Thread: thoughts on the new Marcus King record?

berkhath - 10/11/2018 at 07:13 PM

1. I'm really enjoying it - it's a bit easier on the ears than his prior stuff

2. several of the songs themselves, and Marcus' guitar tone, sound an awfully lot like the TTB and DT.


leafsfan - 10/12/2018 at 04:57 PM

I need to listen some more the first album grabbed my by the juju right away. This one not so much. I miss the rough guitar edge but maybe I just haven't found it yet.


DeadMallard - 10/12/2018 at 05:00 PM

quote:
1. I'm really enjoying it - it's a bit easier on the ears than his prior stuff

2. several of the songs themselves, and Marcus' guitar tone, sound an awfully lot like the TTB and DT.




Thanks I wasn't aware he had one out. Going to check it out.


jparadise - 10/12/2018 at 06:36 PM

I like it a lot. I know he was using Tele's more in the studio on this one. It's got a good "feel" to it. Dave Cobb is a master.


74Jer - 10/12/2018 at 10:51 PM

Boring, unoriginal, derivative. He sounds like a Warren wannabe.


cmgst34 - 10/14/2018 at 03:17 AM

quote:
1. I'm really enjoying it - it's a bit easier on the ears than his prior stuff

2. several of the songs themselves, and Marcus' guitar tone, sound an awfully lot like the TTB and DT.




And when he doesn’t sound like DT he sounds like Warren.

He’s definitely good but he definitely needs to get comfortable on his own skin

But, if I gave up on a young Kenny Wayne Shepherd for being derivative, I would’ve missed seeing a fantastic guitar player growing into what he is today. So, l stick around.

But yeah, he needs his own style.


fender31 - 10/14/2018 at 11:37 AM

quote:
Boring, unoriginal, derivative. He sounds like a Warren wannabe.


x2


AlPaul - 10/14/2018 at 02:59 PM

I think he sounds a lot lik ehmself, especially in his singing and songwriting, which is very personal and very strong.


DanB - 10/14/2018 at 03:14 PM

quote:
I think he sounds a lot lik ehmself, especially in his singing and songwriting, which is very personal and very strong.


exactly

I don't think anyone sounds like Marcus vocally especially for his age. I do hear influences of Derek and Warren but it isn't like he's copying their chops. The MKB is another branch of the ABB that music needs right now.


DeadMallard - 10/14/2018 at 06:19 PM

I just listened to it.

He's GREAT!


aiq - 10/15/2018 at 03:13 PM

Like it. Heard him with Lesh in Mobile, great.


The_Newt - 10/15/2018 at 05:22 PM

quote:
Boring, unoriginal, derivative. He sounds like a Warren wannabe.

I agree. I also can't stand his voice he makes JB of WSP actually sound like a great singer.


jparadise - 10/15/2018 at 06:36 PM

quote:
I think he sounds a lot lik ehmself, especially in his singing and songwriting, which is very personal and very strong.


+1


[Edited on 10/15/2018 by jparadise]


Sang - 10/15/2018 at 07:31 PM

Just got it yesterday - listened twice today and I like it.


stormyrider - 10/16/2018 at 09:16 PM

Heard live versions of many of the tunes and liked them. New disc is on the way.
I like him and the band
I agree with those that say he has his own sound
He borrows from others, including Derek and Warren, but who doesn't?

Looking forward to seeing him again in November


scotiadave - 10/17/2018 at 07:19 AM



He is a monster guitar player.

The new record is good, “Goodbye Carolina” got stuck in my head so badly that I had to stop listening to it for a bit.


Shavian - 10/18/2018 at 09:03 PM

I've listened to it a couple of times. The playing and arrangements are excellent but the writing to me is the weak point.

Almost everybody these days has to write their own material, it seems, and some just aren't that great writers. It used to be that an album might contain a couple of fillers - weak songs to make up the time. The ratio these days seems much higher.

Maybe all the great ideas, lyrics, riffs, hooks etc have been used over and over to the point that very little sounds fresh and inventive.

Even Warren Haynes, for all the great songs he has written, has penned an awful lot of average material to my ears.

I still love the MKB live where jams and covers augment their own songs.


sixty8 - 10/18/2018 at 10:52 PM

Every musician borrows from their influences and Marcus IMO has a lot more influences than just Haynes and Trucks. He has plenty of his own sound in their and I love his male version of Janis Joplin vocals. Love the new record as well as their first two and look forward to their further progression. Live is by far the best way to experience this band though.


jparadise - 10/19/2018 at 01:43 PM

quote:
Maybe all the great ideas, lyrics, riffs, hooks etc have been used over and over to the point that very little sounds fresh and inventive.

Even Warren Haynes, for all the great songs he has written, has penned an awful lot of average material to my ears.


This is an interesting take on it. Honestly, there's only 12 notes....style/voice/feel....all of it, if you're trying to develop your own sound or sometimes, you just sound like you, has to do with your interpretation of those 12 notes. People have been doing it throughout all of history. So there's always fresh to be found, it's just a matter of the creative aspect. And it's HARD, don't get me wrong, but it's there.

In terms of songwriting and songwriters, I can only speak for myself, but we all right average material. I used to sit and wait on inspiration, but since I moved to Nashville to dive into writing more, I've learned the trick is to write when you're uninspired. You have to exercise it just like any other muscle....it's definitely a craft. We all write stuff that winds up in the trash bin, but we're writing. If you have that skill, and are willing to learn the craft behind it, you're going to write sh*t songs....but at that point it's almost a numbers game. It's really kinda hard to explain, hopefully that helped a little?


sully - 10/19/2018 at 02:00 PM

i wish i could be good enough to be a DT and WH wannabe!


DeadMallard - 10/19/2018 at 05:03 PM

quote:
quote:
Maybe all the great ideas, lyrics, riffs, hooks etc have been used over and over to the point that very little sounds fresh and inventive.

Even Warren Haynes, for all the great songs he has written, has penned an awful lot of average material to my ears.


This is an interesting take on it. Honestly, there's only 12 notes....style/voice/feel....all of it, if you're trying to develop your own sound or sometimes, you just sound like you, has to do with your interpretation of those 12 notes. People have been doing it throughout all of history. So there's always fresh to be found, it's just a matter of the creative aspect. And it's HARD, don't get me wrong, but it's there.

In terms of songwriting and songwriters, I can only speak for myself, but we all right average material. I used to sit and wait on inspiration, but since I moved to Nashville to dive into writing more, I've learned the trick is to write when you're uninspired. You have to exercise it just like any other muscle....it's definitely a craft. We all write stuff that winds up in the trash bin, but we're writing. If you have that skill, and are willing to learn the craft behind it, you're going to write sh*t songs....but at that point it's almost a numbers game. It's really kinda hard to explain, hopefully that helped a little?


Great information.

I read an interview of Derek several years back that compared slide to electric guitar in terms of undiscovered sound. His opinion that since the slide guitar was not nearly as popular as electric it was "relatively easier" to create new sounds. (I may be using "sounds improperly but am not a musician)


A question:

Hasn't it become almost impossible to make a living as a songwriter with the advent of digital music?

Sorry if I'm hijacking the intent of the thread. As I noted above I really like the new album by Marcus.


MartinD28 - 10/19/2018 at 05:24 PM

quote:
quote:
Maybe all the great ideas, lyrics, riffs, hooks etc have been used over and over to the point that very little sounds fresh and inventive.

Even Warren Haynes, for all the great songs he has written, has penned an awful lot of average material to my ears.


This is an interesting take on it. Honestly, there's only 12 notes....style/voice/feel....all of it, if you're trying to develop your own sound or sometimes, you just sound like you, has to do with your interpretation of those 12 notes. People have been doing it throughout all of history. So there's always fresh to be found, it's just a matter of the creative aspect. And it's HARD, don't get me wrong, but it's there.

In terms of songwriting and songwriters, I can only speak for myself, but we all right average material. I used to sit and wait on inspiration, but since I moved to Nashville to dive into writing more, I've learned the trick is to write when you're uninspired. You have to exercise it just like any other muscle....it's definitely a craft. We all write stuff that winds up in the trash bin, but we're writing. If you have that skill, and are willing to learn the craft behind it, you're going to write sh*t songs....but at that point it's almost a numbers game. It's really kinda hard to explain, hopefully that helped a little?


Agree with this post.

Check your PM.


jparadise - 10/19/2018 at 06:27 PM

quote:
A question:

Hasn't it become almost impossible to make a living as a songwriter with the advent of digital music?


Yes, and no. Some aspects have become easier (demoing your music is now doable at your own home and with, generally speaking....depending on your own knack for production/engineering, very good quality.

The only aspect that is harder is getting radio or album cuts. But that's always been tough, and you gotta have the goods. There's tricks to it, but yes it's hard. So really, the hard part is still hard. Haha.

[Edited on 10/19/2018 by jparadise]


Shavian - 10/20/2018 at 09:22 AM

quote:
And it's HARD, don't get me wrong, but it's there.


Thanks for the response.

Maybe I didn't express myself very well. I know that song writing is a difficult art, that there are only so many notes and keys to deploy. If it was easy we - including me - would all be knocking out half a dozen classics before lunch!

My point was that every band and artist these days seems to rely on self-written material and in a lot of, if not most, cases it's not really strong enough. Not everyone can be a Lennon and McCartney, Carole King, Paul Simon, Pete Townsend, Jimmy Webb or Burt Bacharach.

Would it not benefit these artists to perform more songs written by specialist songwriters or to cover classics?

I'm thinking of the days when people such as Bernie Taupin (Elton John), Pete Sinfield (King Crimson), Keith Reid (Procol Harum), Robert Hunter (Dead), Clive James (Pete Atkin) etc worked with artists in a purely song writing capacity.

One of my favourite albums is Diamonds and Rust by Joan Baez. Aside from the brilliant title track and three others which Baez wrote the rest are covers, mostly very successful: Blue Sky, Fountain Of Sorrow by Jackson Browne, Dylan's Simple Twist Of Fate, John Prine's Hello In There, Jesse by Janis Ian and so on. And it all makes for a very satisfying album.

A lot of GA's later work was mainly covers too.

Now there might well be an issue with paying royalties but am I more likely to buy a great album containing arrangements of other writers' songs, or an indifferent effort which is totally comprised of the artists' own weak material? The ideal is a great album of the artists' own strong material but I'm finding that rare these days.

I don't think there's much doubt that the number of great new songs being written these days is much reduced from previous decades, which suggests that song writing is a dying art or, as I originally said, it has all been said before.

Even the great writers seem to dry up eventually.



[Edited on 10/20/2018 by Shavian]


cyclone88 - 10/20/2018 at 01:52 PM

quote:
Honestly, there's only 12 notes....style/voice/feel....all of it, if you're trying to develop your own sound or sometimes, you just sound like you, has to do with your interpretation of those 12 notes. People have been doing it throughout all of history. So there's always fresh to be found, it's just a matter of the creative aspect. And it's HARD, don't get me wrong, but it's there.


"Music is essentially 12 notes between any octave. Twelve notes, and the octave repeats. It's the same story, told over and over, forever. All any artist can offer the world is how they see those 12 notes. That's it. He loved how you see them." -- "12 Notes" from A Star is Born (movie & soundtrack)


[Edited on 10/20/2018 by cyclone88]


cyclone88 - 10/20/2018 at 02:39 PM

quote:

Would it not benefit these artists to perform more songs written by specialist songwriters or to cover classics?



The money is in songwriting. A song is owned by the writer who gets royalties every time it's covered/recorded/licensed to someone else. With the extension of the length of copyright (life plus decades), songs are valuable assets. A singer gets paid for a performance, period.


The_Newt - 10/20/2018 at 08:52 PM

quote:
quote:
quote:
Maybe all the great ideas, lyrics, riffs, hooks etc have been used over and over to the point that very little sounds fresh and inventive.

Even Warren Haynes, for all the great songs he has written, has penned an awful lot of average material to my ears.


This is an interesting take on it. Honestly, there's only 12 notes....style/voice/feel....all of it, if you're trying to develop your own sound or sometimes, you just sound like you, has to do with your interpretation of those 12 notes. People have been doing it throughout all of history. So there's always fresh to be found, it's just a matter of the creative aspect. And it's HARD, don't get me wrong, but it's there.

In terms of songwriting and songwriters, I can only speak for myself, but we all right average material. I used to sit and wait on inspiration, but since I moved to Nashville to dive into writing more, I've learned the trick is to write when you're uninspired. You have to exercise it just like any other muscle....it's definitely a craft. We all write stuff that winds up in the trash bin, but we're writing. If you have that skill, and are willing to learn the craft behind it, you're going to write sh*t songs....but at that point it's almost a numbers game. It's really kinda hard to explain, hopefully that helped a little?


Great information.

I read an interview of Derek several years back that compared slide to electric guitar in terms of undiscovered sound. His opinion that since the slide guitar was not nearly as popular as electric it was "relatively easier" to create new sounds. (I may be using "sounds improperly but am not a musician)


A question:

Hasn't it become almost impossible to make a living as a songwriter with the advent of digital music?

Sorry if I'm hijacking the intent of the thread. As I noted above I really like the new album by Marcus.

Yes it basically as both as a songwriter, and as a professional musician, but the songwriter does get royalty from writing the song if it's performed. It has been this way for a long time though, in the very early 2000s a good friend of mine who I went to lots of Allmans shows with through the decades, completely stopped studying Jazz/music at a local university and studied something a lot more versatile and lucrative.

I also knew musicians and songwriters who in the very early 1980s did the same thing. They play music as a hobby and write songs for fun but they've never made any money from either.

[Edited on 10/20/2018 by The_Newt]


Titanosaur22 - 10/21/2018 at 01:21 AM

We have true talent in Marcus King and his band. I love it. I've had the pleasure of seeing him at the saint In Asbury before he blew up. Man we sure are lucky.


DeadMallard - 10/21/2018 at 06:06 PM

Great thread & both topics (Marcus) & (songwriting) are fun reads


Lee - 10/22/2018 at 12:02 PM

For those in the know, this has always puzzled me. So a songwriter/artist receives payment when someone plays their song? What about bars and festivals? People cover songs all the time.


Shavian - 10/22/2018 at 03:55 PM

I can't speak for the US but in the UK there is an organisation called the Performing Rights Society (PRS).

Artists pay the PRS a membership fee in return for which the PRS collects all royalties due to the artist for performances of their work whether it be broadcast on TV or radio, use in film or theatre, by DJs, live performance, online, at sporting events etc.

The PRS uses reports from licence holders and tracking services to know when works are played, performed or reproduced.

Royalties paid for live performance of a work are small - in a small venue, £10 per event which is divided between all PRS members whose works are performed.

At larger venues and festivals, royalties are calculated as a percentage, minimum 4%, of gross box office takings. Royalties due are divided between members based on the number of seconds a performance lasts.


BIGV - 10/22/2018 at 04:11 PM

Music Modernization Act


DOVETAIL - 10/22/2018 at 05:32 PM

quote:
Boring, unoriginal, derivative. He sounds like a Warren wannabe.

Never got into, then out of, an artist so fast...I question whether he's conscious of his influences and similarities to them or not, but high-powered HardHead mgmt clearly doesn'tz care about that!?!?!


jparadise - 10/22/2018 at 05:45 PM

quote:
For those in the know, this has always puzzled me. So a songwriter/artist receives payment when someone plays their song? What about bars and festivals? People cover songs all the time.


From the writer's perspective, they have performance rights organizations (ASCAP/BMI/SESAC) that are responsible for chasing down the mechanical royalties from movie/film placement, radio play, etc. etc. Those same organizations charge live music venues flat fees so they can have essentially anything performed in their club.....basically to cover their asses for people covering copywritten and published music.

There's more to it than just that, but that's the meat and potatoes of it.


Lee - 10/22/2018 at 05:52 PM

quote:
quote:
For those in the know, this has always puzzled me. So a songwriter/artist receives payment when someone plays their song? What about bars and festivals? People cover songs all the time.


From the writer's perspective, they have performance rights organizations (ASCAP/BMI/SESAC) that are responsible for chasing down the mechanical royalties from movie/film placement, radio play, etc. etc. Those same organizations charge live music venues flat fees so they can have essentially anything performed in their club.....basically to cover their asses for people covering copywritten and published music.

There's more to it than just that, but that's the meat and potatoes of it.



That explains it I think. So nobody has to count how many times a song is played by someone, correct?


BIGV - 10/22/2018 at 06:37 PM

" thoughts on the new Marcus King record? "

Man, I want to like this kid...

Maybe that will happen further down the road when he develops more of an original sound & identity.


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