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Author: Subject: Interesting bit of info from The Fillmore East Archives

Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/27/2014 at 03:52 PM
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I think that was the late show March 13, the end of the At Fillmore East run. I can believe it was a four or five hour show, keeping in mind that that's an estimate and that comments like 'nobody said a word when it ended' are figures of speech.


Not figures of speech, just a quote from an interview that gets repeated till some believe its fact.

I'm saying the quote should be taken as a figure of speech.
quote:
No chance that they played songs that never showed in set lists before or after the closing.

They did play all of the songs BNAKED mentioned. There are six setlists from that 1971 that include DWYNM/Cross to Bear, and we have recordings of one of those (the Warehouse). They played Revival periodically in '71, more often as the year went on, and I think there are three versions on tape. They did play Dimples, Outskirts of Town and Every Hungry Woman in '70 but those seem to have fallen off the setlist. (So did Hoochie Coochie Man and Leave My Blues at Home, based on the available setlists.) They even played Please Call Home once, late in the year. So it's unlikely they played those last couple of songs but it's not totally impossible. I also doubt the show went six hours even though my reading was that they played Whipping Post > Mountain Jam and then did a two hour jam. I doubt anybody was looking at his watch during the show. I don't know how long the longest existing Duane-era show is, but Bill Graham said the performance on the 26th went four to four and a half hours. I don't think that's crazy.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/27/2014 at 04:18 PM
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OK so someone records this legendary show and then after all that they hand the tapes over?



I doubt that any taper would have considered it to be legendary at the time he had to "Hand them over"....That being said...About 15 years ago I was at a Van Morrison/Taj Mahal show @ the Universal Amp. in L.A. I had a seat on the rail and was stealthily recording the show when a "yellow jacket" walked right by me and saw the red light on my Sony. I had a choice, the tapes or the deck... I chose to keep the deck...

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/27/2014 at 04:58 PM
As Oldcoot mentioned, it is unlikely that anyone brought a cassette recorder, two dozen batteries, a bag full of blanks. If you went to that much effort of recording various acts and then some marathon ABB show and pulled it all off stealth fashion then who would flash it around for security to step in then? If the show was over and I was leaving then security could kiss my ass.

Surprised that you coughed up either the tapes or the deck, Vince. They legally have no right to take, listen or watch any tape or deck. I can see getting caught and stopping. Hope you pulled another tape out after they left.

Whether it was considered legendary at the time, if it was a mammoth show that was three to four times longer than the usual set anyone with the thought of taping would know it was a special show.

When I asked Dickey about the show and it's' length, he laughed and said "so people have told me". He said it was a great night but didn't seem to remember playing till the cows came home.

Who knows? Maybe some security guy has been waiting for just the right moment to cash in. Hopefully someone recording on a cassette player in 71 had a time machine and some better equipment otherwise it likely sounds like crap anyway. A two 90 minute cassette Mtn Jam that speeds up and down as the batteries were dying and the tapes were getting flipped, do we really want to hear that? Could take away the magic.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/27/2014 at 05:26 PM
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Surprised that you coughed up either the tapes or the deck, Vince. They legally have no right to take, listen or watch any tape or deck. I can see getting caught and stopping. Hope you pulled another tape out after they left.

It's better than getting thrown out and missing the rest of the show, which was his third option.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/27/2014 at 05:36 PM
Option number three could be telling him where to go.

A benefit of being a big guy is that most security will try and avoid conflict if at all possible.

With Vince's loveable nature and smooth talk, I am surprised that he didn't let him continue and buy him a beer.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/27/2014 at 08:22 PM
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Surprised that you coughed up either the tapes or the deck, Vince. They legally have no right to take, listen or watch any tape or deck. I can see getting caught and stopping. Hope you pulled another tape out after they left.

It's better than getting thrown out and missing the rest of the show, which was his third option.



Correct. I was asked to follow not only that "security guard" but a couple of more who were also in the area. My girlfriend remained in her seat as I was escorted to the office where my options were explained to me. I gave up the tapes and my batteries and was escorted back to my seat.

All of the brave talk here is making me laugh out loud. I had no choice.

 

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  posted on 8/27/2014 at 09:42 PM
I would let a guy known as BigV keep recording. They insulted you by only sending 3 guys.

Did they return your batteries? Should have sued. Pain, suffering, stolen property, missed part of show, left GF unprotected, not to mention the tarnished reputation. You live in the Land of the Lawyer Next time call 1 800 LEE FREE.

 

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Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/27/2014 at 10:05 PM
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There are exceptions - in late 1971, the ABB played at Marietta College. I spoke with an older alum who attended that show and he mentioned the band played its typical repertoire and then brought Luther Allison to the stage for 30-40 minutes of a blues based jam. Unfortunately no tapes were rolling that night either.


I was at the Cow Palace show on New Year's Night 1974; a long time ago so I remember very little except for Elvin and some other guests coming out to jam after a very long set. To tell you the truth, most in my little gang of fellow Allman worshipers actually started to get bored with the length of the performance, especially after Gregg failed to complete the concert... I recall him saying, "we're gonna boogie 'til the cows come home" and then he left the stage. In my recollection, these "Extremely long shows" were a rarity.....

But like others here, I still hope a recording of of 6-26 surfaces someday, but if it does..... I'll wager it is nowhere near the marathon people 'remember'.

 

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Extreme Peach



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  posted on 8/28/2014 at 08:04 AM
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I have joked over the years that this show gets longer all the time...I want a copy like everyone else. Will sit and listen with Santa and the Easter Bunny.


Reminds me of the joke, Gibson made between 600 - 700 Les Paul's in 1958, of which 1300 survive to this day.

 

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  posted on 8/28/2014 at 09:51 AM
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quote:


I have joked over the years that this show gets longer all the time...I want a copy like everyone else. Will sit and listen with Santa and the Easter Bunny.


Reminds me of the joke, Gibson made between 600 - 700 Les Paul's in 1958, of which 1300 survive to this day.


Pontiac made 697 Trans Am's in 1969, but there are about 1500 of them now.

In 2025, people will be talking about the 28 hour Allman show at the Fillmore where Bill Graham served breakfast and put them to bed



 

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  posted on 8/28/2014 at 11:46 AM

quote:
.....Gregg failed to complete the concert... I recall him saying, "we're gonna boogie 'til the cows come home" and then he left the stage.....



Sorry, but that made me laugh!

I expect he had a more pressing engagement!




 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/29/2014 at 02:50 PM
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Reminds me of the joke, Gibson made between 600 - 700 Les Paul's in 1958, of which 1300 survive to this day.



Haha!....My new signature!

 

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  posted on 8/29/2014 at 03:19 PM
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Reminds me of the joke, Gibson made between 600 - 700 Les Paul's in 1958, of which 1300 survive to this day.



Haha!....My new signature!


I get what he was trying to say but ironically the OP's numbers are wrong as well.

Les Paul Guitar Production numbers: 1958: 434 (about half Goldtops), 1959: 643, 1960: 635 (about 1600 estimated 1958-1960 sunburst Les Pauls)

http://home.provide.net/~cfh/lpsun.html

[Edited on 8/29/2014 by Bill_Graham]

 

Peach Bud



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  posted on 8/9/2017 at 01:48 PM
I know this is an old thread, but I've done some digging recently and couldn't find the following info anywhere on the site. Apologies if it has already been discussed, but I think it's very interesting...

This is from the copyright records on the Library of Congress' website. Here's a screenshot of the search. It shows that a copyright exists for a "sound recording" with the title: "The Allman Brothers Band : Fillmore East, 06/26/1971." The copyright claimant (and authorship on the application) belongs to "Bill Graham Archives, LLC." The catalog entry was created in 2005 and has a publication date of 3-27-06, which is after Wolfgang purchased the archives. There was a previous registration as a "Pre-1972 sound recording" and the basis for the new copyright claim is "remixing and editing." So, take it as you will. Very interested to hear what people have to say though...has anyone seen this before?



[Edited on 8/10/2017 by SkyDog4President]

[Edited on 8/10/2017 by SkyDog4President]

 

Peach Master



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  posted on 8/9/2017 at 09:58 PM
That certainly is an attention grabber. Did you also see a copyright filing for 6-27-71? If not it's possible the WV people confused the two dates. If there are filings for both this is pretty interesting.

 

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Peach Master



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  posted on 8/9/2017 at 10:04 PM
Just did the search myself. Both dates do exist. What is the next step to find out what the actual content is?

Interestingly, the filing for the 27th is for 3 discs while the 26th just says compact disc. Could it be that what is available from the 26th is just a remnant?

[Edited on 8/10/2017 by dzobo]

 

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  posted on 8/10/2017 at 07:55 AM
That is interesting and I will always hold out hope...BUT it is possible they did the copyright just in case they did find the tapes. In 2005 when they filed they could have been simply trying to protect their rights on the hope that there was a recording.

 

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  posted on 8/10/2017 at 04:10 PM
I have talked to people who were at one time a major part of the Allman brothers band and they said how the last night at the Fillmore the show that was not open to the public, was not recorded either in house as a soundboard reel to reel via the staff of the Fillmore East, by the Allman brothers band crew themselves, or by anyone in the audience.

 

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Peach Bud



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  posted on 8/10/2017 at 07:31 PM
So I'm not 100% on this because it's not my area of practice, but I don't think you can apply for a copyright without having something of substance to support it. Could be wrong, but I don't think you can just blanket apply for something like that. Your point makes sense though on its face.

And obviously the 6/27 exists so what do you mean when you say people didn't think it was ever recorded? Gives me some hope, about 6/26 I suppose.

I'm not sure what the next steps for this would be. I find it hard to believe that some sound from that existed as recent as 2005 and it's never come up at all in any discussion with people from the band or who were around at the time..On the other hand, I really do think it's out here somewhere.

 

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  posted on 8/10/2017 at 10:21 PM
I see that hope springs eternal, but if this recording hasn't surfaced by now, it probably never will.

A) These tapes, if they even exist, are old enough to start decomposing. If they are still sitting in somebody's closet, they are probably not usable anymore.

B) The Allman Brothers broke up 3 years ago. Butch and Gregg have passed away. The market for ABB music is dwindling fast. If anybody is still holding on to this recording, what in the Wide World Of Sports could they possibly be waiting for?

The idea that the show just wasn't recorded is the most likely answer. The ABB played plenty of shows back then that were not recorded.

That said, I still have no reason to doubt that this was an extraordinary show and the original band's finest moment.

 
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Extreme Peach



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  posted on 8/11/2017 at 11:31 AM
I wasn't around back then.
But what if it's mislabeled?
Maybe some of it added on to an existing date with no markings?
The chase must go on for the "grail".

" Midnight on a carousel ride
Reaching for the gold ring down inside

Never could reach
It just slips away but I try"
Robert Hunter

 

Zen Peach



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  posted on 8/12/2017 at 07:39 PM
quote:
I see that hope springs eternal, but if this recording hasn't surfaced by now, it probably never will.

Probably so. But I assumed all the Duane stuff that could be found was found in the late '90s or early 2000s, but a couple of shows have turned up in the last year and it sounds like there are others. So that's reason to think it's not impossible.
quote:
A) These tapes, if they even exist, are old enough to start decomposing. If they are still sitting in somebody's closet, they are probably not usable anymore.

You don't register a copyright for that, though. Or at least Bill Graham's archives wouldn't.
quote:
B) The Allman Brothers broke up 3 years ago. Butch and Gregg have passed away. The market for ABB music is dwindling fast. If anybody is still holding on to this recording, what in the Wide World Of Sports could they possibly be waiting for?

Also a totally fair question, but why is previously unheard Duane stuff still emerging?

quote:
But what if it's mislabeled?
Maybe some of it added on to an existing date with no markings?

Lawyers cost money, so you would probably check that before you pay a lawyer to go to the trouble of filing the paperwork.

 

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  posted on 8/15/2017 at 11:00 PM
So just to inject a little reality

A bunch of tripping hippies look at their wristwatches (LMAO) and somehow remember 50 years later that the band played OWO for 45 min. Or whatever.

I'm not buying it.

The band had a set list that didn't vary much in those days. I find it more than probable they went on late and had a nice smoke break in between bomb scares or whatever.

If this show exists someone would have booted it.

the stories of the legendary jams that lasted hours and hours are BS

The band had plenty of nights when they were hittin' it. I'm not sure, even if the show was taped, if it would be so immensely better than anything else.

the intriguing thing is the copyright page. Might just be listed because the agency booked the band on that date not knowing if there was a recording or not.

I'd put my money on Kirk.

 

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  posted on 8/16/2017 at 09:46 AM
quote:
the intriguing thing is the copyright page.

Yes, that's the new part of the conversation. Not much sense in arguing with three-year-old posts that were obviously wrong the first time.
quote:
Might just be listed because the agency booked the band on that date not knowing if there was a recording or not.

Is that typically how these sorts of listings work? Does the Graham archive have a lot of copyrights on shows that were booked and not recorded?

 

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True Peach



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  posted on 8/16/2017 at 10:24 AM
quote:
I see that hope springs eternal, but if this recording hasn't surfaced by now, it probably never will.

A) These tapes, if they even exist, are old enough to start decomposing. If they are still sitting in somebody's closet, they are probably not usable anymore.

B) The Allman Brothers broke up 3 years ago. Butch and Gregg have passed away. The market for ABB music is dwindling fast. If anybody is still holding on to this recording, what in the Wide World Of Sports could they possibly be waiting for?

The idea that the show just wasn't recorded is the most likely answer. The ABB played plenty of shows back then that were not recorded.

That said, I still have no reason to doubt that this was an extraordinary show and the original band's finest moment.


agreed, it would've seen the light of day by now
as to A, unsure -- if stored properly, ie not moved around a lot, in a place w/ the right heating/steady temp etc., in cases I've seen they hold up pretty well, perhaps the recently-unearthed 7/9 Stonybrook 4 instance
B, would've thought so too but the Skydog box set from 2013 sold very well, as Southern Blood, left to us w/love from our departed brother, almost surely will too
word also, IIRC, was for possible future release of the Fillmore West shows, but unsure about that too
I love the ABB

 

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