SC Local Klan will hold a rally today because they want to preserve the "White Heritage" of the south
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/confederate-flag-rally-tests-diminished-ku-klux- klan
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I guess Weary and slakfish will be busy ... 😛 Just kidding!
I still want to know 2 things
1. What would the south do if it "Rose up" again. What changes would be made???
2. What rights have been taken away other than owning other humans???
And as far as slavery being something that was accepted. It's never been accepted as "moral" or "right" enslaved people have never wanted to be slaves and the people who owned other people knew very well it wasn't the right thing to do...they simply didn't care as long as it made them rich...nothing more
The fact that families in the south have wrapped that flag around themselves and their kids as something to be proud of is sad...I'm sure wearly went to many family picnics and waved that flag while eating and drinking...when the real meaning of the flag is treason...I can put bunny ears and a fluffy tail on my cat but it's still a cat....That flag is still a flag of treason and hate no matter how many meals you've had under it....
Well let me unequivocally answer the first question for you Goldtop. We'd kick all the Yankees and Raisins out first thing. If I have to hear how much better it was in Cali or New England, I'll scream. Hope that helps. 
Well let me unequivocally answer the first question for you Goldtop. We'd kick all the Yankees and Raisins out first thing. If I have to hear how much better it was in Cali or New England, I'll scream. Hope that helps.
Well I know what Yankees are but I'm afraid to ask about raisins....and even though I'm from CA I have no idea what its like to live anywhere else so I can't say its better its just what I know.......
Of course the slave owners knew better. Why do you think they killed slaves who learned to read? Because they were afraid of intelligent slaves. Gina you really need to do some serious reading about slavery before you post your opinions.
And Charles I am guessing life for the "raisins " as you called them was most likely better in Cali and New England based on what history tells us.... 😉
So let's talk about all of your ancestors who fought for the Union Army and came down South and raped and molested women and children and burned and stole private property. They were a lot better than slave owners? One thing I have learned from this thread is that you people suck as much as your ancestors.
Today picture from South Carolina. while I realize this probably doesn't represent the typical Confederate Flag Rights supporters, unfortunately, this is who is out there representing the flag rights for them. Bad scene.................
So let's talk about all of your ancestors who fought for the Union Army and came down South and raped and molested women and children and burned and stole private property. They were a lot better than slave owners? One thing I have learned from this thread is that you people suck as much as your ancestors.
my ancestors escaped Pograms in eastern Europe.
And those who didn't leave got killed by Hitler.
so watch what you're saying regarding ancestors.
This thread has been quite entertaining and disgusting at the same time, although it confirms what I have know ever since falling victim to The Waffen SS Sheriff's dept. of Manning County SC, you just can't reason with a South Carolinian.
So let's talk about all of your ancestors who fought for the Union Army and came down South and raped and molested women and children and burned and stole private property. They were a lot better than slave owners? One thing I have learned from this thread is that you people suck as much as your ancestors.
My ancestors came from Sicily at the turn of the 20th century and had nothing to do with the civil war...My grandfather was interned and had a daily curfew during WWII even though he had 4 sons serving in the US Army and Navy....lost one son to pneumonia while recovering from being wounded...
My grandparents were dirty immigrants from England and Eastern Europe turn of the 20th century so we unfortunately missed out on the raping and pillaging party.
1. What would the south do if it "Rose up" again. What changes would be made???
2. What rights have been taken away other than owning other humans???
1. It is NOW illegal to separate from the United States. It wasn't then. Post-Lincoln, Presidents have a right to send in the army and annihilate whomever. This is big point of mine.
But, if Lincoln would have let the matter go to court and would have recognized the CSA, like many wanted, i think things would be better today. (it wouldn't be better for your pal Slakfish, i'd have to move to the old US of A.) But better for the country in general. Think about it, socially, economically, and politically the South is far different than any other region in the USA. We could stop a lot of this blue-state, red-state arguing.
2. In a nutshell, much of the same reasons the colonies wanted freedom from the throne. As i've said, they are much the same in argument.
1. What would the south do if it "Rose up" again. What changes would be made???
2. What rights have been taken away other than owning other humans???1. It is NOW illegal to separate from the United States. It wasn't then. Post-Lincoln, Presidents have a right to send in the army and annihilate whomever. This is big point of mine.
But, if Lincoln would have let the matter go to court and would have recognized the CSA, like many wanted, i think things would be better today. (it wouldn't be better for your pal Slakfish, i'd have to move to the old US of A.) But better for the country in general. Think about it, socially, economically, and politically the South is far different than any other region in the USA. We could stop a lot of this blue-state, red-state arguing.
2. In a nutshell, much of the same reasons the colonies wanted freedom from the throne. As i've said, they are much the same in argument.
So we'd still have slavery and things would be better????? Interesting thoughts....(shaking my head in disbelief)
1. What would the south do if it "Rose up" again. What changes would be made???
2. What rights have been taken away other than owning other humans???1. It is NOW illegal to separate from the United States. It wasn't then. Post-Lincoln, Presidents have a right to send in the army and annihilate whomever. This is big point of mine.
But, if Lincoln would have let the matter go to court and would have recognized the CSA, like many wanted, i think things would be better today. (it wouldn't be better for your pal Slakfish, i'd have to move to the old US of A.) But better for the country in general. Think about it, socially, economically, and politically the South is far different than any other region in the USA. We could stop a lot of this blue-state, red-state arguing.
2. In a nutshell, much of the same reasons the colonies wanted freedom from the throne. As i've said, they are much the same in argument.
So we'd still have slavery and things would be better????? Interesting thoughts....(shaking my head in disbelief)
can i take a ride in your machine that allows you to view alternate timelines?
This thread has been quite entertaining and disgusting at the same time, although it confirms what I have know ever since falling victim to The Waffen SS Sheriff's dept. of Manning County SC, you just can't reason with a South Carolinian.
Luke, I've said three things - 1) What the Confederate flag represents to me, 2) that I am opposed to intolerance and that I respect the fact that other people interpret the flag differently, and 3) that I thought my State's elected representatives should be able to decide the disposition of the flag without undue influence from people who aren't South Carolina citizens.
The other folks say essentially (and not in a very nice way...lol) that I am not allowed to think differently than them, and that my elected representatives weren't capable of deciding this issue the way they thought it should be decided without outside influence.
So since you are so much more "reasonable" and "wise" than a South Carolinian, please explain to me why I should be reasonable when I simply expressed my well considered opinion. I didn't ask anyone if it was ok for me to have my feelings or thoughts. I didn't seek approval, so WTF are you talking about if you even know? I believe you just wanted to pile on but couldn't think of an intelligent way to do (like everyone else around here).
I can't wait to hear this.....
I never personally addressed you, just your bass ackwards state. I didn't expect you to be reasonable, nor did I claim to be wise. Your state's elected officials had 50 years to remove the flag and did not budge. Feel free to get the last word, I know your pride needs it.
Signed a North Carolinian
You know you can read the Articles of Secession on line. I've not read them all but the Georgia Articles seem to state the abolishment of slavery as one of the main reasons for secession.
I'll get to them all over the next couple of days, but I'm leaning towards slavery being the chief cause of the Civil War.
Here's one link for those interested. Or just google, "Articles of Secession".
http://www.civilwar.org/education/history/primarysources/declarationofcauses.html
[Edited on 7/21/2015 by BillyBlastoff]
Who wouldn't want to be associated with these folks?
Who wouldn't want to be associated with these folks?
what about when there were slaves before the confederate states existed? obviously they were brought here on ships with american flag. ban those too then
The length of this thread is sad.
Many are said tongue in cheek.
Butt cheeks I'm sure. 🙂
So we'd still have slavery and things would be better????? Interesting thoughts....(shaking my head in disbelief)
Please don't tell me you think we'd still have slavery. That's just asinine. I've put lots of information out that is probably new to a lot of you, yet nobody actually reads it. This is why i said --first thing --that it's as frustrating as talking about religion. Because nobody listens. They have their mind made up and just spew out idiotic notions.
"So, we'd still have slavery..." Jezuss Cripes!
Who wouldn't want to be associated with these folks?
i don't know ANYBODY that doesn't think they are idiots. Obviously they are idiots. Why do they need to get air time, attention, or mentions in this thread? Is that the only alternative to someone who doesn't want to forget the flag? I have to be a redneck? Far from the truth...i'm a pro-choice, gay rights, legalize marijuana, rights for doctor assisted suicide, peaceful and pretty nice guy. But i still get tired of getting kicked in the balls for being a white male southerner.
peace,
slakfish
Who wouldn't want to be associated with these folks?
i don't know ANYBODY that doesn't think they are idiots. Obviously they are idiots. Why do they need to get air time, attention, or mentions in this thread? Is that the only alternative to someone who doesn't want to forget the flag? I have to be a redneck? Far from the truth...i'm a pro-choice, gay rights, legalize marijuana, rights for doctor assisted suicide, peaceful and pretty nice guy. But i still get tired of getting kicked in the balls for being a white male southerner.
peace,
slakfish
It is brought up because it is part of the *today* problem of it's symbolism, now. Like it or not, it has been adopted by racists. Can anyone deny that? Is that what it represents? No. But also, well, yes. It shouldn't. It does. One can not reverse or change that now. The bad apples have damaged it's use as a historical respectful tribute. Thank them. So in light of that, people are saying it should be looked at as something to not show in black folks faces, regardless of your sincere respect for history. And many agree with that. So not everyone is out to kick your privates. It is not about you.
what about when there were slaves before the confederate states existed? obviously they were brought here on ships with american flag. ban those too then
Good point. Sadly, slavery once existed under the Stars and stripes too, but we as a republic saw slavery as inhuman treatment and abolished it. The South eventually would had done the same, the Civil War just sped up the process. As a side note, History shows that Lincoln went to war to save the Union; the emancipation proclamation was issued after the battle of Sharpsburg in 1862 and even then it applied only to the recognized states in the Confederacy.
Worth noting, from wiki :
1865, December: US abolishes slavery with the Thirteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution; about 40,000 remaining slaves are affected.[68]
1866: Slavery abolished in Indian Territory (now Oklahoma).[69]
1869, February, 27th: Portugal: King Louis I signs a decree of the government, chaired by the Marquis Sá da Bandeira, abolishing slavery in all Portuguese territories. Accordingly, all slaves in the Portuguese colonies in Africa were set free, resulting in the total termination of slavery across the Portuguese Empire.
1871: Brazil: Rio Branco Law (Law of Free Birth) declares free the sons and daughters born to slave mothers after 28 September 1871.[70]
1873: Slavery abolished in the Spanish colony of Puerto Rico: March 22nd.
1873: Treaty between Britain and Zanzibar and Madagascar to suppress slave trade.[49]
1874: Britain abolishes slavery in the Gold Coast (now Ghana), following its annexation in 1874.[71]
1877: Slavery had been abolished in Egypt in August 1877.
1882: Ottoman firman abolishes all forms of slavery, white or black.[72]
1884: France abolished slavery in its then Protectorate of Cambodia.
1885: Brazil passes Sexagenarians Law (Saraiva-Cotegipe Act), freeing all slaves over the age of 60, and creating other measures for the gradual abolition of slavery, such as a Manumissions Fund administered by the State.
1886: Slavery abolished in Cuba.[27]
1888, 13 May: Brazil enacts the Golden Law, decreeing the total abolition of slavery with immediate effect, without indemnities to slaveowners, but also without providing for any aid to newly freed former slaves.[73]
1890: Brussels Conference Act – a collection of anti-slavery measures to put an end to the slave trade on land and sea, especially in the Congo Basin, the Ottoman Empire, and the East African coast.
1894: Korea officially abolishes slavery, but it survives in practice until 1930.[74]
1896: France abolishes slavery in its then colony of Madagascar.
1897: Zanzibar abolishes slavery[75] following its becoming a British protectorate.
1899: France abolishes slavery in Ndzuwani.
1900–present[edit]
1902: The Ethiopian Empire abolishes slavery (though it was not legally and officially abolished by Emperor Haile Selassie until 1942).
1906: China formally abolishes slavery effective 31 January 1910, when all adult slaves were converted into hired labourers and the young were freed upon reaching age 25.[23]
1912: Siam (Thailand) formally abolishes all slavery. The act of selling a person into slavery was abolished in 1897, but slavery itself was not outlawed at that time.[76]
1917: Abolition of the Indian Indentured System.
Nepal abolishes slavery.[77][78]
1922: Morocco abolishes slavery.[79]
1923: Afghanistan abolishes slavery.[80]
1924: Iraq abolishes slavery.
1924: League of Nations appoints a Temporary Slavery Commission.
1926, 25 September: Convention to Suppress the Slave Trade and Slavery bound all signatories to end slavery.
1928: Iran abolishes slavery.[81]
1928: Domestic slavery practised by local African elites abolished in Sierra Leone.[82] Though established as a place for freed slaves, a study found practices of domestic slavery still widespread in rural areas in the 1970s.
1935: Italian General Emilio De Bono proclaims slavery to be abolished in the Ethiopian Empire.[83]
1936: Britain abolishes slavery in Northern Nigeria.[84]
1946: Fritz Sauckel, procurer of slave labor for Nazi Germany, is convicted at the Nuremberg trials and executed as a war criminal.
1948: UN Article 4 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights bans slavery globally.[85]
1952: Qatar abolishes slavery.
1958: Bhutan abolishes slavery.
1959: Slavery in Tibet is abolished by China after the Dalai Lama flees.
1960: Niger abolishes slavery (though it was not made illegal until 2003).[86]
1962: Saudi Arabia abolishes slavery.
1962: Yemen abolishes slavery.
1964: The United Arab Emirates abolishes slavery.
1970: Oman abolishes slavery.
1981: Mauritania abolishes slavery.[87][88][89]
2003: Niger makes slavery a crime.[86]
2007: Mauritania makes slavery a crime.[90]
There's a tremendous amount of human slavery and human trafficking going on today. Both here in America and throughout the world, all races, genders and ethnicities involved.
Anyway, I think Beat Down the Dust is a great comment by Warren about racism, slavery, economic injustices, and privledge. It uses irony and sarcasm. But it is to the point.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Warren Haynes? - Beat Down The Dust - One of my favorite songs from Ashes and Dust
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
#AshesandDust #WarrenHaynes
Release date is July 24th.
Various places you can get the cd/vinyl/downloads online:
https://itunes.apple.com/us/album/ashes-dust-deluxe-edition/id994316584
http://warrenhaynes.shop.musictoday.com/Product.aspx?cp=484_70738&pc=HADD14
International outlet:
http://www.mascotlabelgroup.com/warren-haynes
Do you know Sicilians are considered the "blacks" of Italy? I'm 1/4 Sicilian and proud.
So let's talk about all of your ancestors who fought for the Union Army and came down South and raped and molested women and children and burned and stole private property. They were a lot better than slave owners? One thing I have learned from this thread is that you people suck as much as your ancestors.
My ancestors came from Sicily at the turn of the 20th century and had nothing to do with the civil war...My grandfather was interned and had a daily curfew during WWII even though he had 4 sons serving in the US Army and Navy....lost one son to pneumonia while recovering from being wounded...
Bet a bunch of racists missed this story: http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/photo-black-official-helping-man-kkk-rally-viral-32579334
I'm from the north. Haven't read all the discourse but did some on FB. This is America. You are free to be a racist. You are free to start a succession movement. Ain't that great? I think so. You are free to own your guns, you are free to utter racist comments. America is great, ain't it?
I went to the WTC after 9/11, maybe 2-3 years later. All the factions were there. Factions. Fractions of humanity. Both for and against all sides of the political, ideological coin. Some men were keeping terrorism alive handing out 9/11 memorabilia. Some people think all Muslims are terrorists.
~~~~~~~~~~~
Just as the racists, the crazies, the intellectuals the deluded have a right to feel and believe and demonstrate, so do the righteous, the moderates and the people who believe common sense and kindness is what matters most. (Note I'm not saying "kill" here cause no one has that right.)
My Sicilian grandmother, a diminutive in stature, poor, uneducated woman said to me when I was young, "They're people too." Not politically correct, but I got the idea. Even though I grew up in a racist, mafioso section of Brooklyn and watched while the 60's played out on the TV screen, I understood what she meant and ignored how she said it.
~~~~~~~~~~
White people who are racists are the most fearful men I've come across. Not me being afraid of them, but I see them living in constant fear and anxiety that they are not good enough and that the Black man will overtake them.
So they buy their guns, and their SUV's, and talk their big talk, to compensate for their lack of self confidence, small peni and their absence of considered thoughtfulness about complex realities beyond their own TV screens and corners of the world.
I'm sure most aren't racist in this thread, but I will say, if you don't like America, the United States of America, there are plenty of places you can live.
You can move to the Nordic world and see mostly white people around you. You can move to large parts of this country and ignore the fact that black and other people of color exist. You can pretend you're not a relatively poor person who has almost no impact on the way things are or will be.
It's a free country. Live where you're comfortable. You won't ever have to question your view of the world.
You can pretend that your lack of gainful employment isn't about the capitalist system that also divides around economics and not just race. You can pretend you're not afraid of the man. You can delude yourself every single day of your life. You know why?
Cause this is America.
[Edited on 7/21/2015 by roboto]
[Edited on 7/21/2015 by roboto]
Who wouldn't want to be associated with these folks?
i don't know ANYBODY that doesn't think they are idiots. Obviously they are idiots. Why do they need to get air time, attention, or mentions in this thread? Is that the only alternative to someone who doesn't want to forget the flag? I have to be a redneck? Far from the truth...i'm a pro-choice, gay rights, legalize marijuana, rights for doctor assisted suicide, peaceful and pretty nice guy. But i still get tired of getting kicked in the balls for being a white male southerner.
peace,
slakfishIt is brought up because it is part of the *today* problem of it's symbolism, now. Like it or not, it has been adopted by racists. Can anyone deny that? Is that what it represents? No. But also, well, yes. It shouldn't. It does. One can not reverse or change that now. The bad apples have damaged it's use as a historical respectful tribute. Thank them. So in light of that, people are saying it should be looked at as something to not show in black folks faces, regardless of your sincere respect for history. And many agree with that. So not everyone is out to kick your privates. It is not about you.
Slakfish... I had no intention of kicking you in your privates either. The conversation was, has been, about the flag flying on the grounds of the State grounds of South Carolina. That flag was installed as a reaction to the Civil Rights Act. It was a racially motivated "screw you" to the law of the land.
To me the flag is more representative of treason than racism. I can't think of any other country that lets the loser of a war continue to fly there battle flag.
That "Beat Down the Dust" tune is great.
