ever fearful of coups, liquidated senior army officers who’d emerged from the war as heroes. One such officer was his cousin, childhood friend, and brother-in-law, Defense Minister Adnan Khairallah Talfah. Having thus hollowed out the Iraqi army, Saddam built special units, like the Republican Guards and Fedayeen Saddam, that were well trained in espionage work and explosives. After the U.S.-led invasion in 2003, some of these officers, along with others from Saddam’s M4 directorate of the Iraqi intelligence service, joined the insurgency against coalition forces and Iraq’s new Shiite-dominated ruling order, which from their perspective was a collaborative American and Iranian affair.
On the other side, Tehran’s first order of business in 2003 after Saddam had been toppled was to take revenge on the Iraqi military and intelligence personnel the Iranians had fought in the 1980s. Many of Iran’s allies in Iraq—including, some say, former prime minister Maliki—formed death squads to go after these officers. Saddam’s onetime officer corps went into hiding and used their expertise and money to wage war against the regime that had replaced them. When the United States, in partnership with major Sunni tribes, defeated the Sunni insurgency, American officials pleaded with Maliki to stop hunting the former Baathists and allow them to resettle peacefully in a post-Saddam Iraq. Maliki didn’t, nor did his allies. Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps officers like Quds Force commander and Iran-Iraq war veteran Qassem Suleimani as well as Iranian-backed militias like Asa’ib ahl al-Haq continued to prosecute their war against Iraq’s Sunni community. Eventually the Sunnis came to see ISIS as one of their few lines of defense against this Shiite persecution.
So you have already shown that your little cartoon is factually incorrect.
_________________________________________________________________________
You forgot to read the salient point:
ISIS’s leader, Ibrahim Awwad al-Badri, is the self-proclaimed caliph, also known as Abu-Bakr al-Baghdadi, a 43-year-old jihadist from the Iraqi city of Samarra. During the American occupation, he was arrested on unclear charges, but deemed a low security threat and released after six months. Once out of jail, he joined Al Qaeda in Iraq, then under the leadership of the Jordanian Abu Musab al Zarqawi. Long before he proclaimed his caliphate, Baghdadi came to understand something that was lost on Zarqawi. As a member of the Banu Badr clan, Baghdadi saw that he needed to court the tribesmen on both sides of the Iraqi-Syrian border.
His strategy was greatly facilitated by the Obama administration’s December 2011 withdrawal from Iraq and the anti-Sunni policies pursued by the Shiite-dominated government in Baghdad. ISIS’s project was further aided by the Syrian uprising, which began in March 2011. Over the last three and half years, it has evolved into a civil war in which Syrian president Bashar al-Assad has slaughtered Sunnis. The White House and the rest of the international community have done nothing to stop him.
Proving yet again ISIS is a product of Obama's cut and run policy.
Wrong. The article clearly states that ISIS started around 2003. Try to create a timeline. It is easy. 2003 occurred before 2011. In 2003 Bush was president. That is 6 years before Obama became president.
Always with the semantics. ISIS' precursor was Al Quaeda in Iraq, A group that the U.S> had pretty well finished off by 2008 thanks to the new strategy Bush adopted after 2006. ISIS as we know it grew and metastisized on Obama's watch. To claim otherwise is ridiculous.
Terrible setback to his golf and campaign schedule.
Obama the Campaigner in action here. He really doesn't have a clue when tone and words matter most and when its ok to talk cute and tap dance in circles. he should have left the g20 summit immediately and went back to Washington or meet in Europe to aid France in an appropriate response.
We provided France with the intelligence to bomb those targets yet left it up to them to decide on their own course.
Obama doesn't have to campaign. He kicked your bull$hit party's ass twice idiot.
You ever hear of multi tasking?
I love listening to how morons would run the world.
We also bombed 100's of oil tankers in Syria today. Oil is how ISIS funds their operations.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/17/world/middleeast/us-strikes-syria-oil.html?_r=0
No matter what we do ISIS will not be stopped without Islamic countries, particularly Saudi Arabia stepping up and condemning, not only the actions of ISIS, but also changing their own extreme fundamental practices of beheading and flogging individuals. We need to stop selling them weapons unless they change the way they rule.
[Edited on 11/16/2015 by BillyBlastoff]
So Obama has an ISIS target list? Glad he shared it with a country willing to DO SOMETHING
________________________________________________________________________
Yes Obama has an ISIS target list.
It is the targets Obama will not hit because there might be civilian casualties.
Note to Obama, there are always civilian casualties in war.France is stepping up and into the war against ISIS where Obama tinkers around the edges to cowardly to do his job.
Even better, The Obama administration announced late Sunday that five Yemeni detainees who had been held at the detention facility at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba have been released.
Five more terrorists back on the battlefield.
What happens to Israel when they fight back against their attackers who hide among the innocent and it causes civilian casualties???? They get blasted by us and everyone else around the world. We could certainly do it that way but bear in mind that we would all of a sudden be considered the bad guys and the families and friends of the innocents killed would become our lifelong enemies many of whom would then become radicalized themselves. Remember what you said here next time the Israelis do exactly what you say we should do and watch how they are made out to be the bad guy monsters for defen
ding themselves. If it were that easy we would just nuke the whole place.
ISrael is not the bad guy when its proper and just actions of self defense lead to civilian casualties and neither would the United States be.
Cute picture. But you already posted this link:
http://www.hudson.org/research/10584-on-the-origin-of-isis
Which said this:
ccordingly, it might be most useful to see the current sectarian conflagration tearing through the Middle East as an extension of the Iran-Iraq war. After that nearly decade-long conflict (1980-1988), Saddam Hussein, ever fearful of coups, liquidated senior army officers who’d emerged from the war as heroes. One such officer was his cousin, childhood friend, and brother-in-law, Defense Minister Adnan Khairallah Talfah. Having thus hollowed out the Iraqi army, Saddam built special units, like the Republican Guards and Fedayeen Saddam, that were well trained in espionage work and explosives. After the U.S.-led invasion in 2003, some of these officers, along with others from Saddam’s M4 directorate of the Iraqi intelligence service, joined the insurgency against coalition forces and Iraq’s new Shiite-dominated ruling order, which from their perspective was a collaborative American and Iranian affair.
On the other side, Tehran’s first order of business in 2003 after Saddam had been toppled was to take revenge on the Iraqi military and intelligence personnel the Iranians had fought in the 1980s. Many of Iran’s allies in Iraq—including, some say, former prime minister Maliki—formed death squads to go after these officers. Saddam’s onetime officer corps went into hiding and used their expertise and money to wage war against the regime that had replaced them. When the United States, in partnership with major Sunni tribes, defeated the Sunni insurgency, American officials pleaded with Maliki to stop hunting the former Baathists and allow them to resettle peacefully in a post-Saddam Iraq. Maliki didn’t, nor did his allies. Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps officers like Quds Force commander and Iran-Iraq war veteran Qassem Suleimani as well as Iranian-backed militias like Asa’ib ahl al-Haq continued to prosecute their war against Iraq’s Sunni community. Eventually the Sunnis came to see ISIS as one of their few lines of defense against this Shiite persecution.
So you have already shown that your little cartoon is factually incorrect.
_________________________________________________________________________
You forgot to read the salient point:
ISIS’s leader, Ibrahim Awwad al-Badri, is the self-proclaimed caliph, also known as Abu-Bakr al-Baghdadi, a 43-year-old jihadist from the Iraqi city of Samarra. During the American occupation, he was arrested on unclear charges, but deemed a low security threat and released after six months. Once out of jail, he joined Al Qaeda in Iraq, then under the leadership of the Jordanian Abu Musab al Zarqawi. Long before he proclaimed his caliphate, Baghdadi came to understand something that was lost on Zarqawi. As a member of the Banu Badr clan, Baghdadi saw that he needed to court the tribesmen on both sides of the Iraqi-Syrian border.
His strategy was greatly facilitated by the Obama administration’s December 2011 withdrawal from Iraq and the anti-Sunni policies pursued by the Shiite-dominated government in Baghdad. ISIS’s project was further aided by the Syrian uprising, which began in March 2011. Over the last three and half years, it has evolved into a civil war in which Syrian president Bashar al-Assad has slaughtered Sunnis. The White House and the rest of the international community have done nothing to stop him.
Proving yet again ISIS is a product of Obama's cut and run policy.
Wrong. The article clearly states that ISIS started around 2003. Try to create a timeline. It is easy. 2003 occurred before 2011. In 2003 Bush was president. That is 6 years before Obama became president.
Always with the semantics. ISIS' precursor was Al Quaeda in Iraq, A group that the U.S> had pretty well finished off by 2008 thanks to the new strategy Bush adopted after 2006. ISIS as we know it grew and metastisized on Obama's watch. To claim otherwise is ridiculous.
Go back and read the links that I provided. ISIS was formed by Sadaam's generals. Al-Quaeda was not the precursor to ISIS. The two organizations have existed side by side since 2003.
One other important tidbit that receives little attention in the discussion about the creation of ISIS is where much of the seed money to create this group came from. Sadam's personal wealth was taken by his Sunni generals upon his deposition as were billions of United States greenbacks provided by the United States taxpayer to bribe the Sunni's during the Patreaus "surge" years.
Chain, I remember Bush warning Saddam that we were coming for him, giving him three days notice, and during that three days Saddam withdrew 900 Million dollars from the central bank.
Though it probably is true seed money did go Isis during the surge years, because Isis is a culmination of fighters from other groups. I think the Arabs also help fund them covertly. I know I read a long time ago the 400 land cruisers the Afghan Taliban were given prior to 9.11.01 were paid for by Saudis. They kept stability in the region and they are Sunnis, nobody was at war with them.
I recently saw a video with a large convoy of Isis trucks, there was a also a Blackhawk helicopter that flew by and did not do anything or interfere in any way. There is no way he could have missed them, which made me think some of the former CIA people who have spoken out on it know that there is a clandestine relationship between Isis and certain government agencies. It was no different with al Qaida, they were funded to do proxy wars and take down certain regimes. It was just made palatable tot he public under the guise of 'we're helping these freedom fighters' (Nicaragua), now it is this 'war on terror'.
If we want to stop terror and prevent attacks here, it is simple, we need to get out of other countries, let their own national citizens determine their fate. Yes there will be wars, changes of regimes, it's cyclical. One group rules for a certain amount of time, then they are taken down, another groups assumes power.
Do some searches on "full spectrum dominance". Then you'll start to understand the ultimate goal
Which is complete control by the govt. of everything and everyone, it amounts to global enslavement of free people. It cannot be achieved unless people's rights are taken away, by Executive Orders in our country, by regime changes in other countries. People give away their rights under this guise of terror, to be more safe they welcome a police state, slowly, naively.
[Edited on 11/26/2015 by gina]
ISIS leader Charaffe al Mouadan, who coalition says had direct contact with ringleader of Paris attacks, was killed in airstrike in Syria.
(CNN) ISIS leader Charaffe al Mouadan, who the coalition says had direct contacts with the suspected ringleader behind the terror attacks in Paris, was killed by an airstrike in Syria on December 24, coalition forces announced Tuesday.
Abdelhamid Abaaoud, who was killed in a police raid in the Paris suburb of Saint-Denis last month, had direct contacts, the coalition says, with al Mouadan before the attacks took place, which killed more than 120 people.
The coalition identified al Mouadan as an ISIS leader and one of ten high-value targets killed by coalition forces in the past month.
