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Author: Subject: Ralph Don't Run

A Peach Supreme





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  posted on 2/4/2004 at 08:49 PM
If you're so inclined...

come watch Ralph Don't Run: http://www.ralphdontrun.net

 

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A Peach Supreme



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  posted on 2/4/2004 at 09:13 PM
Ralph Nader didn't cost Gore the election.
When your brother is the govoner of FL and all of the Judges used in the case are appointed by your father then you've got the election in the bag.
Not to mention the law that was passed in FL just weeks before the election that said that once convicted fellons could not vote at the polls.

 

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  posted on 2/4/2004 at 09:39 PM
Yes, we need more convicted felons voting. If Gore had won his own flippin' state of Tennessee, and Clinton's state of Arkansas, they would have won. They didn't, the end, old news.

 

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  posted on 2/4/2004 at 10:44 PM
I want Pat Buchanan to run......
 

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  posted on 2/4/2004 at 11:27 PM
Don't forget that they used the law that Newt mentioned as an excuse to excuse many black voters from voting; denying them their rights. Most found out at the polls that they were "not eligible" to vote because they had criminal records. Not one was notified ahead of time, to give them the opportunity to prove otherwise. They had no recourse because they found out at the last minute, and it proved to take days to weeks to sort it all out, well after the election was over.

In the weeks after the election they received the news that the state had mistakenly removed them from voter lists because they had similar names and social security numbers to actual felons.

It wasn't about felons voting, it was about keeping blacks (& surely Democratic votes) out of the polls, since the majority of convicts in Florida are black. It's believed that enough legimate voters were illegally denied their rights because of the "confusion", that it cost Gore the election. Guess who decided "not to take any chances" and had all similar names and SS#'s removed from the rolls... even after she was warned that legitimate voters would be removed... That's right, 'ol Jeb's secretary of state, who was also GW's Florida State campaign manager. It was a blatantly illegal act and she got away with it. All people cared about was that felons didn't vote. It's a small price to pay for some to be denied their Constitutional rights, to keep the "felons" out. I mean it was an insignificant number of voters- barely enough to swing the Presidential Election.

Fortunately, for the Bushies, most of those who were illegally removed from voting lists were black, so it's all good. They don't want to take literacy tests before getting into the voting booth, other ways will be found to keep 'em out.

This was just one issue on a laundry list of illegal acts and conflicts of interest that affected the election.

So, folks can blame Ralph all they want, but until they get their heads out of their arses and take a look at the facts, they will continue to be duped by those who will deceive them. Ignorance is a great weapon to those who can get others to wield it for them.

 

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  posted on 2/5/2004 at 12:17 AM
it would me nice if a politician's mouth wouldn't run

 

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  posted on 2/5/2004 at 07:59 AM
Peachnutt wrote:
"I want Pat Buchanan to run......"

Does that mean politically, or, south of the border?

Cheers

Carlos "the more the merrier" Rivera

 

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  posted on 2/5/2004 at 10:23 AM
quote:
Don't forget that they used the law that Newt mentioned as an excuse to excuse many black voters from voting; denying them their rights. Most found out at the polls that they were "not eligible" to vote because they had criminal records. Not one was notified ahead of time, to give them the opportunity to prove otherwise. They had no recourse because they found out at the last minute, and it proved to take days to weeks to sort it all out, well after the election was over.


With all due respect, Florida is one of several states that denies convicted felons the right to vote. They may get it back, but must first go through a process:
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/news/state/3691542.htm

Voting is a right. And with rights come responsibilities. It is not the State of Florida's obligation or responsibility to alert voters when their status is in flux. It is up to the individual to insure that he or she is in good standing as far as registration and status are concerned. It is this same responsibility that dictatates voters should pay attention when actually casting their vote and thus avoid the now-infamous maladies such as the hanging chad. Elections are a vital part of democracy and thus imply a high level of seriousness. So be serious and stop acting as if the State is your mommy.

Portraying the last election as a repeat of Selma 1965 is both specious and irresponsible. It also dishonors all those who actually had to brave violence and death to solidify their right to vote in the South in the 50s and 60s. All the people in 2000 had to brave was their own laziness and irresponsible attitude to something which should be taken a lot more seriously in this country.

 

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  posted on 2/5/2004 at 10:44 AM
well, I don't think Nadar cost Gore the election. Gore did that himself. Little help from our Supreme Court.

I did vote for Nadar last time, but not this time. I agree Nadar cost Gore some votes, so I will refrain and do my best to get this loser out of our house.

Thanks for reminding me, I did get an e mail from Nadar's exploritory campaign. Have to answer the survey.

 

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  posted on 2/5/2004 at 11:46 AM
First of all, in the two counties where the most discrepancies happened the elction process was run by Democrats. Second, when you have folks that can't figure out a ballot that a group of 12 year olds in school figured out 100% then that is the way it is.

Meanhwile, shoutout to Al Gore, Bill Bradley, Carol Mosely Braun, for making such a difference with their endorsement of Howard Dean. Now Dean is asking for more money from the "grassroots" claiming that he has to win Wisconsin to stay in the race. 40 million down the tubes to completely screw an election up. Give, folks, give again like you've never given before.

Also, it is good to see a "populist" like John Kerry running, a true man of the people;

quote:
February 5, 2004 -- BOSTON

ONE of the surest ways to get the phones ringing on any Massachusetts talk-radio show is to ask people to call in and tell their John Kerry stories. The phone lines are soon filled, and most of the stories have a common theme: our junior senator pulling rank on one of his constituents, breaking in line, demanding to pay less (or nothing) or ducking out before the bill arrives.

The tales often have one other common thread. Most end with Sen. Kerry inquiring of the lesser mortal: "Do you know who I am?"

And now he's running for president as a populist. His first wife came from a Philadelphia Main Line family worth $300 million. His second wife is a pickle-and-ketchup heiress.

Kerry lives in a mansion on Beacon Hill on which he has borrowed $6 million to finance his campaign. A fire hydrant that prevented him and his wife from parking their SUV in front of their tony digs was removed by the city of Boston at his behest.

The Kerrys ski at a spa the widow Heinz owns in Aspen, and they summer on Nantucket in a sprawling seaside "cottage" on Hurlbert Avenue, which is so well-appointed that at a recent fund-raiser, they imported porta-toilets onto the front lawn so the donors wouldn't use the inside bathrooms. (They later claimed the decision was made on septic, not social, considerations).

It's a wonderful life these days for John Kerry. He sails Nantucket Sound in "the Scaramouche," a 42-foot Hinckley powerboat. Martha Stewart has a similar boat; the no-frills model reportedly starts at $695,000. Sen. Kerry bought it new, for cash.



Every Tuesday night, the local politicians here that Kerry elbowed out of his way on his march to the top watch, fascinated, as he claims victory in more primaries and denounces the special interests, the "millionaires" and "the overprivileged."

"His initials are JFK," longtime state Senate President William M. Bulger used to muse on St. Patrick's Day, "Just for Kerry. He's only Irish every sixth year." And now it turns out that he's not Irish at all.

But in the parochial world of Bay State politics, he was never really seen as Irish, even when he was claiming to be (although now, of course, he says that any references to his alleged Hibernian heritage were mistakenly put into the Congressional Record by an aide who apparently didn't know that on his paternal side he is, in fact, part-Jewish).

Kerry is, in fact, a Brahmin - his mother was a Forbes, from one of Massachusetts' oldest WASP families. The ancestor who wed Ralph Waldo Emerson's daughter was marrying down.

At the risk of engaging in ethnic stereotyping, Yankees have a reputation for, shall we say, frugality. And Kerry tosses around quarters like they were manhole covers. In 1993, for instance, living on a senator's salary of about $100,000, he managed to give a total of $135 to charity.

Yet that same year, he was somehow able to scrape together $8,600 for a brand-new, imported Italian motorcycle, a Ducati Paso 907 IE. He kept it for years, until he decided to run for president, at which time he traded it in for a Harley-Davidson like the one he rode onto "The Tonight Show" set a couple of months ago as Jay Leno applauded his fellow Bay Stater.

Of course, in 1993 he was between his first and second heiresses - a time he now calls "the wandering years," although an equally apt description might be "the freeloading years."

For some of the time, he was, for all practical purposes, homeless. His friends allowed him into a real-estate deal in which he flipped a condo for quick resale, netting a $21,000 profit on a cash investment of exactly nothing. For months he rode around in a new car supplied by a shady local Buick dealer. When the dealer's ties to a congressman who was later indicted for racketeering were exposed, Kerry quickly explained that the non-payment was a mere oversight, and wrote out a check.

 

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  posted on 2/5/2004 at 12:46 PM
http://www.opensecrets.org/2000elect/other/bush/pioneers.asp

mmmm! going get me one of those $2,000 plate dinners to hear George W. spew out lies!

 

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  posted on 2/5/2004 at 01:42 PM
KnownRider, with all due respect, it's the responsibility of the Government to protect the rights of citizens. It is not the government's job to screw hundreds, perhaps thousands of people out of them. That is what happened in FL. I receive a letter from the state of MA (got one in CO when I was out there, too) that lets me know that I am a registered voter in good standing, I think once a year, so as far as making sure I am up to snuff, what more should I need to do? Call City Hall every day before the election to make sure I'm good to go? That list was compiled in the very weeks prior to the election, it wasn't something that was posted for months before the election. If you're not a convict, why should you have to make sure you NOT on the list? These people were LEGITIMATE voters, I'm not talking about the actual convicts.
The point was that, yes sure they can clear their good names, but it's too late to vote. The polls closed. They, by law, cannot reopen to allow those who were screwed the opportunity to cast. To make matters worse, the list was compiled so close to the election that if someone had found out they were on it, it still would have taken too long to iron out the affair, with the research and documentation requirements.
Voting is a right that is protected by the Constitution, no if, ands or buts. As far as convicts go, that is not the issue I am addressing. Because of their criminal records they have limited rights. But to say it's someone's own fault that they were illegally removed from voting lists is absurd.
That fact that it was caused by someone who had a direct interest in the outcome of the election is criminal.

Perhaps you will be fortunate enough some day to have your rights blatantly violated for no reason- and have the general public decide that it was your own fault. If that day ever comes, I will gladly remind you of your own argument, when you dare to complain.

 

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  posted on 2/5/2004 at 02:03 PM
hmmmmmmm, I wonder if today the Democratic party repudiates the election of 1960.....I guess the dead can get on polls in Cook County

Cheers

Carlos "is one better or worse than the other?" Rivera

 

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  posted on 2/5/2004 at 02:26 PM
it's the responsibility of the Government to protect the rights of citizens It is not the government's job to screw hundreds, perhaps thousands of people out of them.

There is no evidence that any such thing happened. Only endless conjecture by those who are too bitter to admit that their candidate lost. These instances are usually called urban myths and sometimes conspiracy theories.

I receive a letter from the state of MA (got one in CO when I was out there, too) that lets me know that I am a registered voter in good standing, I think once a year, so as far as making sure I am up to snuff, what more should I need to do? Call City Hall every day before the election to make sure I'm good to go?

Yes, you should do exactly that. I am registered in NY but now live in DC. I acted too late to get my status switched to down here. Nobody reminded me. How could they? It was my own fault due to my own inaction and procrastination. Should government do everything for us? The same people who cannot provide me with drinkable water, revere a crackhead ex-mayor, and cannot even figure out how to properly register cars (something all 50 states seem to have a handle on) are going to hold my hand through the voter registration process? You cannot be serious.

Perhaps you will be fortunate enough some day to have your rights blatantly violated for no reason- and have the general public decide that it was your own fault. If that day ever comes, I will gladly remind you of your own argument, when you dare to complain.

My rights are violated, by the loony left who insist that I cannot register to vote or breath without the Nanny State holding my hand and guided me through the entire, simple process and go on to destroy the very notion of personal responsibility as well as rugged individualism.






[Edited on 2/5/2004 by KnownRider]

 

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  posted on 2/5/2004 at 04:12 PM
Rider,

You just admitted that you weren't allowed to vote because of your own omission. You failed to re-register yourself in the correct location.

Finklewicz is talking about people who were denied a vote when they should, legally, have been allowed to. They made no acts or omissions that would have prevented them from voting. You had an affirmative responsibility to ensure that you're voting status was correct. These people did not.

 

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  posted on 2/5/2004 at 06:37 PM
Wow, Kerry's a rich politician? I had no idea... what an anomaly. But he'd still have had my vote if he was Irish.

 

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  posted on 2/6/2004 at 08:52 AM
You had an affirmative responsibility to ensure that you're voting status was correct.

Yes. I believe I was acknowledging my own mistake in order to make a point.

These people did not.

Quite untrue. Please read the link I included. Convicted felons lose their right to vote and must jump through hoops to get it back. Dems the rules. The facts are quite clear and utilizing infinite denial is not going to change that.

 

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  posted on 2/6/2004 at 09:09 AM
I think we're getting a little sidetracked here. Whether convicted felons should be allowed to vote or not, it seems a number of other people were denied the ability to vote because their names resembled those of convicted felons (the justification, I guess, being that the names could be aliases). This was a method that was known to be error-prone.

Perhaps you can say those people should have checked their voting status, but why would they do so when they have no reason to suspect their status would be changed? I'm not sure what they would have been able to do about it anyway.

 

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  posted on 2/6/2004 at 09:42 AM
Perhaps you can say those people should have checked their voting status, but why would they do so when they have no reason to suspect their status would be changed?

Well firstly, did this even happen? I have heard endless tall tales about roadblocks, confused names, and everything else under the sun. Jesse Jackson mobilized, went down there and, surprise surprise, found nothing. Nothing.

Guess what? If some people were clearly denied the right to vote through no fault of their own, they have endless legal recourse to punish those responsible. The ACLU would have been up in arms. The DOJ would have arrested people. It is a pretty damn serious charge that anyone is prohibited from voting and it does not just fade away to exist only on this talk site.

And whose to say that a bunch of people intending to vote Republican did not allow their voting status to go lax?

 

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  posted on 2/6/2004 at 09:46 AM
quote:
Guess what? If some people were clearly denied the right to vote through no fault of their own, they have endless legal recourse to punish those responsible.

What they don't get, however, is their vote back. They were prevented from voting in 2000.

quote:
It is a pretty damn serious charge that anyone is prohibited from voting and it does not just fade away to exist only on this talk site.

I'm rather surprised if this is the first you've heard of it.

quote:
And whose to say that a bunch of people intending to vote Republican did not allow their voting status to go lax?

Anything's possible. But the voters who got screwed by this maneuver were mostly black, and Gore got upwards of 90% of the black vote in Florida.

 

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  posted on 2/6/2004 at 09:57 AM
I'm rather surprised if this is the first you've heard of it.

It is not the first I have heard of it. It was nonsense then and it is nonsense now. If anything happened, it was people who allowed their voting status to lapse. That is their fault. End of story.

The vast majority of eligible American voters do not vote. The percentage is even greater for black Americans. It is time everybody got off their tails and took elections seriously. The first step in that process is to stay on top of things and insure that your voting status is in good standing so you do not make yourself a victim of the bureacracy. It would also be a good idea if some would treat blacks like adults and cease being patronizing to them.

 

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  posted on 2/6/2004 at 10:10 AM
quote:
The vast majority of eligible American voters do not vote. The percentage is even greater for black Americans. It is time everybody got off their tails and took elections seriously.

Yup.

quote:
It would also be a good idea if some would treat blacks like adults and cease being patronizing to them.

I beg your pardon?

 

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  posted on 2/6/2004 at 10:13 AM
I beg your pardon?

Are you in need of some elucidation?

 

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  posted on 2/6/2004 at 10:14 AM
Yes, I'm in need of elucidation as to what you're talking about vis a vis patronizing black Americans.

 

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  posted on 2/6/2004 at 10:25 AM
I suppose I am saying that as a person who truly believes that blacks are my equal in every respect of the word (intellect, ability, motivations, dreams, desires, hopes, fears, potential, etc, etc, etc), I am quite confident that they are more than capable of picking up that telephone, dialing the appropriate number, checking their voting status, and taking any necessary action to correct any problems or inconsistencies with plenty of time left before the next election.
 
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