Thread: Who decides what ABB music will be relased?

fender31 - 8/5/2018 at 01:31 PM

I was wondering who's decision it is to release live/Studio music from the band.


robslob - 8/5/2018 at 02:01 PM

Me and me only.


DeadMallard - 8/5/2018 at 02:54 PM

quote:
I was wondering who's decision it is to release live/Studio music from the band.


Great question. I would imagine the 2 living partners and whoever, Gregg & Butch appointed as their representatives but that is just a wild guess. I don't believe Duane or Berry's ownership survived their passing because of the manner in which the original band was formed.



DeadMallard - 8/5/2018 at 02:55 PM

quote:
quote:
I was wondering who's decision it is to release live/Studio music from the band.


Great question. I would imagine the 2 living partners and whoever, Gregg & Butch appointed as their representatives but that is just a wild guess. I don't believe Duane or Berry's ownership survived their passing because of the manner in which the original band was formed.

Like I said above this is just my speculation.




griff - 8/5/2018 at 03:51 PM

I am recalcitrant when this subject get brought up.
It should be noted that I don't know the meaning of the word "recalcitrant".
But I like the way it sounds.


PhotoRon286 - 8/6/2018 at 01:52 AM

quote:
I am recalcitrant when this subject get brought up.
It should be noted that I don't know the meaning of the word "recalcitrant".
But I like the way it sounds.



HAHAHAHAHAHAAA!!!!


quote:
re·cal·ci·trant
rəˈkalsətrənt/Submit
adjective
1.
having an obstinately uncooperative attitude toward authority or discipline.
"a class of recalcitrant fifteen-year-olds"
synonyms: uncooperative, intractable, obstreperous, truculent, insubordinate, defiant, rebellious, willful, wayward, headstrong, self-willed, contrary, perverse, difficult; More
noun
1.
a person with an obstinately uncooperative attitude.




PhotoRon286 - 8/6/2018 at 01:53 AM

quote:
I am recalcitrant when this subject get brought up.
It should be noted that I don't know the meaning of the word "recalcitrant".
But I like the way it sounds.



I'd say you are more "indifferent" about it, but that's just my .02.


hotlantatim - 8/6/2018 at 02:28 PM

I can't imagine Dickey was promoting the idea of the release of the Cream of the Crop 2003 release, but I guess as long as a majority of the partners want it released it happens. So in that scenario, i would think it may have been Jaimoe + Butch's estate rep + Gregg's estate rep with Dickey either an abstention or no vote.


Stephen - 8/6/2018 at 03:05 PM

Would Dickey have had a say re: ABB releases after he was voted out in 2000, is what I would question
All these releases, specifically Play All Night 1992, and the current Cream of the Crop from 2003, find the band in top top form from both eras -- that's the best thing -- parts of the Evening With releases are just as good too

not to mention all the A+ sounding DAT concert recordings from the 1990s -- & the next decade's Instant Lives -- practically everything good this band ever did onstage is out there for us fans


hotlantatim - 8/6/2018 at 03:16 PM

I don't think we know for sure since the settlement they made in 2000/2001 timeframe is confidential. However, we do know Dickey remained a partner/officer in the band's corporation (state of FL secretary of state filings show that). I suspect everything the ABB did after after 2000 under the name Allman Brothers Band just moved forward with 3 "Yes" votes (a majority).


dzobo - 8/6/2018 at 05:12 PM

Agree with hotlantin. I believe there are still four voting parties. Earlier the 3 surviving members could be a majority and Dickey's vote would not matter, so he could even just ignore an issue and abstain. With the estates now apparently involved I think the chances for a greater amount of additional releases significantly improve. Gregg had very high standards regarding artistic quality and had vetoed several projects. I think the estates realize that their window for financial opportunity is closing, in addition to their wanting to cement the legacy of the band.


The_Newt - 8/6/2018 at 06:57 PM

quote:
Me and me only.

Well, I hope that you, or Warren, and Jaimoe decide to release soundboards of all of the early 2000s Beacon shows from the Derek/Warren era, including 3/20/03, and soundboards of all the summer shows from the late 1990s until the end. If these shows were actually recorded by the band as soundboards?


DOVETAIL - 8/7/2018 at 01:10 PM

quote:
Me and me only.

Is there an official archivist, a role played by David Lemieux with the Dead?,such as AJ DeVorkaitis?...Bill Levenson is invariably part of the preparation process once the selection's made. always a good thing given his history with ABB music and beyond.


blackey - 8/7/2018 at 01:53 PM

Who ever owns/controls the Capricorn era recordings can release that material. 1991's 1969-1979 A Decade of Hits is a good example. The band had nothing to do with that. The band was popular again so the package was released to cash in on that and it surprised everybody and sold over 2 million copies. Far more than any of the new Epic albums with Where it All Begins being the only one to go Gold and none went Platinum. But this package of tracks from the first album through Enlighten Rogues with the exception of Wipe the Windows went double platinum. Gregg and Dickey made millions off of this Butch Trucks wrote on this site and Butch said he got nothing. Butch complained about writing a drum part for Liz Reed but got no writing credit from Dickey and Duane backed Dickey and in the mid 90s Butch was still pissed about that. I imagine the release of the album and it selling over 2 million copies with Gregg and Dickey making lots of money as writers but band member getting nothing reintroduce this as something that got Butch angry. Butch complained about he and Berry getting nothing for the changes to the music on Whipping Post and getting no writing credit on From Madness Out Of The West on Reach For the Sky. If they had just put Hot 'Lana on the release, Butch would had made some money. So clearly the Allman Brothers Band had no rights and say so with recordings once owned by Capricorn.

I got the impression Play All Night was something Epic wanted to do but they invited Warren in to supervise the release.

So the band probably only controls post Epic recordings and that is one reason the band refused to record again after 1994 and Where It All Begins because they wanted a better deal with Epic and Epic wouldn't do it so the band waited out it's contract with Epic demanding one more release which became Peakin' At The Beacon which didn't sell well at all. But I'm sure Jaimoe and who else controls band business now could get 1990s live recordings released. Epic would go along with an archival release. And I would love a live package of the Dickey, Jack, Otiel lineup. The several shows I saw of that line up smoked. And U think it's a shame that line up never put out anything studio or live.


Shavian - 8/7/2018 at 03:54 PM

I don't want to move the topic too far off topic - for what it's worth, I imagine Bert Holman will have a role to play - but I have always been confused by the failure to release a studio album after HTN or more archive releases.

I say this because of the publicised financial difficulties experienced by Butch in his last few years. Would it not have made sense to release product to provide some relief?

Perversely, I recall that Butch was one of those opposed to recording a studio album as he felt the band's best work was performed on stage.

Warren and Derek seem to have been keen to record and I get the impression that Jaimoe goes with the flow.

Whatever, the window of opportunity to make any worthwhile money from archive releases seems to be closing rapidly. If there are any gems left in the vault, I hope that they will be released in a phased programme as quickly as decency allows.




hotlantatim - 8/7/2018 at 04:28 PM

There are some gems that haven't seen the light of day (video from Atlanta Pop Festival) but I'm surprised when people say little archive material has been released. Compared to the Dead? Sure. They were a different model band.

But tons has been released in the last 5-10 years: Brothers & Sisters box set; At Fillmore East box set; Play All Night; Duane box set; new rerelease of Fillmore 1970 with remastering & extra download tracks; Live from A&R studios; Atlanta Pop Festival (about 10 years ago); Cream of the Crop 2003; Nassau 1973 (about 10 years ago). That's not insignificant.


Stephen - 8/7/2018 at 05:02 PM

quote:
There are some gems that haven't seen the light of day (video from Atlanta Pop Festival) but I'm surprised when people say little archive material has been released. Compared to the Dead? Sure. They were a different model band.

But tons has been released in the last 5-10 years: Brothers & Sisters box set; At Fillmore East box set; Play All Night; Duane box set; new rerelease of Fillmore 1970 with remastering & extra download tracks; Live from A&R studios; Atlanta Pop Festival (about 10 years ago); Cream of the Crop 2003; Nassau 1973 (about 10 years ago). That's not insignificant.


X2 -- besides the Danny T/Rook era, each version of the band has been well covered w/later releases --
if anything is released in the future, hopefully it's a show, or comp of shows, from late 90s w/Jack P
also, the same from late-1980s>1990 w/Johnny Neel -- both guys brought a lot to the band in those 2-year periods

[Edited on 8/7/2018 by Stephen]


hotlantatim - 8/7/2018 at 11:37 PM

I'd love a Best of the Beacon 1998 archive release with Jack P like they did with Play All Night. Include Hideaway, High Falls, Dimples....

And the same for a 1979 release. I'd be an instant buyer of both.

Nothing would sell as much as another release with Duane....


Zambi - 8/7/2018 at 11:49 PM

I would really love to hear something from late September 2000 with Jimmy/Derek lineup. Either a best of from the last half dozen shows, or the Raleighwood show from 9/23/2000. I know there are pretty good AUD recordings of many of those shows, but with how much of a sonic improvement Cream of the Crop is compared to already very good sources from the 2003 Instant Lives.... if they could do that with the Sep 2000 shows I would be first in line in the e-store. I seriously doubt we will ever hear anything officially released from that lineup though.

Also would love to hear some Jackie P stuff with Dickey. I know the Beacon shows can be costly to release, so maybe we'll never get the March '98 or '99 shows, but there were lots of great playing in the summer of '98 too.

quote:
I say this because of the publicised financial difficulties experienced by Butch in his last few years. Would it not have made sense to release product to provide some relief?

Perversely, I recall that Butch was one of those opposed to recording a studio album as he felt the band's best work was performed on stage.


Problem was that by the mid to late 2000s, the roles of albums vs. touring flipped. Used to be bands made big money on records and toured to support (i.e., market) the record. By the time of HTN and the years that followed, it was pretty much the other way around. Bands made records to have material or an excuse to tour where they made the big bucks. With a heavy touring band like the ABB, they didn't really need the records to create the reason or need to tour.

Plus, I think most new records cost more to make than they earn back in sales, so it's often a money-losing endeavor. Last thing Butch needed.


DOVETAIL - 8/8/2018 at 06:55 PM

quote:
I don't want to move the topic too far off topic - for what it's worth, I imagine Bert Holman will have a role to play - but I have always been confused by the failure to release a studio album after HTN or more archive releases.

I say this because of the publicised financial difficulties experienced by Butch in his last few years. Would it not have made sense to release product to provide some relief?

Perversely, I recall that Butch was one of those opposed to recording a studio album as he felt the band's best work was performed on stage.

Warren and Derek seem to have been keen to record and I get the impression that Jaimoe goes with the flow.

Whatever, the window of opportunity to make any worthwhile money from archive releases seems to be closing rapidly. If there are any gems left in the vault, I hope that they will be released in a phased programme as quickly as decency allows.
Re follow-up to HTN: Warren has spoken about his and Derek's ready willingness to produce another studio work, but he also made clear it never happened because no consensus could be reached with the entire group (sounds like he was being his usual polite self in not engaging in undue fingerpointing!?).




Holt - 8/11/2018 at 01:28 AM

There's two separate entities that release the material. The Archival releases are under the "Allman Brothers Band Recording Company" and then stuff recorded from 2002 and released from 2003 and on like Hittin' The Note, the Instant Lives, and Cream of The Crop are under Peach Records which was incorporated after DB was out of the band and he's not involved in that incorporated entity or the profits from those . . . as a matter of fact if you look Peach Records up on Florida Secretary of State corporation search then Jaimoe is the only one listed currently as an officer . . . I recall before seeing both GA's and BT's names on there in the past . . . Also if you click on the .pdf then GA(probably his POA) electronically signed the most recent paperwork. DB was in NYC in December of '01 as he played with Phil Lesh at the Beacon on 12/1/01 then and the articles of incorporation or whatever for Peach Records were filed only 5 days later on 12/6/01 with Butch's name at the bottom. That leads me to believe the settlement from their mediation was made right around then. Somewhere in one of the books I think there is maybe very vague details mentioning the timeline only . . . Can't remember which book? From this article I read from late May 2017 ( https://www.billboard.com/articles/columns/rock/7809755/gregg-allman-brothe rs-manager-bert-holman-band-archives ) and after GA passed and with Bert quoted about potential future releases it makes it sound like there's a committee. I'd imagine(speculating) that includes input from the 3 partners or their representatives and then definitely Bert, Warren, & Levenson . . . And John Lynskey had input on Cream of the Crop. Bert says in the article they'd ask Jack Pearson about a recommendation for a great show from his time in the band.

quote:
I don't think we know for sure since the settlement they made in 2000/2001 timeframe is confidential. However, we do know Dickey remained a partner/officer in the band's corporation (state of FL secretary of state filings show that). I suspect everything the ABB did after after 2000 under the name Allman Brothers Band just moved forward with 3 "Yes" votes (a majority).


[Edited on 8/11/2018 by Holt]

[Edited on 8/13/2018 by Holt]


fender31 - 8/11/2018 at 11:27 AM

I would love to hear some studio stuff again.


peccles - 8/11/2018 at 11:26 PM

I wonder if any if the Moogis shows will make out on DVD or Bluray.


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