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Author: Subject: GUNS DON'T KILL PEOPLE. PEOPLE DO

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 11:08 AM
quote:
1200 people die every day from tobacco related disease ....


In all seriousness, what is your point?

quote:
dead is dead the method matters not you want to save lives then do it !


Are you suggesting we update laws on both guns and smoking?

Rydethewind, are you against people having to demonstrate complete responsible operation of a firearm before exercising their 2nd amendment rights? And what purpose do the psychological evaluations serve used by our police on recruits before hire?

[Edited on 10/5/2017 by BoytonBrother]

 

World Class Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 11:52 AM
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Prescription medicine? Seriously? When is the last time someone's prescription medicine killed a crowd of innocent people


Glad this surfaced - actually psychiatric prescrips, SSRI in particular, seem to be a common element in these crazy attacks. So the answer to your question is prescription medication is klling crowds of innocents on a regular basis.

Baby steps, can't fix it all at once. The impasse over guns is killing any progress in dialogue. Best to take the focus off the weapons and start studying who should not have them and yank the guns away from them, all of them down to a squirt gun.

A good start would be any prescription for psychiatric medication, SSRI especially, include mandatory forfeiture of all firearms. It looks like SSRI are the real culprit in these "blaze of glory" postal "senseless" events.

Falls into the rules against operating heavy machinery or driving intoxicated category.


[Edited on 10/5/2017 by BrerRabbit]

 

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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 01:27 PM
_(&#12484_/
Guns or not, a person can find several other ways to inflict this type of damage on a crowd of people. McVeigh used commercial fertilizer and fuel, a bomb of that stature near the venue would have killed way more than 50 people. I like to keep mine as a hobby and as protection. Maybe my prescription medicine analogy wasn't the best but it shows how regulation and control can make little difference, if someone wants something they will find a way to get it.

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 01:47 PM
quote:
_(&#12484_/
Guns or not, a person can find several other ways to inflict this type of damage on a crowd of people. McVeigh used commercial fertilizer and fuel, a bomb of that stature near the venue would have killed way more than 50 people. I like to keep mine as a hobby and as protection. Maybe my prescription medicine analogy wasn't the best but it shows how regulation and control can make little difference, if someone wants something they will find a way to get it.


Since the OKC bombing, an effort was made to regulate and more easily track the purchase of large quantities of fertilizer. Also, companies have attempted to make the fertilizer less explosive. Regulation seems to have made a difference; or perhaps semi-automatic weapons are just much more easier to acquire.

 

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Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 01:51 PM
Exactly anthonyspare. Next thing you know these libtards will want to ban us from buying fertilizer bombs.
 

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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 02:00 PM
quote:

Since the OKC bombing, an effort was made to regulate and more easily track the purchase of large quantities of fertilizer. Also, companies have attempted to make the fertilizer less explosive. Regulation seems to have made a difference; or perhaps semi-automatic weapons are just much more easier to acquire.

I imagine in the Midwest and big farming states that a truckload of fertilizer is only a drop in the bucket, likely not to raise flags. And, if I am tight with farmer John and he has a stockpile of fertilizer for his several hundred acre farm, who's to say that he wouldn't sell me a truck load for some cash under the table for my "flower bed". If you want it bad enough you can get it, there is always a way, legal or not.

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 02:01 PM
Republican stances on issues.

A person has a right to own one or more weapons that can be used to commit mass murder.

It is a privilege, and not a right, to get medical treatment after being shot by a mass murderer with a gun.








 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 02:03 PM
quote:
quote:

Since the OKC bombing, an effort was made to regulate and more easily track the purchase of large quantities of fertilizer. Also, companies have attempted to make the fertilizer less explosive. Regulation seems to have made a difference; or perhaps semi-automatic weapons are just much more easier to acquire.

I imagine in the Midwest and big farming states that a truckload of fertilizer is only a drop in the bucket, likely not to raise flags. And, if I am tight with farmer John and he has a stockpile of fertilizer for his several hundred acre farm, who's to say that he wouldn't sell me a truck load for some cash under the table for my "flower bed". If you want it bad enough you can get it, there is always a way, legal or not.


That's a wonderful hypothetical that hasn't happened because most farmers know how severity. Care to address events that have happened?

 

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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 02:13 PM
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That's a wonderful hypothetical that hasn't happened because most farmers know how severity. Care to address events that have happened?


Just saying it is possible, I imagine I could roll through Nebraska or Kansas and find someone willing to sell me a truck bed full of fertilizer without an issue.

Boston Marathon, over 200 injured in seconds, materials cost WAY less than any firearm, and MUCH easier to conceal. If someone wants to hurt people, they will, regardless of a firearm, is the point im trying to make.


Disclaimer: For what its worth, you all are the last group of people I would want to argue politics with, ABB fam, sorry that ALL of our views don't align. And I dig Porkchop's videos too.

[Edited on 10/5/2017 by anthonyspare]

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 02:13 PM
quote:
Republican stances on issues.

A person has a right to own one or more weapons that can be used to commit mass murder.

It is a privilege, and not a right, to get medical treatment after being shot by a mass murderer with a gun.



If the issue is mental illness, then why seek to limit access to mental health care?

If laws limiting access to fire arms, even the deadliest kinds, is unconstitutional and thus unacceptable, then so should laws/order that are broadly discriminatory in nature, such as travel bans, because they are unconstitutional.

There is no consistency or logic. Just lots of nonsense about cigarettes and meds.

 

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Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 02:21 PM
quote:
quote:

That's a wonderful hypothetical that hasn't happened because most farmers know how severity. Care to address events that have happened?


Just saying it is possible, I imagine I could roll through Nebraska or Kansas and find someone willing to sell me a truck bed full of fertilizer without an issue.

Boston Marathon, over 200 injured in seconds, materials cost WAY less than any firearm, and MUCH easier to conceal. If someone wants to hurt people, they will, regardless of a firearm, is the point im trying to make.


If a chicken had lips, it could whistle.

You have a wonderful imagination and apparently a low opinion of the peoples of the Plain states to follow regulation of controlled, potentially deadly, substances that they use to feed their families with.

 

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Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 02:23 PM
quote:
Just saying it is possible, I imagine I could roll through Nebraska or Kansas and find someone willing to sell me a truck bed full of fertilizer without an issue.


Amen brother. If I wanted to commit mass murder, I'd definitely research how to make a bomb, and take my chances that I can execute the science behind it, rather than use an AR-15.

quote:
Boston Marathon, over 200 injured in seconds, materials cost WAY less than any firearm, and MUCH easier to conceal. If someone wants to hurt people, they will, regardless of a firearm, is the point im trying to make.


Exactly my point! It's not hard at all to build those bombs. Any idiot can do it. It's a lot easier than spraying an AR-15, let me tell you. And just because only 3 people died in Boston, it doesn't affect my point one bit! Dumb liberals.

 

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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 02:27 PM
Requiring any type of psychological exam for gun purchases is moronic. Just because our police rely on them to protect and serve is completely irrelevant.
 

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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 02:28 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:

That's a wonderful hypothetical that hasn't happened because most farmers know how severity. Care to address events that have happened?


Just saying it is possible, I imagine I could roll through Nebraska or Kansas and find someone willing to sell me a truck bed full of fertilizer without an issue.

Boston Marathon, over 200 injured in seconds, materials cost WAY less than any firearm, and MUCH easier to conceal. If someone wants to hurt people, they will, regardless of a firearm, is the point im trying to make.


If a chicken had lips, it could whistle.

You have a wonderful imagination and apparently a low opinion of the peoples of the Plain states to follow regulation of controlled, potentially deadly, substances that they use to feed their families with.


Sorry if I offended anyone from Kansas or Nebraska, was merely using leading fertilizer consumers as an example, nothing against the people of the Plains states or saying that they are more likely to put their family's well-being in harm. Here, in Kentucky, I could go to a numerous farms and purchase fertilizer no questions asked, today, tomorrow, whenever. With that said, no offense to the residents of Kentucky.

Curious to what are your thoughts are regarding , "Boston Marathon, over 200 injured in seconds, materials cost WAY less than any firearm, and MUCH easier to conceal. If someone wants to hurt people, they will, regardless of a firearm, is the point i'm trying to make. "

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 02:48 PM
quote:
Curious to what are your thoughts are regarding , "Boston Marathon, over 200 injured in seconds, materials cost WAY less than any firearm, and MUCH easier to conceal. If someone wants to hurt people, they will, regardless of a firearm, is the point i'm trying to make. "


Pipe bombs are illegal. A person has to learn how to make one and build it himself in secret. Thus, we don't have massive pipe bombings every week. In fact, very rarely.

Semi-automatic weapons, and devices that convert them to automatic weapons, are legal and easy to acquire. We have deadly mass shootings on a weekly basis.

 

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Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 02:55 PM
quote:
Boston Marathon, over 200 injured in seconds


No offense, but you are using an analogy with less than half the injuries of Vegas, and 55 less deaths. And it's easier to spray with an AR-15 than learn how to build a bomb. It's not about eliminating mass shootings but rather making it as difficult as possible for them - not buying an AR-15 and spraying. Can you make a fertilizer bomb and execute controlled detonation easier than you can spray an AR-15? Just curious.

quote:
materials cost WAY less than any firearm, and MUCH easier to conceal. If someone wants to hurt people, they will, regardless of a firearm, is the point i'm trying to make.


But very difficult to make compared to shooting an automatic weapon.

Next?

 

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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 03:19 PM
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But very difficult to make compared to shooting an automatic weapon.
Next?


Unfortunately they are not very difficult to build, I bet you have every ingredient in your kitchen/garage/basement right now. A quick Google search and about an hours time, you have a bomb capable of killing.

 

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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 03:21 PM
You guys win. Gotta get out of this Whippin Post.
 

A Peach Supreme



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 03:41 PM
quote:
But very difficult to make compared to shooting an automatic weapon.

Next?
You make it sound like what this guy did was easy. Maybe buying the guns & ammo was, though he spent 30 years doing that. All indications are that this took a great deal of planning. Just because you can buy guns & accessories legally does not make pulling off a sick stunt like this easy. The time and effort this sick bastard put into this I'll bet would have been more than sufficient for him to learn to make bombs. Fact is he had explosive material in his car at the time he did this. We don't know why he chose to do what he did. But the point that someone COULD make bombs and do similar damage is indeed a valid point whether you think it is or not.

quote:
No offense, but you are using an analogy with less than half the injuries of Vegas, and 55 less deaths. And it's easier to spray with an AR-15 than learn how to build a bomb. It's not about eliminating mass shootings but rather making it as difficult as possible for them - not buying an AR-15 and spraying. Can you make a fertilizer bomb and execute controlled detonation easier than you can spray an AR-15? Just curious.
Again you make it sound so easy, anybody could do it. How about jet airliners flying into buildings? Is that enough casualties for you? Perhaps flying lessons should be illegal? I am a pilot and I didn't have to pass any kind of mental health test to take flying lessons.

 

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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 05:06 PM
quote:
quote:
But very difficult to make compared to shooting an automatic weapon.

Next?
You make it sound like what this guy did was easy. Maybe buying the guns & ammo was, though he spent 30 years doing that. All indications are that this took a great deal of planning. Just because you can buy guns & accessories legally does not make pulling off a sick stunt like this easy. The time and effort this sick bastard put into this I'll bet would have been more than sufficient for him to learn to make bombs. Fact is he had explosive material in his car at the time he did this. We don't know why he chose to do what he did. But the point that someone COULD make bombs and do similar damage is indeed a valid point whether you think it is or not.

quote:
No offense, but you are using an analogy with less than half the injuries of Vegas, and 55 less deaths. And it's easier to spray with an AR-15 than learn how to build a bomb. It's not about eliminating mass shootings but rather making it as difficult as possible for them - not buying an AR-15 and spraying. Can you make a fertilizer bomb and execute controlled detonation easier than you can spray an AR-15? Just curious.
Again you make it sound so easy, anybody could do it. How about jet airliners flying into buildings? Is that enough casualties for you? Perhaps flying lessons should be illegal? I am a pilot and I didn't have to pass any kind of mental health test to take flying lessons.


What would have been his plan if assault weapons were not available. He can still have a pistol, shotgun and hunting rifle. Could he mow down 500+ people from 500 yards? no

Also where have you been since 9/11....its much harder to get on a plane now...a big PITA

They made huge changes to security for flying. Also how many people are killed everyday in plane violence....how many die here everyday due to gun violence....more NRA Rhetoric

Please if you don't want to find a solution don't stop those who actually care to monitor the toys children need to play with

Also I couldn't care less what the NRA has to say on anything as far as I'm concerned their focus needs to be picnics and social events for their members in their club fort. They don't speak for the majority....nowhere close

 

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World Class Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 05:08 PM
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I am a pilot and I didn't have to pass any kind of mental health test to take flying lessons.


Appreciate the heads up.

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 05:32 PM
quote:
quote:
quote:
But very difficult to make compared to shooting an automatic weapon.

Next?
You make it sound like what this guy did was easy. Maybe buying the guns & ammo was, though he spent 30 years doing that. All indications are that this took a great deal of planning. Just because you can buy guns & accessories legally does not make pulling off a sick stunt like this easy. The time and effort this sick bastard put into this I'll bet would have been more than sufficient for him to learn to make bombs. Fact is he had explosive material in his car at the time he did this. We don't know why he chose to do what he did. But the point that someone COULD make bombs and do similar damage is indeed a valid point whether you think it is or not.

quote:
No offense, but you are using an analogy with less than half the injuries of Vegas, and 55 less deaths. And it's easier to spray with an AR-15 than learn how to build a bomb. It's not about eliminating mass shootings but rather making it as difficult as possible for them - not buying an AR-15 and spraying. Can you make a fertilizer bomb and execute controlled detonation easier than you can spray an AR-15? Just curious.
Again you make it sound so easy, anybody could do it. How about jet airliners flying into buildings? Is that enough casualties for you? Perhaps flying lessons should be illegal? I am a pilot and I didn't have to pass any kind of mental health test to take flying lessons.


What would have been his plan if assault weapons were not available. He can still have a pistol, shotgun and hunting rifle. Could he mow down 500+ people from 500 yards? no

Also where have you been since 9/11....its much harder to get on a plane now...a big PITA

They made huge changes to security for flying. Also how many people are killed everyday in plane violence....how many die here everyday due to gun violence....more NRA Rhetoric

Please if you don't want to find a solution don't stop those who actually care to monitor the toys children need to play with

Also I couldn't care less what the NRA has to say on anything as far as I'm concerned their focus needs to be picnics and social events for their members in their club fort. They don't speak for the majority....nowhere close



The NRA speaks for gun and ammo manufacturers more than they speak for gun owners.

 

Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 05:38 PM
quote:
But the point that someone COULD make bombs and do similar damage is indeed a valid point whether you think it is or not.



It's not valid. He wasn't throwing pipe bombs into the crowd for over 10 minutes. He was using legal, rapid-firing guns, which did continuous damage and kept medical personnel and police from being able to respond and tend to wounded at the scene quickly.

After OKC or Boston, the only two major bombings in the US that I can think of off the top of my head from the past 30 years, no one gave hypotheticals on if the murderers instead had legal guns.


 

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Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/5/2017 at 05:39 PM
quote:
The NRA speaks for gun and ammo manufacturers more than they speak for gun owners.


Stephen Paddock was one of their best customers.

 

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Ultimate Peach



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  posted on 10/6/2017 at 07:39 AM
At the end of the day, the anti gun-control crowd resist trying to improve the situation, because they sadly feel as though they are losing some sort of right. Talk about sensitive snowflakes, good Lord. Their logic is: if Americans have to test their responsibiliy, knowledge, and competence before buying a firearm, they see it as a loss of a right. That's some perspective! Too many Americans put their own interests over the greater common sense good.
 
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