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Author: Subject: Intel experts again contradict Trump

Extreme Peach





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  posted on 1/30/2019 at 02:18 AM
Once again his own Intelligence Leaders have issued dire warnings that directly contradict Trump's own "wisdom" and his constant idiotic statements and actions that continually place us in financial, technological and physical danger, a man so incompetent, I am guessing he struggles to find his own fat ass with both hands?............Peace...... joe
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/politics-news/grave-warnings-aside-trump-c alls-russian-interference-hoax-again-n897201


https://www.google.com/amp/amp.fox29.com/news/politics/us-intel-chiefs-cont radict-trump-on-north-korea-isis-threats


https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/01/29/politics/us-intelli gence-chiefs-contradict-trump/index.html

Edited on 1/30/2019 by crazyjoe]

[Edited on 1/30/2019 by crazyjoe]

 
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Universal Peach



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  posted on 1/30/2019 at 12:38 PM
Come on Joe, Trump knows more than the experts....You don't believe the Intelligence community over Trump do you?

Any minute now Bot Boy and Bot Girl will chime in with some scripted post telling us the "Deep State" shouldn't be trusted...Or the panel of Intel experts are all hold over's from the Obama administration and actually hate America...

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 1/30/2019 at 01:09 PM
Weren't most of those who testified before Congress Agent Trump's appointments? How could they go against what he said? Doesn't he demand loyalty over facts / accuracy?
 

Maximum Peach



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  posted on 1/30/2019 at 02:36 PM
Only the gullible and/or stupid will believe anything trump says.
 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 1/30/2019 at 03:24 PM
quote:
Only the gullible and/or stupid will believe anything trump says.


http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/has-trump-peddled-bogus-claims-abou t-the-border-because-movie

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 1/30/2019 at 06:55 PM
What an arrogant & uninformed president we have. He thinks he knows more than career intel types. It's amazing he disputes intel community but bows down and won't criticize Russia & Putin.

"Trump Calls Intelligence Officials ĎNaiveí After They Contradict Him"

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/30/us/politics/trump-intelligence.html


 

Peach Master



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  posted on 1/30/2019 at 08:25 PM
Now lets hold the horses folks. Have we heard from ann coulter yet?

 

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Universal Peach



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  posted on 1/31/2019 at 09:31 AM
quote:
What an arrogant & uninformed president we have. He thinks he knows more than career intel types. It's amazing he disputes intel community but bows down and won't criticize Russia & Putin.

"Trump Calls Intelligence Officials ĎNaiveí After They Contradict Him"

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/30/us/politics/trump-intelligence.html




Probably just as amazing is that there are Trump supporters who think he does actually know more than career intel professionals....and more than generals....and more than economists....and more than, well, most any professional.

 

Peach Extraordinaire



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  posted on 1/31/2019 at 09:44 AM
quote:
Probably just as amazing is that there are Trump supporters who think he does actually know more than career intel professionals....and more than generals....and more than economists....and more than, well, most any professional.


The good news is that Trump is exposing the weak and deranged - his followers and admirers - who donít represent politics, conservatism, or the Republican Party. Itís plain lunacy to follow someone that praises Putin while attacking our own intelligence agencies, but these folks sure do exist.l, sadly. Itís good to know who these people are.

Some guy named Ben Shapiro has been making the media rounds for his comments. Putting politics aside - his tone suggests that anyone outside of the Trump loyalists is an enemy to the United States. This mentality is as unamerican as it gets. These people are nuts. Whatever happened to debating about healthcare costs?

 

Universal Peach



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  posted on 1/31/2019 at 11:02 AM
quote:
quote:
Probably just as amazing is that there are Trump supporters who think he does actually know more than career intel professionals....and more than generals....and more than economists....and more than, well, most any professional.


The good news is that Trump is exposing the weak and deranged - his followers and admirers - who donít represent politics, conservatism, or the Republican Party. Itís plain lunacy to follow someone that praises Putin while attacking our own intelligence agencies, but these folks sure do exist.l, sadly. Itís good to know who these people are.

Some guy named Ben Shapiro has been making the media rounds for his comments. Putting politics aside - his tone suggests that anyone outside of the Trump loyalists is an enemy to the United States. This mentality is as unamerican as it gets. These people are nuts. Whatever happened to debating about healthcare costs?


I sometimes wonder if people like Shapiro actually believe what they're saying or if they simply see an opportunity to do exactly what Trump and his henchman/women have done. That is to build a brand/following that can be milked for personal profit. Many of Trump's supporters after all have proven to be no more than self promoters who have clung to him only for their own enrichment.

Sure, there are a few exceptions (Steven Miller comes to mind) but no one seems all that passionate to me about any policy coming from the White House...It truly seems like one constant reality tv show to be milked for every penny possible....

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 1/31/2019 at 11:23 AM
quote:
quote:
Probably just as amazing is that there are Trump supporters who think he does actually know more than career intel professionals....and more than generals....and more than economists....and more than, well, most any professional.


The good news is that Trump is exposing the weak and deranged - his followers and admirers - who donít represent politics, conservatism, or the Republican Party. Itís plain lunacy to follow someone that praises Putin while attacking our own intelligence agencies, but these folks sure do exist.l, sadly. Itís good to know who these people are.

Some guy named Ben Shapiro has been making the media rounds for his comments. Putting politics aside - his tone suggests that anyone outside of the Trump loyalists is an enemy to the United States. This mentality is as unamerican as it gets. These people are nuts. Whatever happened to debating about healthcare costs?


Following up on Shapiro, there was a guest on FOX yesterday who was very critical of Dan Coats (DNI) for "not supporting" Trump. Of course Coats should just sandbag for Trump's mischaracterizations. In other words, Coats spoke truth and facts which disagreed with Trump's mental midget knowledge of intelligence and counter-intelligence. Specifically Coats' facts disagree with Trump's BS on actions taking place w/in North Korea.

 

Universal Peach



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  posted on 1/31/2019 at 11:34 AM
quote:
quote:
quote:
Probably just as amazing is that there are Trump supporters who think he does actually know more than career intel professionals....and more than generals....and more than economists....and more than, well, most any professional.


The good news is that Trump is exposing the weak and deranged - his followers and admirers - who donít represent politics, conservatism, or the Republican Party. Itís plain lunacy to follow someone that praises Putin while attacking our own intelligence agencies, but these folks sure do exist.l, sadly. Itís good to know who these people are.

Some guy named Ben Shapiro has been making the media rounds for his comments. Putting politics aside - his tone suggests that anyone outside of the Trump loyalists is an enemy to the United States. This mentality is as unamerican as it gets. These people are nuts. Whatever happened to debating about healthcare costs?


Following up on Shapiro, there was a guest on FOX yesterday who was very critical of Dan Coats (DNI) for "not supporting" Trump. Of course Coats should just sandbag for Trump's mischaracterizations. In other words, Coats spoke truth and facts which disagreed with Trump's mental midget knowledge of intelligence and counter-intelligence. Specifically Coats' facts disagree with Trump's BS on actions taking place w/in North Korea.


Fox is a perfect example of my point earlier....They are a network that milks the Trump train for money. They essentially created much of his mystique and greatly helped him get elected and ever since defend him despite actual reality. To the Rupert Murdoch's of the world it's all about making more money no matter what the costs....

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 1/31/2019 at 02:45 PM
quote:
Come on Joe, Trump knows more than the experts....You don't believe the Intelligence community over Trump do you?

Any minute now Bot Boy and Bot Girl will chime in with some scripted post telling us the "Deep State" shouldn't be trusted...Or the panel of Intel experts are all hold over's from the Obama administration and actually hate America...



You trust the folks who developed MK Ultra, Mind Control programs, and the torture programs used in Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo? As for me I support my President.

 

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Universal Peach



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  posted on 1/31/2019 at 07:06 PM
Just heard a clip on the evening news in which Trump claims the Intels were misquoted and the disagreements are fake news...He blames the media and all is actually well out there on the wire so to speak...
 

Universal Peach



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  posted on 1/31/2019 at 07:08 PM
quote:
quote:
Come on Joe, Trump knows more than the experts....You don't believe the Intelligence community over Trump do you?

Any minute now Bot Boy and Bot Girl will chime in with some scripted post telling us the "Deep State" shouldn't be trusted...Or the panel of Intel experts are all hold over's from the Obama administration and actually hate America...



You trust the folks who developed MK Ultra, Mind Control programs, and the torture programs used in Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo? As for me I support my President.


Obviously I believe the Intelligence community over a nit wit con man. And obviously you believe the con man.

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 1/31/2019 at 07:20 PM
quote:
Just heard a clip on the evening news in which Trump claims the Intels were misquoted and the disagreements are fake news...He blames the media and all is actually well out there on the wire so to speak...


Yes I saw that too. I also saw the testimony by Coats, Haskel, and Gray speak directly to Congress. What they said was not misquoted. I'd think that the right wingers and libertarians on this site who may have seen the testimony would admit that this is just another of the 7000 plus lies Trump has made since he took office. It's pretty black & white what the intels said, yet here is Russian Don trying to do a spin on their testimony. He's becoming more pathetic by the day. He's digging a deeper & deeper hole on many fronts. He needs to go into the daycare room in the WH and build a wall out of Playdough.

 

Sublime Peach



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  posted on 1/31/2019 at 09:37 PM
quote:
You trust the folks who developed MK Ultra, Mind Control programs, and the torture programs used in Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo? As for me I support my President.


Trump loves torture:

Torture works. OK, folks? You know, I have these guysóĒTorture doesnít work!Ēóbelieve me, it works. And waterboarding is your minor form. Some people say itís not actually torture. Letís assume it is. But they asked me the question: What do you think of waterboarding? Absolutely fine. But we should go much stronger than waterboarding.



 

World Class Peach



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  posted on 1/31/2019 at 11:31 PM
Gina, help. Here's the facts:

1. Trump has always supported torture.
2. The intel community criticized Trump.
3. Trump criticized them in turn.
4. In support of Trump, you say that the intel community is shady because we shouldn't trust torturers.
5. Trump then claims that the intel folks were misquoted and that they are in line with him.

So, do you support Trump in this issue, Trump who endorses torture even though you seem to be against torture?

Do you support Trump's rebuke of the intel community's criticism of him even after he says that actually they were NOT criticizing him?

I'm genuinely curious here.

 

Maximum Peach



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  posted on 2/1/2019 at 09:40 AM
The people in the intelligence community are American patriots who serve the country.

The President has never taken much of their advice, he actually almost purposefully goes out of his way to say the opposite! But behind the scenes, thankfully, there are people doing their job for this country. Trump's Presidency will pass. The work done at these intelligence agencies and the threats to America will remain.

One thing about Syria and ISIS, they have been reduced from holding 40,000 square miles in Syria to 1. One could say the mission to defeat them and the caliphate has been won and they have been defeated in that sense. However, that does not mean that they cease to exist and no longer pose a regional or global threat, they very much do. It's just two different things, a victory in one sense and an ongoing battle in another sense. The question just becomes how long does the US have to stay in these countries due to mission creep?

 

Maximum Peach



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  posted on 2/1/2019 at 12:46 PM
It's pretty interesting read to through the actual threat assessment:



https://www.odni.gov/files/ODNI/documents/2019-ATA-SFR---SSCI.pdf

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 2/1/2019 at 03:59 PM
quote:
Gina, help. Here's the facts:

1. Trump has always supported torture.
2. The intel community criticized Trump.
3. Trump criticized them in turn.
4. In support of Trump, you say that the intel community is shady because we shouldn't trust torturers.
5. Trump then claims that the intel folks were misquoted and that they are in line with him.

So, do you support Trump in this issue, Trump who endorses torture even though you seem to be against torture?


Do you support Trump's rebuke of the intel community's criticism of him even after he says that actually they were NOT criticizing him?

I'm genuinely curious here.



NO I DO NOT EVER SUPPORT/CONDONE TORTURE. I do not think it is ever necessary. I think people lie when tortured just to make the pain stop. I think people are co-erced into false confessions when torture is used.

I am aware of TRUMPS support of torture, and on THIS ISSUE I DISAGREE WITH HIS POSITION.

As to how it is unnecessary, take the case of Zacarius Moussaoui, he was going to flight training school in Oklahoma preparing for when he was going to participate in a terrorist attack, per his own testimony. He was charged with preparing for the 9-11-01 attacks, but he refuted this and told the Judge in that Virginia courthouse that NO he did not plan or participate in the planning or the 9-11-01 WTC attacks, but that he was training for an attack the NEXT YEAR> The Judge convicted him anyway thinking that as long as he was planning something later on, it was okay to convict him on what he was charged with, which was the 9-11-01 attack.

He had no problem telling what he was doing and planning. He did not need to be tortured to provide this information. He believed what he was doing was an acceptable form of jihad. [his belief NOT mine]. The point is, torture was not necessary.

Torture came in the forefront when people from Al Qaida were captured and those who captured them wanted confessions. The majority of the people captured were not planning anything, they were shot at and shot back. There was no need for torture other than to try to justify the 'war on terror' program.

Now the threat is from Isis. They will tell you plain out, what they want, and why they want to do it. Nobody is hiding anything. They want a worldwide caliphate and they want return of Jerusalem into the hands and control of Islam.

If you apply torture to other types of prisoners, who is is valuable for? Not murderers, because people who do that are either sociopaths with no conscience, psychopaths who plan and think they are justified in doing it.

Drug smugglers? It is not even valuable then, each person is just a little fish in cartel chain of command.

Torture is just anger and ignorance in action. If those who wanted to know things had any brains, they would do appropriate investigative work to get to the truth. Apparently they do not have the brains to do that.





[Edited on 2/1/2019 by gina]

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 2/1/2019 at 04:02 PM
P.S. I think the intel community probably does have more info. on Iran than Trump has been given.

 

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Sublime Peach



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  posted on 2/1/2019 at 07:17 PM
quote:
NO I DO NOT EVER SUPPORT/CONDONE TORTURE


Then why do you keep punishing us with your incessant insanity?

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 2/1/2019 at 07:32 PM
quote:
P.S. I think the intel community probably does have more info. on Iran than Trump has been given.


No. It appears that Trump is not interested very much in intel briefings. His interst is instead peaked by watching FOX and Friends. He has said he goes with his intuition & gut, and why not? His opinion and judgement surely is better than the facts known to career intel staff. No different than his opinion of the generals that surrounded him, but some who have quit because they found him impossible to work with or babysit.

 

Maximum Peach



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  posted on 2/2/2019 at 11:18 AM
quote:
P.S. I think the intel community probably does have more info. on Iran than Trump has been given.


Well, there definitely could be sensitive and classified intelligence that isn't disclosed in an open hearing for Congress. BUT, to say that they have itel on Iran that they haven't given to Trump are you saying they 1) don't trust the President with such information 2) are purposefully keeping data from the President for what reason? I'm assuming you worded your statement correctly. I would certainly hope the intel community would never withhold information from the President.

Here is what Dan Coats said on Iran in his prepared opening statement:

quote:
Now, let me discuss Iran

The Iranian regime will continue pursuing regional ambitions and improved military capabilities, even while its own economy is weakening by the day.

Domestically, regime hardliners will be more emboldened to challenge rival centrists and we expect more unrest in Iran in the months ahead.

Tehran continues to sponsor terrorism as the recent European arrests of Iranian operatives plotting attacks in Europe demonstrate.

We expect Iran will continue supporting the Huthis in Yemen and Shia militants in Iraq, while developing indigenous military capabilities that threaten US forces and allies in the region.

Iran maintains the largest inventory of ballistic missiles in the Middle East.

And while we do not believe Iran is currently undertaking the key activities we judge necessary to produce a nuclear device, Iranian officials have publicly threatened to push the boundaries of JCPOA restrictions if Iran does not gain the tangible financial benefits it expected from the deal.

Its efforts to consolidate its influence in Syria and arm Hizballah have prompted Israeli airstrikes; these actions underscore our concerns about the longterm trajectory of Iranian influence in the region and the risk of conflict escalation.

All four of these states Ė China, Russia, North Korea, and Iran Ėare advancing their cyber capabilities, which are relatively low-cost and growing in potency and severity.

https://www.dni.gov/files/documents/Newsroom/Testimonies/2019-01-29-ATA-Ope ning-Statement_Final.pdf



And here is what the 2019 Global Threat Assessment said on Iran:

quote:
Iran

Iranís regional ambitions and improved military capabilities almost certainly will threaten US interests in the coming year, driven by Tehranís perception of increasing US, Saudi, and Israeli hostility, as well as continuing border insecurity, and the influence of hardliners.

Iranís Objectives in Iraq, Syria, and Yemen

We assess that Iran will attempt to translate battlefield gains in Iraq and Syria into long-term political, security, social, and economic influence while continuing to press Saudi Arabia and the UAE by supporting the Huthis in Yemen.

In Iraq, Iran-supported Popular Mobilization Committee-affiliated Shia militias remain the primary threat to US personnel, and we expect that threat to increase as the threat ISIS poses to the militias recedes, Iraqi Government formation concludes, some Iran-backed groups call for the United States to withdraw, and tension between Iran and the United States grows. We continue to watch for signs that the regime might direct its proxies and partners in Iraq to attack US interests.

Iranís efforts to consolidate its influence in Syria and arm Hizballah have prompted Israeli airstrikes as recently as January 2019 against Iranian positions within Syria and underscore our growing concern about the long-term trajectory of Iranian influence in the region and the risk that conflict will escalate.

Iranís retaliatory missile and UAV strikes on ISIS targets in Syria following the attack on an Iranian military parade in Ahvaz in September were most likely intended to send a message to potential adversaries, showing Tehranís resolve to retaliate when attacked and demonstrating Iranís improving military capabilities and ability to project force.

Iran continues to pursue permanent military bases and economic deals in Syria and probably wants to maintain a network of Shia foreign fighters there despite Israeli attacks on Iranian positions in Syria.

We assess that Iran seeks to avoid a major armed conflict with Israel. However, Israeli strikes that result in Iranian casualties increase the likelihood of Iranian conventional retaliation against Israel, judging from Syrian-based Iranian forcesí firing of rockets into the Golan Heights in May 2018 following an Israeli attack the previous month on Iranians at Tiyas Airbase in Syria.

In Yemen, Iranís support to the Huthis, including supplying ballistic missiles, risks escalating the conflict and poses a serious threat to US partners and interests in the region. Iran continues to provide support that enables Huthi attacks against shipping near the Bab el Mandeb Strait and land-based targets deep inside Saudi Arabia and the UAE, using ballistic missiles and UAVs.

Domestic Politics

Regime hardliners will be more emboldened to challenge rival centrists by undermining their domestic reform efforts and pushing a more confrontational posture toward the United States and its allies.

Centrist President Hasan Ruhani has garnered praise from hardliners with his more hostile posture toward Washington but will still struggle to address ongoing popular discontent. Nationwide protests, mostly focused on economic grievances, have continued to draw attention to the need for major economic reforms and unmet expectations for most Iranians. We expect more unrest in the months ahead, although the protests are likely to remain uncoordinated and lacking central leadership or broad support from major ethnic and political groups.

We assess that Tehran is prepared to take more aggressive security measures in response to renewed unrest while preferring to use nonlethal force.

Ruhaniís ability to reform the economy remains limited, given pervasive corruption, a weak banking sector, and a business climate that discourages foreign investment and trade. Military Modernization and Behavior Iran will continue to develop military capabilities that threaten US forces and US allies in the region. It also may increase harassment of US and allied warships and merchant vessels in the Persian Gulf, Strait of Hormuz, and Gulf of Oman.

Iran continues to develop, improve, and field a range of military capabilities that enable it to target US and allied military assets in the region and disrupt traffic through the Strait of Hormuz. These systems include ballistic missiles, unmanned explosive boats, naval mines, submarines and advanced torpedoes,armed and attack UAVs, antiship and land-attack cruise missiles, antiship ballistic missiles, and air defenses.

Iran has the largest ballistic missile force in the Middle East and can strike targets as far as 2,000 kilometers from Iranís borders. Russiaís delivery of the SA-20c SAM system in 2016 provided Iran with its most advanced long-range air defense system. Iran is also domestically producing medium-range SAM systems and developing a long-range SAM.

In September 2018, Iran struck Kurdish groups in Iraq and ISIS in Syria with ballistic missiles in response to attacks inside Iran, demonstrating the increasing precision of Iranís missiles, as well as Iranís ability to use UAVs in conjunction with ballistic missiles.

We assess that unprofessional interactions conducted by the Iranian Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps (IRGC) Navy against US ships in the Persian Gulf, which have been less frequent during the past year, could resume should Iran seek to project an image of strength in response to US pressure. Most IRGC interactions with US ships are professional, but in recent years the IRGC Navy has challenged US ships in the Persian Gulf and flown UAVs close to US aircraft carriers during flight operations.

Moreover, Iranian leaders since July have threatened to close the Strait of Hormuz in response to US sanctions targeting Iranian oil exports.

Pages 29-31
https://www.odni.gov/files/ODNI/documents/2019-ATA-SFR---SSCI.pdf


 
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