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Author: Subject: Closed Session Called in Senate Regarding Iraq

Zen Peach





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  posted on 11/1/2005 at 04:44 PM
Good. Let's get all of this out in the open once and for all. I hope they keep the doors locked until we can start getting some real answers instead of tired rhetoric, such as the tripe added here by Sen. Frist.

Answers. The American people deserve them.

quote:
By LIZ SIDOTI, Associated Press Writer
31 minutes ago



WASHINGTON - Democrats forced the Republican-controlled Senate into an unusual closed session Tuesday, questioning intelligence that President Bush used in the run-up to the war in Iraq and accusing Republicans of ignoring the issue.

"They have repeatedly chosen to protect the Republican administration rather than get to the bottom of what happened and why," Democratic leader Harry Reid said.

Taken by surprise, Republicans derided the move as a political stunt.

"The United States Senate has been hijacked by the Democratic leadership," said Majority Leader Bill Frist. "They have no convictions, they have no principles, they have no ideas," the Republican leader said.

In a speech on the Senate floor, Reid demanded the Senate go into closed session. The public was ordered out of the chamber, the lights were dimmed, and the doors were closed. No vote is required in such circumstances.

Reid's move shone a spotlight on the continuing controversy over intelligence that President Bush cited in the run-up to the war in Iraq. Despite prewar claims, no weapons of mass destruction have been found in Iraq, and some Democrats have accused the administration of manipulating the information that was in their possession.

Vice President Dick Cheney's chief of staff, I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, was indicted last Friday in an investigation that touched on the war, the leak of the identity of a CIA official married to a critic of the administration's Iraq policy.

"The Libby indictment provides a window into what this is really all about, how this administration manufactured and manipulated intelligence in order to sell the war in Iraq and attempted to destroy those who dared to challenge its actions," Reid said before invoking Senate rules that led to the closed session.

Libby resigned from his White House post after being indicted on charges of obstruction of justice, making false statements and perjury.

Democrats contend that the unmasking of Valerie Plame was retribution for her husband, Joseph Wilson, publicly challenging the Bush administration's contention that Iraq was seeking to purchase uranium from Africa. That claim was part of the White House's justification for going to war.

Sen. Trent Lott (news, bio, voting record), R-Miss., said Reid was making "some sort of stink about Scooter Libby and the CIA leak."

A former majority leader, Lott said a closed session was appropriate for such overarching matters as impeachment and chemical weapons the two topics that last sent the senators into such sessions.

In addition, Lott said, Reid's move violated the Senate's tradition of courtesy and consent. But there was nothing in Senate rules enabling Republicans to thwart Reid's effort.

As Reid spoke, Frist met in the back of the chamber with a half-dozen senior GOP senators, including Intelligence Committee Chairman Pat Roberts of Kansas, who bore the brunt of Reid's criticism. Reid said Roberts reneged on a promise to fully investigate whether the administration exaggerated and manipulated intelligence leading up to the war.

Inside the Senate, Democrats sought assurances that Roberts would hold hearings into prewar intelligence. The Senate had been considering a budget bill when it went into closed session.


 

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Maximum Peach



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  posted on 11/1/2005 at 04:48 PM
Coolness! It's about time.

Is this move simiilar to the Dems giving the Republicans a "time-out" for being stubborn and childish?

[Edited on 11/1/2005 by musichick3]

 

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  posted on 11/1/2005 at 05:46 PM
Publicity stunt. All hat, no cattle

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/1/2005 at 05:59 PM
quote:
Publicity stunt. All hat, no cattle




Hmmm. Senate GOP members have been stonewalling any investigation into the intel for two years now. Enough is enough. This is our country and our tax dollars paying for all of it. We need some real answers. Afraid of the answers?

Two years of stonewalling:

quote:
March 14, 2003 - Senator Rockefeller sent a letter to Director Mueller requesting an investigation into the origin of the Niger documents.

May 23, 2003 - Senators Roberts and Rockefeller sent a letter to the CIA and State Department Inspectors General to review issues related to the Niger documents.

June 2, 2003 - Senator Rockefeller issued a press release endorsing a statement made of the previous weekend by Senator Warner calling for a joint SSCI/SASC investigation.

June 4, 2003 - Senator Rockefeller issued a press release saying he would push for an investigation. Senator Roberts issued a press release saying calls for an investigation are premature.

June 10, 2003 - Senator Rockefeller sent a letter to Senator Roberts asking for an investigation.

June 11, 2003 - All Committee Democrats signed a letter to Senator Roberts asking for a meeting of the Committee to discuss the question of authorizing an inquiry into the intelligence that formed the basis for going to war.

June 11, 2003 - Senator Roberts issued a press release saying this is routine committee oversight, and that criticism of the intelligence community is unwarranted. Senator Rockefeller issued a press release calling the ongoing review inadequate.

June 20, 2003 - Senators Roberts and Rockefeller issued a joint press release laying out the scope of the inquiry.

August 13, 2003 - Senator Rockefeller sent a letter to Senator Roberts making 14 points about the investigation, asking to expand the inquiry to address the "use of intelligence by policy makers" and asking for several other actions.

September 9, 2003 - After press reports quoting Senator Roberts as saying the investigation was almost over, Senator Rockefeller sent a letter to Senator Roberts urging him not to rush to complete the investigation prematurely.
October 29, 2003 - Senators Roberts and Rockefeller sent a letter to Director Tenet expressing in strong terms that he should provide documents that have been requested and make individuals available.

October 30, 2003 - Senators Roberts and Rockefeller sent letters to Secretaries Rumsfeld and Powell, and National Security Advisor Rice expressing in strong terms that they should provide documents that have been requested and make individuals available.

October 31, 2003 - Senator Rockefeller sent a letter to Director Tenet asking for documents related to the interaction between intelligence and policy makers, including the documents from the Vice President's office related to the Powell speech.

November 2, 2003 - Senator Roberts made statements during a joint television appearance with Senator Rockefeller claiming that the White house would provide all documents they jointly requested.

December 5, 2003 - Senator Rockefeller sent a letter to National Security Advisor Rice asking for her help getting documents and access to individuals.

January 22, 2004 - Senator Rockefeller sent a letter to Director Tenet asking for compliance with the Oct. 31 request for documents.

February 12, 2004 - Senators Roberts and Rockefeller issued a joint press release announcing the Committee's unanimous approval of the expansion of the Iraq review, to include use of intelligence in the form of public statements, and listing other aspects of what became Phase II.

March 23, 2004 - Senator Rockefeller sent yet another letter to Director Tenet asking for compliance with the Oct. 31 request for documents.

June 17, 2004 - Senators Roberts and Rockefeller joint press release announcing the unanimous approval of the report.

July 16, 2004 - Committee Democrats sent a letter to Bush asking for the one page summary of the NIE prepared for Bush. The Committee staff had been allowed to review it but could not take notes and the Committee was never given a copy.

February 3, 2005 - Senator Rockefeller sent a letter to Senator Roberts outlining Committee priorities for the coming year and encouraging completion of Phase II.

August 5, 2005 - Senator Rockefeller sent a letter to Senator Roberts expressing concern over the lack of progress on Phase II and calling for a draft to be presented to the Committee at a business meeting in September.

September 29, 2005 - All Committee Democrats joined in additional views to the annual Intelligence Authorization Bill criticizing the lack of progress on Phase II.





Let's see if the Seante Republicans cave, then we'll see if it's just a stunt. Because if very shortly they finally annouce some real investigations into the matter, then we'll see just how much of a stunt it is.

 

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Maximum Peach



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  posted on 11/1/2005 at 08:12 PM
Exactly Bhawk. I'm sure they don't want to get even more egg on their faces with the revelations a thorough investigation will produce.

 

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  posted on 11/1/2005 at 08:34 PM
I hope they start the investigation by finding out why Bill Clinton said Sadaam had reinstituted his nuclear arms programs and was harboring all those chemical and biological WMD, and also why he refused to take Bin Ladin the three different times the Sudanese government wanted to hand him over to us. I'd realy be interested in knowing that. Is that what you mean by an investigation?
 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/1/2005 at 09:58 PM
quote:
I hope they start the investigation by finding out why Bill Clinton said Sadaam had reinstituted his nuclear arms programs


Where did Clinton say that Saddam had reinstituted his nuclear arms programs? I looked and looked. No luck.

quote:
and was harboring all those chemical and biological WMD


Because thats why we hit him in 98. Then the Republicans screamed bloody murder that Clinton acted against Saddam.

quote:
and also why he refused to take Bin Ladin the three different times the Sudanese government wanted to hand him over to us. I'd realy be interested in knowing that. Is that what you mean by an investigation?


I think the "Clinton refused Saddam" story is my favorite fairy tale. Its so easy to debunk.

http://www.9-11commission.gov/staff_statements/staff_statement_5.pdf

http://www.pulitzer.org/year/2002/national-reporting/works/100301a.html

http://mediamatters.org/items/200406220008

http://mediamatters.org/items/200408120011

 

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Extreme Peach



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  posted on 11/1/2005 at 10:21 PM
quote:
I hope they start the investigation by finding out why Bill Clinton said Sadaam had reinstituted his nuclear arms programs and was harboring all those chemical and biological WMD, and also why he refused to take Bin Ladin the three different times the Sudanese government wanted to hand him over to us. I'd realy be interested in knowing that. Is that what you mean by an investigation?


There's a slight difference. Clinton didn't cause the deaths of 2000+ Americans and tens of thousands of innocent Iraqis and piss away 300 billion dollars of American taxpayer money for a naked power grab based on a lie that may have been a conspiracy. Or maybe that's not a big deal to you.

 

Universal Peach



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  posted on 11/1/2005 at 11:02 PM
"I hope they start the investigation by finding out why Bill Clinton said Sadaam had reinstituted his nuclear arms programs and was harboring all those chemical and biological WMD"

I agree, the best way to investigate the crimes of this administration is to rehash the crimes of an administration that has been out of power for five years. While they're at it, why don't they investigate what happened to the Lindbergh baby? That has about as much to do with the subject of this inquiry as anything Clinton may have done or said ten years ago.

 
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Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 07:03 AM
I think we're gonna hear a bit more about this soon.


DUBAI, U.A.E. (AP) - Deposed Iraqi president Saddam Hussein accepted an 11th-hour offer to flee into exile weeks ahead of the U.S.-led 2003 invasion but Arab League officials scuttled the proposal, officials in Dubai said

 

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Maximum Peach



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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 07:17 AM

 

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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 08:53 AM
SquatchTexas, it took me 1 minute to find what you SAY you searched and searched for - Bill Clinton's 1998 State of the Union speech. Choke on it.

"Together, we also must also confront the new hazards of chemical and biological weapons, and the outlaw states, terrorists and organized criminals seeking to acquire them. Saddam Hussein has spent the better part of this decade, and much of his nation's wealth, not on providing for the Iraqi people, but on developing nuclear, chemical, and biological weapons -- and the missiles to deliver them. The United Nations weapons inspectors have done a truly remarkable job, finding and destroying more of Iraq's arsenal than was destroyed during the entire Gulf War. Now Saddam Hussein wants to stop them from completing their mission.

I know I speak for everyone in this chamber, Republicans and Democrats, when I say to Saddam Hussein: You cannot defy the will of the world. (Applause.) And when I say to him: You have used weapons of mass destruction before; we are determined to deny you the capacity to use them again. (Applause.)"

 

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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 09:01 AM
And they had inspections and sanctions and dealt with it. Note that at no time in Clinton's presidency did we invade Iraq. That's a pretty big difference from Bush and Co.

The big "open secret" about this whole situation is that INSPECTIONS WORKED. War was unnecessary to accomplish the goals stated by Mr. Clinton in his speech. Clinton understood that and Bush didn't, probably because Bill is a much smarter man than Shrub.

 
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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 09:08 AM
What this all adds up to is our ability to gather accurate intelligence is pretty, pretty, pretty, pretty, pretty, pretty, awful.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 09:32 AM
quote:
SquatchTexas, it took me 1 minute to find what you SAY you searched and searched for - Bill Clinton's 1998 State of the Union speech. Choke on it.


Oh I see it now. Thanks for providing context to your claim. It is appreciated. As for choking on it, is there a particular reason youre being a **** ? I realize your other claims were shown for what they were and shot down, but its no reason to be nasty. And yes, I searched and searched for it, but a sentence in a speech from 7 years ago is kind of hard to track down when the context isnt known.

[Edited on 11/2/2005 by SquatchTexas]

 

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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 10:53 AM
This time you can't say it's all the "cover up" not the crime; not when 2,000 young American men and women have been killed; tens of thousands have been crippled for life and just as many (maybe more) Iraqi citizens have lost their lives. No one has even begun to count the numbers of Iraqis who have lost families, homes, limbs, eyes, etc. and FOR WHAT? That's what I want to know and that's what America and the rest of the world deserve to know.

While there's one hell of a cover up going on here, this time I hope the greed and pandering is exposed to the full extent that it exists and that the perpetrators of these horrific sins against humanity receive the punishment they deserve.

There was lot of talk about judgment day yesterday. Who among us has perpetrated such horrific crimes to deserve what these people deserve to receive on judgment day?

In our times, we know evil in the form of people like Hitler. But, Hitler was a crazed egomaniac. In my opinion, the people who need to answer for this war are quite sane and well aware of their decisions and their outcome.

Am I comparing George W. Bush and Karl Rove and Dick Cheney and Donald Rumsfeld and John Ashcroft and Paul Wolfowitz to Hitler? No, Hitler was insane. These men are quite sane and well aware of what they've planned, accomplished and hope to accomplish. I hope to God that somebody stops them.

[Edited on 11/2/2005 by elagrua]

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 11:12 AM
Yes, but you see, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Therefore, if Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, so that means Bush isnt responsible for any of this.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 11:38 AM
Kudos to Harry Reid for having the balls to stand up to this adminsitration. The Republicans will let Bush and his gang get away with what they've done, and I'm happy to see someone trying to stop them.


quote:


"The United States Senate has been hijacked by the Democratic leadership," said Majority Leader Bill Frist. "They have no convictions, they have no principles, they have no ideas," the Republican leader said.




This is from the House Majority leader, saying that none of the Democrats in the Senate have any principles. Or any convictions. Or any ideas. This reminds me of a post by our resident troll, not someone elected to lead this country, speaking about those he works with everyday.

Harry Reid had at least one idea, Dr. Frist.

This administration is going down, and there may be prison bars for some who now think they own the world.

[Edited on 11/2/2005 by SantaCruzBluz]

 

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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 11:40 AM
And for Frist to be lecturing ANYONE on principles and convictions is hilarious.

He is currently under investigation by the SEC for insider trading. He might get a conviction or two of his own.

Freaking little whiner.

 

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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 12:34 PM
quote:
Yes, but you see, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Therefore, if Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, Clinton, so that means Bush isnt responsible for any of this.


Then what IS he responsible for? Something positive, that is.

 

Maximum Peach



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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 01:14 PM
Frists display yesterday brought dishonor upon an already dishonored Senate. Squatch identified the weasel pansy's behavior with the word "whiner". Congressional leadership has gone out of their way to not investigate the deceit used to trick America into going to war. The "Downing Street Memos" were ignored but, like toilet paper stuck on a shoe, people are noticing the crap being dragged through the room.

Elagrua your point is well taken. The criminals of this administration planned and executed mass murder for profit. They knowingly sent many to their deaths for Halliburton profits. They need to be arrested, given a fair trial (with no chance of pardon), and if found guilty sterilyzed and put away where they can never harm anyone again.

 

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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 01:18 PM
He is responsible for carrying out a policy that was established during the Clinton Administration, that being to support regime change in Iraq. All the weapons in the world mean nothing unless there is someone willing to use them to threaten other people or even to use the weapons for evil ends. Sadaam was just that type of ruler. He had used WMD against his own people and used food and the necessities of life to control his people through terror. The first thing we have to thank Bush for is the fact that Sadaam is behind bars and no longer a threat to anyone. Next we can thank him for being willing to lead and take action rather than simply appease countries who allowed terrorism to flourish by hosting training capms, and funding their missions, as Bill Clinton did with North Korea. Next, we can thank Bush for the fact that about 50,000,000 people are now living in freedom under self government.

It's a mystery to me that some of you can ignore so many good things that have and are occurring in Iraq and here at home. The casualties of the war are extremely low for the type of conflict we've been engaged in and the economy is doing reasonably well, despite the hurricanes and the war and the terrorist attacks on our homeland. I guess you just want to be miserable. Have at it.

My neighbor just returned from Iraq in May of '04 and his brother just returned two weeks ago. If you listen to them I can assure you the troops know the good they're doing and feel it is a very worthwhile cause they're engeged in. But I suppose most of you naysayers know a lot more than they would.

 

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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 01:32 PM
Interesting take on this whole thing...


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3395977/

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 01:46 PM
quote:
He is responsible for carrying out a policy that was established during the Clinton Administration, that being to support regime change in Iraq.


Regime change doesnt necessarily involve war. More changes have been affected in world history through diplomacy than all the wars combined IMO.

quote:
All the weapons in the world mean nothing unless there is someone willing to use them to threaten other people or even to use the weapons for evil ends.


Agreed. However, he had no WMD and had not had WMD for over a decade. Hardly the threat Bush and his cronies made him out to be...

quote:
Sadaam was just that type of ruler. He had used WMD against his own people and used food and the necessities of life to control his people through terror. The first thing we have to thank Bush for is the fact that Sadaam is behind bars and no longer a threat to anyone.


I dont know if "thank" is the right word. The same thing could have likely been accomplished through diplomacy had we tried that route. We had no intention of of that as war was preferable.

quote:
Next we can thank him for being willing to lead and take action rather than simply appease countries who allowed terrorism to flourish by hosting training capms, and funding their missions, as Bill Clinton did with North Korea.


Comedy gold right there.

Please do some research on Saudi Arabia and Egypt for their contributions to terrorism before you comment further on this subject. Youre either ignoring facts or are woefully ignorant.

Also, please provide proof of your statement that Clinton funded terrorist missions and training camps for the North Koreans. I gotta see this.

quote:
Next, we can thank Bush for the fact that about 50,000,000 people are now living in freedom under self government.


Amazing. Are you talking about Iraq? If you are, you are either ignoring the facts or are woefully ignorant.

quote:
It's a mystery to me that some of you can ignore so many good things that have and are occurring in Iraq and here at home.


What good things would those be? What possible justification for the lives of our soldiers could be so great that they would be willing to die for the creation of an Islamic Republic teetering on civil war?

quote:
The casualties of the war are extremely low for the type of conflict we've been engaged in


Low? Remember this was supposed to be a "cake walk" and they never dreamed that there would be this many dead. Im not even going to address the other casualties that you are neglecting.

quote:
and the economy is doing reasonably well


Yeah, just dont think about that debt and it will all be ok...

quote:
My neighbor just returned from Iraq in May of '04 and his brother just returned two weeks ago. If you listen to them I can assure you the troops know the good they're doing and feel it is a very worthwhile cause they're engeged in. But I suppose most of you naysayers know a lot more than they would.


Im happy for them. However, even if they are positive its all good, thats still just their opinion and when you look at whats going on in Iraq, the Iraqis dont seem all too pleased. I also know from my own experience that what the press reports is usually only half of the story and its usually worse than whats really going on. No one doubts that there are good things happening in Iraq, but I think a lot of you Bushies tend to try to make filet mignon out of a shiat sandwich and expect everyone else to believe how good it is.

[Edited on 11/2/2005 by SquatchTexas]

 

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  posted on 11/2/2005 at 02:13 PM
And they forget that lots of good things happened on the ground in Viet Nam, too.

 

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